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SGT Timothy Stuart
14
14
0
Edited >1 y ago
Why not do what the Marine Corps has done for years and make the Soldier accountable for his actions. They are adults! Some of whom are to end up in a combat zone within a relatively short period of time. They need to no longer be coddled, and ACT like an ADULT! Discipline for the military has it's foundations laid in boot camp. Take more time instilling it there, either by extending the time to Basically Train a Soldier, or stop watering down the standards.
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SGT Timothy Stuart
SGT Timothy Stuart
>1 y
PFC Pamala (Hall) Foster - The Marine Corps has used Platoon Sergeants for AIT since 1995 at least. It is what I had while I was going thru my AIT for the Marines. Your statement that "you can NOT make a Solider in 9 to 13 weeks.", I beg to differ with. When my Company graduated from Parris Island we ALL understood that playtime was over, and we were now fully responsible for our own actions (good or bad). THAT standard is were the military is failing at now.
The culture of participation trophies for everyone, celebrations for being able to change oxygen to carbon dioxide, and everything being made of unicorn farts and fairy dust is to blame. I see this in the industry I am in now when I tell the younger new hires they are failing to me the standard, and the response I get is "At least I tried.". The look of abject horror when I tell them "Do or do not, there is no try." (Yoda is a wise being after all) is amazing. They've never had an adult not jump up and down, applauding them for merely trying. Smoke sessions not needed, reality checks however..............
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PFC Pamala (Hall) Foster
PFC Pamala (Hall) Foster
>1 y
Playtime is OVER now!!! The 'Smoke Sessions' we had were PT til we dropped and that helped keep us in shape physically and mentoring was mentally. I was in from 07 to 09 at 37 yoa and you said it right: NO TRY- DO IT! I didn't know how Marines did it, but Army was my branch and when I saw Marines, I knew I was backed by the best til my guys got there. I did til I dropped and still at a loss of how I did it. Second-FORGET Participation trophies-EARN THE HONOR, Give it all you have and DON'T GIVE UP!!! My reality check came the morning I woke up and couldn't go anymore...now i mentor and live as a civilian and volunteer singing for our guys and gals.
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PVT Thad Lucken
PVT Thad Lucken
>1 y
i had an SFC from day one til abn school. wtf did they ever take them out for? oh, obama,right..
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2ndLt Fulton Recepcion
2ndLt Fulton Recepcion
>1 y
If they have to bring DS back to AIT, it's because the current leadership at these schoolhouses (the NCOs and Officers) are not enforcing it enough!

The idea is for a new Soldier to eventually be able to carry themselves without the "benefit" of a DI/DS. Leadership is also required to enforce discipline. It does not take the DI/DS model to do that. While the DI/DS does their role well, it is for that civilian transitioning from civilian to military life.

As indicated in my lone post, bringing back the DS to AIT can backfire if they have not evaluated all the factors leading to these accounts of non-discipline.
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SCPO Weather
3
3
0
Reinforcing discipline is a good start. There are other changes that need to be made though. Personal accountability is the first. Holding entire commands/theaters responsible for the actions of a few is demoralizing for all those who are doing the right things. It breeds a belief that it doesn't matter what one does they're going to get punished eventually. The second is the attitude of "Zero Defects" or as I called it, "One strike and your out" needs to go away. Granted, there are violations that are one-strike violations. However, back in my day, we used to be able to screw up pretty regularly and live to tell the tale. Ironically, discipline was pretty tough as was individual accountability.
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SPC Bise Analyst
3
3
0
While I agree dicipline has been in decline in certain areas, I agree with the previous notion: we are all adults. Dicipline is a self-instilled quality to be effective. Yes while the standard can be enforced- (and it should) some soldier AITs need creative approaches. Intelligence as an example: soldiers need to know and be enforced on basic standards, but they need a constructive open forum enviroment for development of critical thinking/analysis/ and addressing superiors on COA development. A DS style approach may very well hinder that environment/learning and negatively impact the MI warfighting function for the ranks to come.
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2ndLt Fulton Recepcion
2ndLt Fulton Recepcion
>1 y
>" A DS style approach may very well hinder that environment/learning and negatively"

Well said. As I said in my post(s), the idea is to be able to operate effectively without the "benefit" of a Drill Instructor/Sergeant after you graduate from Basic/Boot.

Discipline can be enforced without the DI/DS style. In my opinion, it's the leadership at AIT that has failed to do this.
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