Posted on Aug 26, 2021
Any Advice for Reason of Separation Upgrade Not RE-code Navy?
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Looking for advice on best approach, what to expect, can I do it alone? I'm hoping to change my reason of separation based on error of handling. I have contacted lawyers, however, they are all very busy, I do have consultations lined up. I don't want VA benefits or an RE code change as I think they're fine as they are. I don't feel that my discharge was done properly based on procedure. If anyone has experience or knows someone who may have advice, feel free to reach out. Thank you all for your time.
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It will be a lot easier and faster for you to get a waiver from a branch than it will be to get your case before a discharge review board. For one, your purpose for requesting the change is for reentering the military and that can be accomplished through a waiver, meaning that a discharge review isn't necessary. Review boards can take years to review a case if it's not a high priority, and this wouldn't be a high priority case. Second, you have to show that the Separation authority was completely incorrect. Not that it could have been, might have been, or that there were mitigating circumstances and you don't agree with the outcome. Commanders have wide latitude to choose one separation over another and a review board will not lightly overturn a Commanders choice without proof that your separation reason "should" have been something else and not "could" have been something else.
I can tell you that based on the information you provided below there are some things the board will take issue with. Pseudoephedrine is not meth, it's not like meth, it's not even a prescription drug, it's an over the counter drug in most states. You can use it to make meth with some backyard chemistry, but you can use mold to make LSD and that doesn't mean ergot fungus is LSD. You don't know that a medical officer broke any protocol by referring you somewhere. It is the duty of the medical officer to determine when a person needs to be referred to a higher echelon of care. You also don't have a copy of the protocol on hand. Even if you did, and the medical officer broke that protocol, they are within their duties and responsibilities to make that call. Your psych eval may have been haphazard but adjustment disorder is a common enough reaction to a stressful situation that it doesn't take a PhD to meet with you in person to identify.
When you remove these parts of your story, as the board members will, it will read like this:
Serious inner ear infection caused disoriention and extreme pain that led to emotional breakdown during training. No prior history of anxiety disorder and no post history of anxiety disorder afterwards.
That is a much easier sell for the board, that's not to say they will change your separation. But that's also a much easier sell for a recruiter putting in a waiver.
I can tell you that based on the information you provided below there are some things the board will take issue with. Pseudoephedrine is not meth, it's not like meth, it's not even a prescription drug, it's an over the counter drug in most states. You can use it to make meth with some backyard chemistry, but you can use mold to make LSD and that doesn't mean ergot fungus is LSD. You don't know that a medical officer broke any protocol by referring you somewhere. It is the duty of the medical officer to determine when a person needs to be referred to a higher echelon of care. You also don't have a copy of the protocol on hand. Even if you did, and the medical officer broke that protocol, they are within their duties and responsibilities to make that call. Your psych eval may have been haphazard but adjustment disorder is a common enough reaction to a stressful situation that it doesn't take a PhD to meet with you in person to identify.
When you remove these parts of your story, as the board members will, it will read like this:
Serious inner ear infection caused disoriention and extreme pain that led to emotional breakdown during training. No prior history of anxiety disorder and no post history of anxiety disorder afterwards.
That is a much easier sell for the board, that's not to say they will change your separation. But that's also a much easier sell for a recruiter putting in a waiver.
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PFC (Join to see)
I appreciate your input sir. Clarification, I mentioned pseudoephedrine because the main side effect is anxiety, if it changed my behavior unknown to me. I'm not really one to be sick so I've never had it before or really anxiety, new territory all around for me. You mention a diagnosis
dor Adjustment Disorders doesn't need a PhD. For the military to meet bar they need to be diagnosed by a professional who is using the DSM V and not IV in regards to adjustment disorder diagnosis. I'm not a law expert obviously.
I've tried to abbreviate the story, however, you're not wrong with how the board will view it and I agree with you.I guess crying can been seen as an emotional thing beyond it being a response to pain. An emotional distress signal regardless of the scenario. I will certainly consider that and thank you sir very much.
dor Adjustment Disorders doesn't need a PhD. For the military to meet bar they need to be diagnosed by a professional who is using the DSM V and not IV in regards to adjustment disorder diagnosis. I'm not a law expert obviously.
