Posted on Sep 7, 2019
Anyone have the new regulation/pamphlet on Change of Responsibility where we are not to use the NCO sword any longer?
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Regulation
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DA Pam 670-1
Posted >1 y ago
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The "no more swords policy" was never an actual policy. Just something that the SMA at the time mentioned casually at a symposium that he didn't like. CSM's across the Army burned up their keyboards to give weight to his peeves, and just like that, an urban legend was born. TC 7-22.7 is your reference for the COR ceremony, and it'll provide you some examples. Having said that, there is no OFFICIAL COR ceremony in the Drill and Ceremony manual. it only covers Changes of Command.
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CSM (Join to see)
I figured it was an urban myth. I couldn’t remember where I read it at I just hate that they would change traditions
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Not to my knowledge. We still use the NCO sword at every Change of Responsibility Ceremony. The sword is kept at the Battalion CSM’s (my)Office.
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History of the United States Army NCO Sword
The Model 1840 Noncommissioned Officers' Sword was based on a German version of the infantry sword used by British troops during the Napoleonic Wars. In August of 1840, the United States Army Ordnance Department contracted with Schnitzler & Kirschbaum ( S&K )of Solingen, Prussia for 1000 swords of this pattern. Later, N.P. Ames Manufacturing Company of Cabotville received their first contract in 1844 to make this sword, followed by Ames Manufacturing Company of Cabotville (1847), then by Ames Manufacturing Company of Chicoppee , Mass in the 1850s.
The Model 1840 Army NCO sword was worn and saw frontline service by American sergeants during such great conflicts as the Mexican-American War (1846 - 1848), the Civil War (1861 - 1865), and the Spanish American War (1898). A shorter version with a 26 inch blade (the typical 1840 Army NCO sword sports a 31 inch blade) was carried by musicians, and thus was called the Model 1840 Musician's sword. NCO's of shorter stature and cadets also carried this variant. Other ranks allowed to carry it included Sergeant Major, Quartermaster, Ordnance Sergeant, Hospital Steward, Corporal and Pioneer (Combat Engineer).
Many of the Model 1840 Army NCO swords manufactured by the primary contractor, the Ames Manufacturing Company, were very badly manufactured with a blunt edge, but they still proved effective in combat, as the sword could be used like an iron club to break bones. The 1840 Army NCO sword was the main weapon of standard bearers and hospital stewards, as well as a secondary weapon for infantry NCO's. The sword was also used by the Confederates who captured many after seizing state arsenals.
The M1840 (1840 Army NCO sword) has had a long service life. In 1868 the United States Army ordnance board recommended that no more leather sword or bayonet scabbards be purchased. (the sword was originally was equipped with a leather scabbard), so after the leather ones were used up, a black Japanned steel scabbard was substituted along with a new pattern leather frog. The 1840 Army NCO sword remained in service as a ceremonial weapon until general orders No. 77 dated August 6, 1875 discontinued its use. A modern version of this sword with steel scabbard is currently permitted for wear by US Army platoon sergeants and first sergeants (Army Field Manual FM 3-21.5) and is mostly used during a regimental CSM (Sergeant Major or SGM) change of command as a symbolic transfer of authority between CSM's.
Some Army NCOs have this sword and wear it for social occasions, regardless of duty as a platoon sergeant or first sergeant. After all, the sword was originally designed for them. As the original 1840 Army NCO Sword could be carried - by regulation - by all Non-Commissioned Officers. This included the ranks of:
Sergeant-Major,
Quartermaster Sergeant,
Ordnance Sergeant,
Hospital Steward,
First Sergeant,
Sergeant,
Corporal, and
Pioneer.
The 1840 United States Army NCO Sword with leather scabbard
The United States Army NCO sword was adopted by the War Department in 1840. The Army NCO Sword has been worn by Army sergeants for over 100 years. It is primarily used today for honor guards and presentations such as PCS and change of command. Prior to 1868 the M1840 (1840 Army NCO sword) was equipped with a leather scabbard and this traditional sword is preferred by various units.
