Posted on Nov 12, 2014
Should soldiers that didn't finish their term of service, other than ETS, be allowed the title Veteran?
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As we dawn into an era where - like WWII veterans once were - we as veterans will nearly outnumber our civilian counterparts 3:1 in any given area. My question this evening is this: Should a soldier be entitled to be called a Veteran if they didn't even finish their first term of service, other than an ETS (3-5 yrs)? For example, they were chaptered out (600-9, APFT, Misbehavior, etc.). Or, should there be a number of years served before being granted the title Veteran and be able to enjoy the fringe benefits such as, being thanked, free meals, etc? I believe, an ID card should be issued with from and through dates of service, type of discharge given and under what conditions (ETS, Retired, Chapter, Disabled, etc). This would alleviate any "dishonorable claim of service". Just my opinion, what are yours?
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Responses: 12
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SSG Purham...we used to define a "Veteran" as a combat veteran from the Revolutionary War to the Civil War. "Veterans" groups per se first formed after the Civil War; prior to that they were "societies". WWI and WWII adjusted that definition. During and after WWII, a "Veteran" was usually considered one who held an honorable discharge, particularly for disability or for fulfilling all terms of enlistment during a time of war or conflict. Under that definition someone who does not yet have an honorable discharge is not yet a "veteran", but a "service member".
Consider also that the term "veteran" can be traced back to the Roman Legions. A "veteran" was called an Evocati (who reenlisted after 10 years, usually by an officer's request) or Triaii; generally one who performed 20 years of service and was semi-retired subject to recall, for which he (rarely a she) was granted citizenship, if applicable. Veterans also served in the third level or Auxiliary (Auxillia). In combat formations, the Evocati were usually placed in the third rank behind younger, less seasoned soldiers to direct them and to stop them from retreating.
http://www.tribunesandtriumphs.org/roman-army/roman-army-ranks.htm
Consider also that the term "veteran" can be traced back to the Roman Legions. A "veteran" was called an Evocati (who reenlisted after 10 years, usually by an officer's request) or Triaii; generally one who performed 20 years of service and was semi-retired subject to recall, for which he (rarely a she) was granted citizenship, if applicable. Veterans also served in the third level or Auxiliary (Auxillia). In combat formations, the Evocati were usually placed in the third rank behind younger, less seasoned soldiers to direct them and to stop them from retreating.
http://www.tribunesandtriumphs.org/roman-army/roman-army-ranks.htm
Roman Army Ranks! Visit this Roman site for interesting history, facts and information about the different Roman Army Ranks. The power and effectiveness of the different Roman Army Ranks.
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SFC Randy Purham
SGM Dan Coberly, I wholeheartedly agree with you. Thank you for the overview and your response. That was awesome.
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You make some good points and perhaps some of this stems from overkill that is exactly opposite of the past where Honorably serving Veterans were denied benefits they earned.
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1SG Michael Blount
SSgt (Join to see) - if they don't fit the definition, then they're not veterans. Period.
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SGT Michael Glenn
I didnt finish my 2nd term with en ETS but paid dearly for my 1 3/4 term that I did serve. What kind of criteria is being set on this? what do you as well as others think should be deciding factors??
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SFC Randy Purham
SGT Michael Glenn, you finished a term. A veteran. At least in my book. You Reenlisted but got out for whatever reason. If you did it honorably then, hey no issues on my end. SGT Larry Olson, Yes, very true. A bad stigma that has been lumped for everyone that wears a uniform.
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This is an issue for "quality control" at MEPS and the Recruiter.
My opinion is, if they stepped off the cattle truck and survived the first night, they've done more than 95% of Americans. Many of the benefits most of us receive are not available to them because of many of the reasons you already cited (OTH and Bad Conduct, Chapters occurring under 6 months service, etc.), cut them some slack for at least trying. Or failing that, put the blame where it belongs, weak screening in order to make numbers...
My opinion is, if they stepped off the cattle truck and survived the first night, they've done more than 95% of Americans. Many of the benefits most of us receive are not available to them because of many of the reasons you already cited (OTH and Bad Conduct, Chapters occurring under 6 months service, etc.), cut them some slack for at least trying. Or failing that, put the blame where it belongs, weak screening in order to make numbers...
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SFC Randy Purham
Yes, there should be a better screening process. But outside of that. A person whether it was made for them or not, and didn't finish their initial term for reasons other than service-connected injuries, or something along the honorable reasons that would prevent them from finishing their term should not be deemed a veteran. That to me is like giving a participation trophy to everyone in a sport.
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SPC Jason London
I agree with you in spirit but in reality there is no good way to track stuff like this. I think it's unfortunate but I take solace in knowing that what I did was important and if they want to take credit then that's fine, let them. The job got done and the people i care about know the truth, and that's all that matters to me.
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