Posted on Mar 7, 2014
AR 670-1: What is your reaction to the newest changes?
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<14px;">, APPROVED, AND PUBLISHED!<br><br>2. New revision of the regulation will define the following terms: eccentric, faddish,conservative, inconspicuous, unsightly, hair braids/plaits.<br><br>3. AR 670-1 will be a PUNITIVE order in the new regulation. <br><br>4. Sideburns will not extend below the top of the ear. <br><br>5. Soldiers will be clean shaven on AND off duty (even during leave).<br><br>6. Female and Male hair grooming standards will become more restrictive and better defined(I'll have pictures for you at MHS).<br><br>7. Females will be allowed to put their hair into a pony tail during PT.<br><br>8. Males will be prohibited from wearing cosmetics to include nail polish, females may wear cosmetics conservatively, but can only wear nail polish in service, mess, or dress uniforms.<br><br>9. Females fingernail length will not exceed 1/4 inch, no fake nails, add-ons, or extensions will be authorized.<br><br>10. Tattoos will not be visible above the neck line when the IPFU is worn. Tattoos will not extend below the wrist line and not on the hands. Sleeve tattoos will be prohibited (this one will be grandfathered).<br><br>11. Soldiers will not walk while engaged in activities that require the hand salute (eating, cell phone use, smoking, etc.).<br><br>12. ACUs will not be commercially pressed; hand ironing of the ACU only will be authorized.</span></font></p><font color="#666666"><span style="line-height: 17px; font-size: 14px;"><p><br>13. Bags worn over the shoulder will only be black or the color print of the uniform i.e. ACU, without logos.<br><br>14. the new regulation will specify civilian clothes standards both on and off duty and both on and off post.<br><br>15. No visible body piercings on or off duty and on or off post, males will never be allowed to wear earrings. Ear gauging will be unauthorized.<br><br>16. No dental ornamentation or gold teeth will be authorized.<br><br>17. Soldiers will be authorized to wear authorized ballistic eye wear in garrison.<br><br>18. Officers will be authorized to wear non-subdued rank on their headgear in garrison.<br><br>19. Males will be authorized to carry black umbrella with ASU.</p><p><br></p><p>http://www.armytimes.com/article/20140307/NEWS07/303070021/Army-secretary-approves-new-grooming-uniform-regs<br></p></span></font><div class="pta-link-card"><div class="pta-link-card-picture"><img src="http://www.armytimes.com/graphics/ody/alticon.png"></div><div class="pta-link-card-content"><div class="pta-link-card-title"><a href="http://www.armytimes.com/article/20140307/NEWS07/303070021/Army-secretary-approves-new-grooming-uniform-regs" target="_blank">Army secretary approves new grooming, uniform regs</a></div><div class="pta-link-card-description">
Army Secretary John McHugh on Thursday approved a long-awaited revision to grooming and uniform regulations, according to an Army statement.
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Army Secretary John McHugh on Thursday approved a long-awaited revision to grooming and uniform regulations, according to an Army statement.
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Posted in these groups: 
Professionalism
Regulation
Professionalism Regulation
Edited >1 y ago
Posted 12 y ago
Responses: 184
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#3---AR 670-1 will be a PUNITIVE order in the new regulation. (Lacks more definition and how they plan to enforce it). Should have continued to state something about a pattern of violations pertaining to the same infractions, etc. Not just simply stating it is punitive, which leaves it to interpreting that any/all violations will subject violators to UCMJ or reprimand. Makes it sound very asinine with a looming threat of career ending consequences if you wake up and forget to shave....or anything else on the list.
It appears that this is an attempt to remove the ability for leaders to interpret regulation and address concerns as they arise. Thus, eliminating the leader's responsibility and presenting the leaders a large issue that will mount problems so high that the mission focus will be lost. In my opinion, this harkens back to the two most basic NCO responsibilities....Accomplishment of the Mission and Welfare of the Soldiers. Now, if those were both on the scales of justice, I believe that the new proposed regulation balance will place more value towards welfare of the Soldiers (Their perspective in how they are to tighten up the standards), however not to say that isn't important----However there is no true balance and the issues with it being punitive will out way the intended purpose of these new regulations.