The Model 1840 Noncommissioned Officers' Sword was based on a German version of the infantry sword used by British troops during the Napoleonic Wars. In August of 1840, the United States Army Ordnance Department contracted with Schnitzler & Kirschbaum ( S&K )of Solingen, Prussia for 1000 swords of this pattern. Later, N.P. Ames Manufacturing Company of Cabotville received their first contract in 1844 to make this sword, followed by Ames Manufacturing Company of Cabotville (1847), then by Ames Manufacturing Company of Chicoppee , Mass in the 1850s.
The Model 1840 Army NCO sword was worn and saw frontline service by American sergeants during such great conflicts as the Mexican-American War (1846 - 1848), the Civil War (1861 - 1865), and the Spanish American War (1898). A shorter version with a 26 inch blade (the typical 1840 Army NCO sword sports a 31 inch blade) was carried by musicians, and thus was called the Model 1840 Musician's sword. NCO's of shorter stature and cadets also carried this variant. Other ranks allowed to carry it included Sergeant Major, Quartermaster, Ordnance Sergeant, Hospital Steward, Corporal and Pioneer (Combat Engineer).
Many of the Model 1840 Army NCO swords manufactured by the primary contractor, the Ames Manufacturing Company, were very badly manufactured with a blunt edge, but they still proved effective in combat, as the sword could be used like an iron club to break bones. The 1840 Army NCO sword was the main weapon of standard bearers and hospital stewards, as well as a secondary weapon for infantry NCO's. The sword was also used by the Confederates who captured many after seizing state arsenals.
The M1840 (1840 Army NCO sword) has had a long service life. In 1868 the United States Army ordnance board recommended that no more leather sword or bayonet scabbards be purchased. (the sword was originally was equipped with a leather scabbard), so after the leather ones were used up, a black Japanned steel scabbard was substituted along with a new pattern leather frog. The 1840 Army NCO sword remained in service as a ceremonial weapon until general orders No. 77 dated August 6, 1875 discontinued its use. A modern version of this sword with steel scabbard is currently permitted for wear by US Army platoon sergeants and first sergeants (Army Field Manual FM 3-21.5) and is mostly used during a regimental CSM (Sergeant Major or SGM) change of command as a symbolic transfer of authority between CSM's.
Some Army NCOs have this sword and wear it for social occasions, regardless of duty as a platoon sergeant or first sergeant. After all, the sword was originally designed for them. As the original 1840 Army NCO Sword could be carried - by regulation - by all Non-Commissioned Officers. This included the ranks of:
Sergeant-Major,
Quartermaster Sergeant,
Ordnance Sergeant,
Hospital Steward,
First Sergeant,
Sergeant,
Corporal, and
Pioneer.
The 1840 United States Army NCO Sword with leather scabbard
The United States Army NCO sword was adopted by the War Department in 1840. The Army NCO Sword has been worn by Army sergeants for over 100 years. It is primarily used today for honor guards and presentations such as PCS and change of command. Prior to 1868 the M1840 (1840 Army NCO sword) was equipped with a leather scabbard and this traditional sword is preferred by various units.
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I retired in 1992. NCO's didn't have swords then. I remember during the 70's at some ceremonies seeing NCO's wear them, but I know that the Tradition of the NCO Sword was done away with in the 80's. Did they come back after the 90's?
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1SG Frank Boynton
The NCO sword was a tradition that was dropped by the wayside. Who do you see wearing NCO swords today? Same as the swagger sticks. A tradition that was ended. Of course they kept the officers sword and their traditions. Other than ceremonial units I’ve one on very rare occasions seen an NCO wearing the NCO sword.
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SFC Michael Hasbun
1SG Frank Boynton - Swagger sticks were never actually official. NCO swords however, ARE official. I agree that the tradition faded to the background, but it's always been authorized since 1840.
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SFC Michael Hasbun
1SG Frank Boynton - As for who wears it.... well, me, for one ;o)
PS, I'm of average height, those bastards were just really tall!
PS, I'm of average height, those bastards were just really tall!
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1SG Frank Boynton
Well according to CSM Ron Sachs evidently they are worn during Chang of responsibility ceremonies. I served 20 years and I’ve never heard of a change of responsibility ceremony. So besides that, there are no Official functions that an NCO is authorized to wear the sword. I did my share of formals. I never saw a single NCO wear a sword. Your picture clearly shows you with one. I’m just saying if they were authorized for wear I think I’d have seen them at formals and other ceremonies.
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