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Henry David Thoreau writes that “All men recognize the right of revolution; that is, the right to refuse allegiance to, and to resist, the government, when its tyranny or its inefficiency are great and unendurable”. This may be a fact, but what is not a fact is that all men (and women) do not recognize, or at least agree, on when it becomes a necessity to revolt or conduct revolution. Although we may have differing ideas, I believe that we have already been given an exact measurement as to what constitutes an act of revolution against the American government.
In present day America, citizens riot and protest in the streets for any number of reasons. As of the announcement that Donald Trump won the election for President of the United States in November of 2016, it would seem that any reason is also a good reason to go out and call for civil war. That being said, I believe that this is absolute nonsense. I, however, seem to be the minority opinion. In September of 2017, Katie Williams wrote an article for the website “The Hill” in which she stated, “Anti-fascist activists, or ‘antifa’, increasingly mobilized in the wake of President Trump’s election, are unapologetic about what they describe as the necessary use of violence to combat authoritarianism.” Authoritarianism is defined as the enforcement of strict obedience to authority at the expense of personal freedom. Interestingly enough, the only authority that has been asked to be obedient to is the law and I do not believe that abiding by the law is any reason to riot or revolt against the President of the United States.
In fact, the founding fathers, in their ultimate wisdom and uncanny ability to foresee the trials of this country long before they ever occur, left all of us an exact set of circumstances in which it is proper to rise up against our government. In the second paragraph of the United States’ Declaration of Independence, the founding fathers wrote,
“We hold these Truths to be self-evident, that all Men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness – That to secure these Rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just Powers from the Consent of the Governed, that whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its Foundation on such Principles, and organizing its Powers in such Form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.”
It was stated outright at the very moment that our country became a country, when the founding fathers initiated their own revolution against the tyrannical government of Great Britain, the very circumstances that they say fit to begin revolution.
The opposition may argue that we are experiencing a similar state of affairs at present but I submit that in order for a government or, in the case of the always hated President Donald Trump, an individual in government to be considered to be acting in a fashion that constitutes being defined as destructive that one must first identify the laws or article of the constitution that is being violated or disregarded. I ask that those who believe the government has reached a point in which it is time to take up arms against it to point out where violations have been purposefully perpetrated, for without being able to clearly demonstrate that one’s government has overstepped their bounds into realm of tyranny the peoples who choose to arm themselves against a lawful government are not revolutionaries but terrorists; terrorists are defined as persons who use unlawful violence in the pursuit of political aims.
I submit that, as citizens of what, in my opinion, is the greatest country to ever be, that we understand that there is a need for revolution when our government turns on us, but that time is not now. I believe that if and or when the time to take up arms is upon us that every man and woman will be able to see it. I believe that it is time that the citizens of this country recognize not only that there may be a time for revolution but that they recognize the correct set of circumstances laid out for us by our founding fathers to know when that time has come.
In present day America, citizens riot and protest in the streets for any number of reasons. As of the announcement that Donald Trump won the election for President of the United States in November of 2016, it would seem that any reason is also a good reason to go out and call for civil war. That being said, I believe that this is absolute nonsense. I, however, seem to be the minority opinion. In September of 2017, Katie Williams wrote an article for the website “The Hill” in which she stated, “Anti-fascist activists, or ‘antifa’, increasingly mobilized in the wake of President Trump’s election, are unapologetic about what they describe as the necessary use of violence to combat authoritarianism.” Authoritarianism is defined as the enforcement of strict obedience to authority at the expense of personal freedom. Interestingly enough, the only authority that has been asked to be obedient to is the law and I do not believe that abiding by the law is any reason to riot or revolt against the President of the United States.
In fact, the founding fathers, in their ultimate wisdom and uncanny ability to foresee the trials of this country long before they ever occur, left all of us an exact set of circumstances in which it is proper to rise up against our government. In the second paragraph of the United States’ Declaration of Independence, the founding fathers wrote,
“We hold these Truths to be self-evident, that all Men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness – That to secure these Rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just Powers from the Consent of the Governed, that whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its Foundation on such Principles, and organizing its Powers in such Form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.”
It was stated outright at the very moment that our country became a country, when the founding fathers initiated their own revolution against the tyrannical government of Great Britain, the very circumstances that they say fit to begin revolution.
The opposition may argue that we are experiencing a similar state of affairs at present but I submit that in order for a government or, in the case of the always hated President Donald Trump, an individual in government to be considered to be acting in a fashion that constitutes being defined as destructive that one must first identify the laws or article of the constitution that is being violated or disregarded. I ask that those who believe the government has reached a point in which it is time to take up arms against it to point out where violations have been purposefully perpetrated, for without being able to clearly demonstrate that one’s government has overstepped their bounds into realm of tyranny the peoples who choose to arm themselves against a lawful government are not revolutionaries but terrorists; terrorists are defined as persons who use unlawful violence in the pursuit of political aims.