Quite possibly, the real problem is that when some people gain seniority/rank they lose perspective from the lower ranks. Planning in a vacuum without soliciting subordinate feedback prior to implementation generates its own issues. My theory is that we need to get some feedback if time permits and I definitely need to know at a minimum some of the experienced NCOs take on an issue or problem. However, once I get ready to make a decision, I expect everyone to follow through if it is their own decision without question, but I always consider the facts! Point being---Did anyone even try to gain some thoughts and do some cost-benefit analysis on this?
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SFC (Join to see)
Being a paralegal, I have seen many instances where a supervisor will want to recommend to the command that I Soldier receive an Article 15 for not being in compliance with AR 670-1. The issue with that is it has not been punitive, so unless the supervisor corrected them previously and explicitly told them to follow the regulation, it could not be charged. Just like certain portions of AR 600-20 are punitive and if violated, they can be charged, this change will help enforce the rules and make Soldiers more aware.
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MAJ (Join to see)
Excellent point, SFC Toupe! Sounds like the intent is an administrative adjustment in order to aid leaders in pursuing the deficiencies that need pursuing.
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MSG (Join to see)
SSG R.R.,
You assertion that the Army has "lost a crap load of discipline over the last decade and its out of control" is in my opinion highly dubious at best. Most of us been at war repeatedly over the last decade and have served with honor. I've also been in the military since the mid 1990s, and I don't think for a second that soldiers were better when I was a joe than they are now.
I didn't give your post a thumbs down because of the enforcing the regs without bias. I gave it a thumbs down because of this statement:
"I am a proponent for getting back to a well disciplined army across the board."
We have had and do have a well disciplined Army across the board. Making people shave on the weekends, getting rid of sideburns, and banning tattoos is not going to change the discipline or lack thereof in the Army. This type of inherently illogical thinking is probably my biggest dislike in the Army.
You assertion that the Army has "lost a crap load of discipline over the last decade and its out of control" is in my opinion highly dubious at best. Most of us been at war repeatedly over the last decade and have served with honor. I've also been in the military since the mid 1990s, and I don't think for a second that soldiers were better when I was a joe than they are now.
I didn't give your post a thumbs down because of the enforcing the regs without bias. I gave it a thumbs down because of this statement:
"I am a proponent for getting back to a well disciplined army across the board."
We have had and do have a well disciplined Army across the board. Making people shave on the weekends, getting rid of sideburns, and banning tattoos is not going to change the discipline or lack thereof in the Army. This type of inherently illogical thinking is probably my biggest dislike in the Army.
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MSG (Join to see)
Why would a leader give a soldier an article 15 for one instance of not following 670-1? This doesn't make sense to me. For a demonstrated pattern, sure, ex not shaving repeatedly, etc. But for a one time offense? Seems extreme.
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Also on the list I would like them to make it so wives/GF stop wearing their Husbands/BF shirts/PT's/etc. That crap drives me crazy. Specially when they are trying to get out them cause they do not fit. (Take that last one how you want)
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SFC (Join to see)
I would hope you realize that was more of a joke. Although it does drive me nuts seeing wives wearing husbands clothes looking all jackedup. I had a serious response to this earlier.
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CW3 (Join to see)
I realize it was a joke, so was my comment. Tone and inflection is hard to convey in a text-based medium.
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5. Soldiers will be clean shaven on AND off duty (even during leave).
I will be honest; I don't shave everyday. I live off post, and I work a midnight shift as of the moment. I am not going to shave once during the morning just go somewhere or to take my wife to an appointment then shave again when I go to work that night. I think the Army control our lives enough to have some regulations that governs many aspects of our lives. I wish to be left alone to live on my without worry about an off duty version of AR 670-1
8. Males will be prohibited from wearing cosmetics to include nail polish, females may wear cosmetics conservatively, but can only wear nail polish in service, mess, or dress uniforms.
Well no more EMO for some guys I guess.
14. the new regulation will specify civilian clothes standards both on and off duty and both on and off post.
Will there be CPs down town or outside of shopping malls to identify people in civilian clothes who might be soldiers because they are in violation of civilian clothing rules? I guess we have to wait for this on to come into print. I only imagine how ridiculous it will probably be.
