Trump’s Pentagon Opens Up Guantanamo Bay to New Prisoners

Hooah!

MAJ Montgomery Granger - In our system of justice people aren't "found" innocent they are "presumed" innocent until they are "found" guilty. Of course the entire reason the detention camp on Guantanamo was established was to try to get around pesky inconvenient things like the Constitution. Even if that didn't work out quite the way that Cheney and company intended that was the STATED PURPOSE of establishing the camp.

We're the freaking United States of America, we should not be measuring ourselves against the worst we should be measured against our own ideals. We don't get to crow about not beheading people, instead we should hang our heads in shame for torturing people and holding people for years without even charging them with anything.

How are you basing your assertion that _all_ the detainees held were "at LEAST unlawful combatants"? That's not what the Bush administration thought. It's believed that many were just in the wrong place at the wrong time and others were falsely named as Islamic fighters by Afghani warlords looking to collect reward money or just looking to settle a score.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/aug/25/guantanamo-detainees-captured-pakistan-afghanistan

As for the argument that operating the detention facility somehow helps us fight against Islamic terrorism. I haven't seen anything that supports that but I've seen plenty that shows it was and continues to be a highly effective recruiting tool.

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/statements/2015/dec/30/stephen-hayes/guantanamo-key-component-terrorist-propaganda/

I submit that in addition to compromising some of our most precious values that operating the detention facility has actually cost more American lives than it ever could have hoped to save.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/most-guantanamo-detainees-are-innocent-ex-bush-official-1.804550

You can't prove your assertions with other people who assert the same things without proof. It's like trying to define a term by using the term in the definition. What "torture," by whom? Enhanced interrogation techniques (EIT) were legal and approved when used on "a handful of detainees . . . which saved many lives," according to George W. Bush in his autobiography, "Decision Points." There is not always a presumption of innocence, even in our system of justice. Ever heard of "no bail?" If the detainees were presumed innocent they would have never made it to Gitmo. Detainees were vetted "in country" before being flown to Gitmo. Many received battlefield tribunals if their status was in question. The threshold for finding for or against someone is the same as that of those who are confronted in a US grand jury - if it's found more likely than not that person has committed an offense, they are indicted - it's called the 51 percent rule. So, too a battlefield tribunal. That is just to establish stats, i.e., detained person, enemy combatant, protected person, POW, etc. From there, a person can be detained lawfully "until the end of hostilities" without ever being charged or tried. You are confusing jaywalking with unlawful combatants. Those caught in wartime circumstances are not automatically entitled to extra legal privileges. Look at all the droned Americans Obama killed. No presumption of innocence there, nor rights of any kind. Found and then killed. Read up on Geneva Conventions and the Law of Land Warfare. You might learn something. Just remember though, sometimes the truth hurts.

MAJ Montgomery Granger - Even in cases where bail is denied (usually when a criminal suspect is a flight risk) the suspect is still presumed innocent and certainly is under no obligation to "prove" their innocence.

The Geneva Conventions weren't written for situations where you don't have a declared war and your "enemy" is entirely made up of non-state actors. Yes under the conventions these fighters can be (and are) classed as unlawful combatants but the situation on the ground makes it very hard to differentiate combatants from non-combatants in the fog of war because they dress the same and in many cases both are armed on a normal basis (Afghanistan has been a dangerous and hostile place for the majority of our lifetimes)

I provided several links to back and explain my position including firsthand accounts of people involved and independently researched articles by news organizations outside the U.S. (who are less likely to be biased than a U.S. based organization). I deliberately ommitted articles from organizations with likely bias such as the Huffington Post or any human or constitutional rights advocacy group and you can reject those sources if you want but I'll stand by them.

Here's another article you're also free to reject https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/wikileaks/8472804/WikiLeaks-children-among-the-innocent-captured-and-sent-to-Guantanamo.html

Are you kidding? Do you know what my "profession" is? I'm an educator. I served with sheriff deputies, lawyers, doctors, city police officers, clerks, students, retail sales representatives, school guidance counselors, bus drivers, etc. If captured on the battlefield they would only be described by their unit and rank in the military. Unlawful combatants OF COURSE claim to "only be a goat herder." How naive. Al Qaeda and other terrorists are TRAINED to lie about their treatment in captivity. Islam teaches them to lie to the Infidels. They don't wear uniforms or follow Geneva Conventions because they want to defeat us. They don't care about rules, they care about killing us. The Geneva Conventions DO NOT APPLY to unlawful combatants, HOWEVER, upon my unit's arrival to Gitmo, Don Rumsfeld himself told my commander that we would treat the detainees according to "the spirit of Geneva." That's all we needed to hear. We knew no other way. We trained to ONLY treat detainees under the letter and spirit of the Conventions. Gitmo became a virtual Muslim paradise. many had never had it so good, Some didn't even want to leave. The got FREE Qurans, prayer rugs/beads, halal and special Muslim holy holiday meals including lamb and baklava, services of US military Muslim chaplains, directions to Mecca on guard towers and cell floors, world class medical care, white robes, beards, TV, DVD's, recreation - including an artificial turf soccer field, etc. Again, there has not been even ONE "innocent" person incarcerated at Gitmo. The vast majority of detainees were never accused of anything, nor did they need to be. During WWII the US held over 400,000 mostly German lawful combatant POW's who were never charged nor tried because they were never accused of war crimes. They could be lawfully held "until the end of hostilities." Why should Gitmo detainees be treated differently? Because bleeding heart anti-American liberals feel sorry for them? Fill it up, Mr. President, fill it up and then Make Gitmo Great Again. Hooah!

Hooah!