Posted on Mar 22, 2023
US to fast-track Abrams tanks for Ukraine by choosing older version
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US to fast-track Abrams tanks for Ukraine by choosing older version
MY SAY: Old gen M1A1 Abrams are no match for next gen Russian armor: T-90's & T-14's. It will be a slaughter.
MY SAY: Old gen M1A1 Abrams are no match for next gen Russian armor: T-90's & T-14's. It will be a slaughter.
US to fast-track Abrams tanks for Ukraine by choosing older version
Posted from defensenews.com
Russia
Ukraine
Foreign Aid
Tanks
Posted 1 y ago
Responses: 3
Disagree.
T14s aren't an issue as they were being fielded last year in limited numbers to the 2nd GMRD, and that unit had already been rotated out of the war in Ukraine because of major combat losses. They are being reequipped, but UK's MOD stated "the unit is mostly composed of mobilized personnel "operating older equipment taken from storage" whose combat effectiveness "will likely be limited despite several weeks of training."
Second, the Russians have almost all of their T90s in Ukraine (about 50 or so) packed into one small sector of the Ukrainian front around Svatove in eastern Ukraine’s Donbas region. The majority of them are still in Russia (around 360 of them with another 200 or so in storage).
Thirdly, a sabot round from a M1A1 can easily penetrate the armor of a T90 from any angle (even using the old rounds). Now, if they are only given HEAT rounds, that could indeed pose a problem as the M803 rounds had issues against the T90s in frontal engagements. However, they've lost 36 of the T90s from Ukrainian forces in the last year.
A M1A1/T90 matchup will cause nowhere near the level consternation that the Tiger tank rolling onto the battlefield in early WW2 caused and as with most things, it's going to come down to training, tactics and strategy.
T14s aren't an issue as they were being fielded last year in limited numbers to the 2nd GMRD, and that unit had already been rotated out of the war in Ukraine because of major combat losses. They are being reequipped, but UK's MOD stated "the unit is mostly composed of mobilized personnel "operating older equipment taken from storage" whose combat effectiveness "will likely be limited despite several weeks of training."
Second, the Russians have almost all of their T90s in Ukraine (about 50 or so) packed into one small sector of the Ukrainian front around Svatove in eastern Ukraine’s Donbas region. The majority of them are still in Russia (around 360 of them with another 200 or so in storage).
Thirdly, a sabot round from a M1A1 can easily penetrate the armor of a T90 from any angle (even using the old rounds). Now, if they are only given HEAT rounds, that could indeed pose a problem as the M803 rounds had issues against the T90s in frontal engagements. However, they've lost 36 of the T90s from Ukrainian forces in the last year.
A M1A1/T90 matchup will cause nowhere near the level consternation that the Tiger tank rolling onto the battlefield in early WW2 caused and as with most things, it's going to come down to training, tactics and strategy.
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We'll see how these older tanks do against the newer Russian ones...I suspect, not very well.
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MAJ Montgomery Granger
I don't know if Ukraine has that much time! They will lose a war of attrition with Russia. US could send anything, but if there aren't trained Ukrainians to use them, they are useless.
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The Russians have run out of all their next gen stuff. Soviet-era T72s and T80s have been seen on the battlefield, and even the older Abrams would blow those things out of the water, if the Russians could even get them to the frontlines before they break down. In addition to the NATO-supplied Javelins and rocket batteries, I doubt even the most advance Russian armor would last long.
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MAJ Montgomery Granger
It is IMPOSSIBLE that the Russians have even committed the next gen armor, let alone done so and then lost! T-14s? What does Ukraine have to even scratch them? Leopard I's and old Abrams A1's are no match for even T-90's or T-80's! The Russians have their BEST armor and troops in RESERVE.
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John Doane
MAJ Montgomery Granger - No T14s have been deployed, that is true, but even if they were to be deployed, their logistics network would not be able to support them. The Russians are getting bogged down with lack of food, proper equipment, ammunition, and other vital war materiel. In the case of the modern tanks, the reason behind the Russian government's reluctance to deploy the modern tanks is that they are in a severe shortage of the microchips and computer components necessary to maintain and produce the new gen stuff. Taiwan, Korea, Japan, and the US are the largest producers of computer chips, and none of those countries are particularly willing to sell to the Russians... This also doesn't consider the combined arms side of the conflict. NATO and allied nations are training Ukrainian pilots, and no amount of armor can stand up to aerial bombardment. We have also supplied multiple rocket-based artillery systems, which both out-gun Russian batteries, and could blow up Russian armor. I'm not saying that it would be a complete roll-over for the Ukrainians, but supplying them with the Abrams would strenthen their defense against the weakened Russian armor.
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