I submit that, as citizens of what, in my opinion, is the greatest country to ever be, that we understand that there is a need for revolution when our government turns on us, but that time is not now. I believe that if and or when the time to take up arms is upon us that every man and woman will be able to see it. I believe that it is time that the citizens of this country recognize not only that there may be a time for revolution but that they recognize the correct set of circumstances laid out for us by our founding fathers to know when that time has come.
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Command Post
Command Post
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 126
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the people in the U.S. are under the illusion that even with support of the majority of the us military that they have the ability to rebel against the federal government. the speed and collective coordination needed to do so is not possible in secrecy and the federal government will not hesitate to use the full force of the us arsenal on our own people to stop a rebellion with the possibility of success. not to say that our intelligence services couldn't drop the ball but its unlikely. the us government has the center for disease control and the nuclear and chemical weapons stockpiles. our people no longer grow our own food when the supply lines are cut the cities affected will be eating people within a month and i dont think any rebellion would last 2 months.
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Our current, rather large professional army is something the founders worried about. They worried about your train of thought AND some of the others who replied from the opposite side.
Luckily we still have a decent balance that sort of mirrors the ideas of the population as whole. Some thinking only one party is good for the nation, some wrestling with the fact that while party A does great job keeping the gear and training funds flowing to the military, party B seems to do bit better getting money and supplies into schools and other programs that impact that cousin who is teacher or sister who works at a college.
Our military should be (as an organization) fairly neutral while those serving retain their personal right to their views.
It is sad that so many schools no longer teach civics, so that even some officers are left with a vague understanding of how things happen that impact the home life
Luckily we still have a decent balance that sort of mirrors the ideas of the population as whole. Some thinking only one party is good for the nation, some wrestling with the fact that while party A does great job keeping the gear and training funds flowing to the military, party B seems to do bit better getting money and supplies into schools and other programs that impact that cousin who is teacher or sister who works at a college.
Our military should be (as an organization) fairly neutral while those serving retain their personal right to their views.
It is sad that so many schools no longer teach civics, so that even some officers are left with a vague understanding of how things happen that impact the home life
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What if it's done little by little to where we don't see. I just read an very interesting article written by a Venezuela citizen who laminating over the fact that years early they allow the government to disarm them so when it came time to take up arms against what is now more of Socialist dictator they could not because they voted to have their gun rights taken over. The author also talked about other rights that were taken away little by little given over to government to give out. To now from being one of the wealthiest nations in South America they are one of the poorest even though they have oil revenue flowing in. The exchanged their freedom for social hand outs.
However back to my original question will we really be have the chance to recognize when instead of government for the people and by the people it becomes the government that controls the people .
We already now have on the books a laws that allow for holding an American Citizen with out due process of the public law, to be held with out bail with charges for as long as the government sees fit. We have seen how the FISA courts have been compromised to help one party over another one ideology over another.
Let state right now I don't see the need for citizens to take up arms, however if we fail to ensure history is taught correctly and we continue to allow elected government and none elected regulatory agencies to in act laws that eat away at our civil liberties I truly feel in the near future we will wake up as this Venezuela citizens did.
However back to my original question will we really be have the chance to recognize when instead of government for the people and by the people it becomes the government that controls the people .
We already now have on the books a laws that allow for holding an American Citizen with out due process of the public law, to be held with out bail with charges for as long as the government sees fit. We have seen how the FISA courts have been compromised to help one party over another one ideology over another.
Let state right now I don't see the need for citizens to take up arms, however if we fail to ensure history is taught correctly and we continue to allow elected government and none elected regulatory agencies to in act laws that eat away at our civil liberties I truly feel in the near future we will wake up as this Venezuela citizens did.
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You aren't 'the people', you are a minority; and congress is not fielded by people who voted to oppose Trump's disgusting agenda.
If you want to back this bloated, fat idiot, you're free to. Just don't say it's about freedom. Don't say it's about justice. Don't say you're doing it for me, and don't say that you represent more than yourself. You're also free to try your own little revolt.
I, for one, can't wait to see the South die again.
If you want to back this bloated, fat idiot, you're free to. Just don't say it's about freedom. Don't say it's about justice. Don't say you're doing it for me, and don't say that you represent more than yourself. You're also free to try your own little revolt.
I, for one, can't wait to see the South die again.
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SGT Joseph Gunderson
You obviously have absolutely no clue what this piece said. It is either drugs you should be taking or drugs you shouldn't be taking; either way, I advise you fix yourself before jumping on RP and trying to rant on subjects you fail to fully understand.
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SPC Jesse Davis
It's just the usual crocodile tears hypocrisy that has sprung up in the wake of Obama, all ready to revolt and overthrow the government until it's suddenly Trump, and how it's looking for excuses to murder civilians. It's deranged.
This isn't patriotism, this isn't honorable, this is disgusting and beneath the dignity of the uniform.
This isn't patriotism, this isn't honorable, this is disgusting and beneath the dignity of the uniform.
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When socialism infiltrates Congress. Oh wait, that just happened. To Arms, to arms!!!!
