Posted on Sep 6, 2015
SPC James Seigars
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As anyone who looks at my profile can see I left the Military as an E-4 and had been a E-5 for three years prior to being demoted by a green Commander due to actions my spouse & step kids had taken while not in my presence. That 1st LT told me after he made Captain that he was wrong & I should have went to Jag or IG and then asked me to go to the board. I refused. I told him that if he felt he was wrong he should give me my rank back without going through the board again, but he said I had to. So I decided if that is how NCO's are treated I wanted no part of it. After that even though I had Officers & Senior NCO's try to get me to return to the board & re-attain my rank in all three of my remaining units I still refused to go on principal. Most people think I was wrong, but I liked being a Specialist and did just as well or better as I did as a NCO. So my question is why is it so important to get a higher rank if you don't like the politics, extra requirements or stigma that goes with it? I am happy I served over 20 years total and even though I wonder what it would have been like if I hadn't got demoted I am still proud of my accomplishments after that unfortunate event.
Posted in these groups: Rank RankB7085196 Stigma
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Responses: 4
SrA Matthew Knight
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My grandpa retired 20 years Air Force as an E5 back before the high year tenure was lowered for Staff Sergeants. Nothing wrong with not advancing far if you are fine with what you do.

The stigma probably stems from the common mind set that everyone should always be hard charging for promotions and what not. If you don't then I think leadership gets it in their head that you just don't really care about advancing in your career so they start looking down on you.

For me right now I am going to be testing for Staff Sergeant for the first time next spring. On the one hand some of the NCOs here are pushing me to study and seem like they want me to make it. On the other hand, I am planning on getting out at the end of my enlistment in 2017 and if I make Staff I would sew on literally right before I got out so they also talk about how I would be stealing a stripe from someone who is staying in and could actually take on a supervisory role. They want me to try and get promoted to show I want to advance but yet don't want to waste a stripe and ALS training on me.

It all stems back to showing initiative I guess and by not wanting to get promoted one isn't showing the initiative that they are looking for, at least in a career soldier/sailor/marine/airman. You served your 20 years, be proud of what you did and the time you put into it and let the naysayers live in blissful ignorance.
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SPC James Seigars
SPC James Seigars
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Thanks SrA Knight. I had two Sergeant E-5's in Germany in 2005 that both had 20 and were a couple of the best NCO's I ever had. Neither of them cared that they weren't selected for the E-6 board because they liked things how they were. If not for them and my getting demoted I may have tried for promotions I didn't want & possibly take them away from those that did. I'm glad someone gets it.
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SGT Jerrold Pesz
SGT Jerrold Pesz
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When I was in the army they started making people sign a statement of intent to reenlist in order to be promoted if they were close to their ETS. That happened because we did have some people get promoted and then almost immediately leave the service. I don't know how enforceable that was but it worked where I was.
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Cpl Dennis F.
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Why do you look like a Smurf in your photo?
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SPC James Seigars
SPC James Seigars
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Good question. I don't know since the original photo doesn't have that blue tint to it.
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CW3 Network Architect
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So what did your spouse and step-kids do that caused your commander to demote you? How exactly did he demote you, through an Article 15?
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SPC James Seigars
SPC James Seigars
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She was wanting a form that let us live off base from the first Sergeant and went to the company asking for him by last name without rank and when asked if that was who she wanted said "He may be your 1SG, but he ain't nothing to me". Then a week later one of the step kids, both boys of which was in ROTC punched another Cadet in the mouth for not saluting properly (I had to pay $200 because his wire from the braces he wore went into his jaw). His Mother was German and had an article put in the German paper about the incident. the same boy a month later tripped a girl by the hallway stairs trying to scare her. She got shin splints and I had to pay her medical bills. Her father was a SFC and contacted my Colonel (I worked in a dental Battalion & he was the same as a Captain in a normal unit) about it. The Colonel told the LT to deal with it, so he told me "You need to train your family in military ways and get them in line". I told him I would try, but they weren't soldiers or animals so they might not do as told. Sure enough it wasn't long until the MP's called about my 18 y/o stepdaughter who was falling down drunk at the Officer/NCO Club on the Kasern. That happened for about four weeks. The final straw came on New Year's Eve/day when I had to pick her up at a bar on the economy because her ride left her. I had two drinks 1.5 hours before leaving, but when I was stopped at a checkpoint I blew a 0.54 which in Europe is drunk and got a DUI there even though my record is clean here. The Colonel told the Captain that was the last straw and to send them back citing the SOFA agreement and I got an article 15 for failure to obey a direct order since I couldn't keep them out of trouble or "Train" them as directed and got the first DUI of the year so he wanted to make a statement. The Article 15 wasn't read until April 5th and the demotion wasn't automatic, by the way. It was suspended for six months pending me not getting in further trouble. I ended up forgetting I hadn't taken some paperwork to Brigade yet in late September and mistakenly told the CoC I had. When I saw that I was mistaken I did the right thing & told them I hadn't taken the paperwork when I stated I had but had afterward. The LT didn't have an issue, but the Colonel said I had failed to live up to the suspension clause and would lose my rank on October 2nd. That is the part everyone has issues with including the LT that had to take my rank. Since the incident that I got the article 15 for happened Jan 1st then six months would be July 1st, however the Colonel stated orally that it was from six months from April 5th which would be October 5th (Three days after the demotion took effect) which wasn't stated in the actual Article. Needless to say it shouldn't surprise anyone that I am divorced, don't drink at all anymore (not that I did much back then), don't like being around people or drama so I live alone and I refused to get my rank back after all that happened when I lost it. BTW I know drinking & driving is wrong and if I could have got her home by a taxi or friend, any other way, I would have.
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