I've tried to abbreviate the story, however, you're not wrong with how the board will view it and I agree with you.I guess crying can been seen as an emotional thing beyond it being a response to pain. An emotional distress signal regardless of the scenario. I will certainly consider that and thank you sir very much.
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SFC (Join to see)
PFC (Join to see) actually what I said is that you don't need a PhD to recognize the signs and the PhD does not need to meet with you to diagnose it. The way military medicine works is that the lowest person possible who is capable and certified/licensed to record your symptoms does that and the person required to approve it does that. That means that a nurse or PA, who are licensed to assess and treat mental health issues, records the notes. The Doctor reviews the notes and certifies the diagnosis when appropriate. With the amount of entry level separations a training base goes through, you are not going to get an in depth sit down with a Psychiatrist or Psychologist. If you check off enough criteria you can be diagnosed. I'm not sure why you're pointing at the DSM 4 vs 5 criteria but it's this: the presence of emotional or behavioral symptoms in response to an identifiable stressor/s, which occurred within three months of the beginning of the stressor/s.
You met that criteria enough for a medical provider to tag you with it. You are mistaking the bar that the military must meet to separate you under anxiety disorder. You do not have to go and sit down with a Psych, your packet with your info goes before the Behavioral Health team for that post who stamps off that based on your symptoms you are displaying adjustment disorder.
As I said, you have an unreasonably high bar to overcome in order to even get a review board to look into your case. It will be much easier to simply get a waiver, once you're in your old separation is behind you and no longer a hindrance
You met that criteria enough for a medical provider to tag you with it. You are mistaking the bar that the military must meet to separate you under anxiety disorder. You do not have to go and sit down with a Psych, your packet with your info goes before the Behavioral Health team for that post who stamps off that based on your symptoms you are displaying adjustment disorder.
As I said, you have an unreasonably high bar to overcome in order to even get a review board to look into your case. It will be much easier to simply get a waiver, once you're in your old separation is behind you and no longer a hindrance
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PFC (Join to see)
SFC (Join to see) - Thank you very much for being so in-depth and informative, sir. I really do appreciate it, there are a lot of layers in the military that I do not understand as many others do not, all I can do is try. One challenge is misinformation and I appreciate your insight.
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Can you do it alone? Yes I did mine alone (for the most part anyway). It really depends on what you're trying to change it from, to.
Couple questions though:
1. If you're not upgrading for VA benefits or a change in RE code, what's your goal?
2. What are you trying to change the reasoning from and what do you think it should be?
3. In what way do you think your seperation was mishandled and what proof do you have to support it?
4. How long have you been out?
Couple questions though:
1. If you're not upgrading for VA benefits or a change in RE code, what's your goal?
2. What are you trying to change the reasoning from and what do you think it should be?
3. In what way do you think your seperation was mishandled and what proof do you have to support it?
4. How long have you been out?
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PFC (Join to see)
Here is a correction to my statement about pseudoephedrine. I misspoke about it with the intention of pointing out its adverse effects. Whether it is relevant in my story or not, I have no idea!
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SSG Bill McCoy
PFC (Join to see) - Indeed ... a side effect is anxiety in some people. Comparing it to meth however is omething you do not want to state in any appeal or waiver effort. Best of luck to you - as others have said, the waiver is probably your best bet. MEPS will require at least one physician's statement to validate your claim that it was the meds that caused your anxiety. Or, if you can, get an MD and a psychologist/psychiatrist before even going for the waiver. That will sho initiative; but of course that depends on whether or not you have insurance or can afford it out-of-pocket.
Again, best of luck to you.
Again, best of luck to you.
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PFC (Join to see)
SSG Bill McCoy - You are right about the meth comment, hence why I clarified it.Thanks a million for the input sir, I do have insurance through work and that's a great idea.
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PFC Darrell Delmundo
The review board will not procure or review any documentation that is not provided by you. The More documentation you can provide to support your appeal the better. They also will not grant approval for appeal that are for the sole purpose of reenlistment. PFC (Join to see)
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If PTSD is involved at all I believe there is a group in DC funded to represent vets upgrading their discharge
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