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I believe you've violated your Oath of Enlistment. If you feel this strongly you need to get out of the military. I didn't get involved in politics until years after retirement (1996). I helped Wesley Clark during his presidential run. Like President Trump or not (I don't) but he is the duly elected President of the United States. We're Americans, not the military of some third world country. The United States is the world's longest existing democracy and military subservience to civilian control is one of the reasons why.
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SGT Joseph Gunderson
First, I'm retired, bud. Second, I am guessing that you didn't bother to read the piece the whole way through. How about you get all the way to the end before passing judgement.
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MAJ Carl Owen
You are correct and I apologise for not taking the time to read your article in full. After due consideration I have to agree with your assessment. We haven't seen anything anywhere close to justify an armed rebellion. It does distress me that so many of my brothers and sisters in arms have souch a distorted view of Democrats in general and liberals in particular. Being both I find it disturbing that so many Americans prefer to relegate an ever growing number of fellow Americans as subhuman or worse. I remember many years ago when as a young division staff officer I overheard the Assistant Commanding General and several Colonels openly disparage President Clinton. I felt it was extremely inappropriate and even a violation of the UCMJ.
That said what's wrong with our country (in my lowly opinion) has nothing to do with Democrats or Republicans or Conservatives or Liberals or any other stripe of political persuasion. It's that corporate America owns Congress, pretty much both sides. I was a hesitant supporter of Hillary Clinton because I felt she was far too friendly with Big Business but would have at least been a competent caretaker of the Executive Branch of the government. Trump is too incompetent to be even a low-level capo of an Organized Crime family. Again my apology for rushing through your article. It was well written and well thought out.
That said what's wrong with our country (in my lowly opinion) has nothing to do with Democrats or Republicans or Conservatives or Liberals or any other stripe of political persuasion. It's that corporate America owns Congress, pretty much both sides. I was a hesitant supporter of Hillary Clinton because I felt she was far too friendly with Big Business but would have at least been a competent caretaker of the Executive Branch of the government. Trump is too incompetent to be even a low-level capo of an Organized Crime family. Again my apology for rushing through your article. It was well written and well thought out.
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SGT Joseph Gunderson in case you and the others in this thread haven’t recognized it we are currently in a civil war that hasn’t become an armed conflict yet. If our elected leaders don’t wise up and listen to the people they work for we will have a Convention of the States or an armed revolt. It is their choice at the moment. Congress needs to do its job and the courts need to stop legislating from the bench.
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The Declaration of Independence (DoI) is a declaration of war. The DoI was not adopted as part of our government. Citing that document as a guide to be employed renders your entire argument invalid. Our Constitution, as the primary governing document, has been Amended as time has passed. Perhaps The Declaration of Human Rights would be a better guiding framework.
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SGT Joseph Gunderson
I did not say that it was a document that was part of our government but the argument that it gives the right idea as to what constitutes a revolutionary circumstance is ignorant. If we are looking to find what our own founders believed was worthy of revolt there is no better document.
Additionally, neither the constitution or the Dec. of HR lays out these ideas.
Additionally, neither the constitution or the Dec. of HR lays out these ideas.
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SSgt Allan Stringer
I agree with your first sentence, "I did not say .. .the argument that it gives the right idea ... is ignorant." Your second contradicts the first. The "Constitution" should be capitalized, or are you revolting against the English language? "... neither ... nor ...," not "... neither ... or ..."
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I believe that there are some people that would like to use force to remove President Trump I also believe that that is a very very small number there are all kinds of bathrooms in the United States the militias up in Idaho the Ku Klux Klan all over the country are just the most well-known yes I am concerned that each of these radical groups are dangers in their own way but I don’t think there’s any real likelihood there any one of them or any group of them could succeed in overthrowing the constitutional government of United States
On the other hand I personally think that many of the decisions to President Trump has made a bad for the country and I personally think that many of the actions of President Trump has taken Argus the laws of the United States
If there was a constitutional act to remove him from the presidency I would not shed a tear
Luckily we do have a lot of constitutional checks and balances between the branches of the federal government and the states versus the federal government’s the courts at all levels and the loyalty of the military and law-enforcement agencies to the constitutional rights states no one has a loyalty to an elected official they have only loyalties to the constitution of the United States I trust them and I pray for them and I pray for the United States of America
On the other hand I personally think that many of the decisions to President Trump has made a bad for the country and I personally think that many of the actions of President Trump has taken Argus the laws of the United States
If there was a constitutional act to remove him from the presidency I would not shed a tear
Luckily we do have a lot of constitutional checks and balances between the branches of the federal government and the states versus the federal government’s the courts at all levels and the loyalty of the military and law-enforcement agencies to the constitutional rights states no one has a loyalty to an elected official they have only loyalties to the constitution of the United States I trust them and I pray for them and I pray for the United States of America
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Revolt never ended, they just took control, now the paradigms are broken and he is making them whole. I am this country, I am a warrior, We The People will be victorious!!! Holdfast brothers!!!
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