I will be honest; I don't shave everyday. I live off post, and I work a midnight shift as of the moment. I am not going to shave once during the morning just go somewhere or to take my wife to an appointment then shave again when I go to work that night. I think the Army control our lives enough to have some regulations that governs many aspects of our lives. I wish to be left alone to live on my without worry about an off duty version of AR 670-1
8. Males will be prohibited from wearing cosmetics to include nail polish, females may wear cosmetics conservatively, but can only wear nail polish in service, mess, or dress uniforms.
Well no more EMO for some guys I guess.
14. the new regulation will specify civilian clothes standards both on and off duty and both on and off post.
Will there be CPs down town or outside of shopping malls to identify people in civilian clothes who might be soldiers because they are in violation of civilian clothing rules? I guess we have to wait for this on to come into print. I only imagine how ridiculous it will probably be.
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CW3 (Join to see)
Not only do I live off-post, but I'm now a Reserve officer when I used to be active duty enlisted. If I'm not on IDT/ADT/AT/etc...the only way to find out I'm military is if I have to go on post for anything.
So if it's the weekend, and I don't feel like shaving, and I know the only place I'm going is taekwondo class on Saturday morning..... then the razor and I are not going to see each other until Monday morning when it's time to go to my civilian job.
So if it's the weekend, and I don't feel like shaving, and I know the only place I'm going is taekwondo class on Saturday morning..... then the razor and I are not going to see each other until Monday morning when it's time to go to my civilian job.
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SSG (ret) William Martin
I am very weary of people who ask me if I am in the military. I don't trust people I do not know.
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on #2: The terms faddish, conservative, inconspicuous, unsightly already have definitions. What's wrong with opening a dictionary? Oh yeah no matter what they can still apply those definitions based on their own opinions.
on #4: Side burns that don't come below the top of the ear look really bad.
on # 5: Everywhere I have been the shortest recall was a 2 hour period. Even taking my time shaving with a razor and shaving cream it takes 10 minutes. I also keep my electric charged just in case.
on #8 WHOO HOO double standards are still enforceable! Not that it was a huge problem before with males wearing makeup.
on #10 Hey I have an idea...lets hand out a bunch of waivers to swell our ranks to meet manpower demands then later on punish those people we gave waivers to! No one with a face neck or hand tatts should have been allowed in the Army in the first place. But our leaders in their infinite wisdom allowed it, now want them out, and the real reason above any others: to save money on personnel costs.
on #11: We really need to have a regulation change for people to enforce something that should have been happening anyway? Let's make this clear: if you have been told ONCE by ANY NCO or OFFICER EVER that you are not to walk and eat/smoke/talk on cell phone at the same time (which should have been just about everyone at one time) if you continued to do so you could already be punished for disobeying a lawful order.
on #12: Pretty sure the ACU unifrom has instructions on the tags that say: DO NOT DRY CLEAN OR PRESS...following instructions on the tags of any garment will usually help them to last longer...if someone likes replacing their uniforms more often though I don't see why we shouldn't let them support local businesses.
on #13: So the bag I use to carry either my APFT uniform or ACU uniform in is going to get me punished now if I need to throw it over my shoulder in order to have continued use of both my hands? Why do I use a bright red bag for this purpose? It was on clearance and is made by a great company with things like breathability of materials in mind, being on clearance red was the only color left.
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Cpl Glynis Sakowicz
You are actually going there??? Ok, this is from a WM (Woman Marine) Point of view, mind you, so it probably has little merit across the board, but this is my experience...<div> First, women Marines have to wear RED nail polish if they wear any, and RED lipstick as well, which is why so few of us wear any.</div><div> We have to keep our hair up above the collar, without any visible pins, decorations or those annoying fly-away bits dangling down, which is pretty much impossible for most of us, thus the large group that have short hair.</div><div> We have to have our uniform purse, that has to be worn with the strap over the left shoulder, and that sucker is pretty large and heavy, trust me.</div><div> We had to, until just a few years ago, wear a blasted Girdle under our uniforms... that was something that we will not miss, trust me, but that was part of our "Double Standard."</div><div> The thing is, we were told to look feminine, wear simple makeup, and still do our jobs. Ever try to change a truck tire with red finger nail polish? The cursing alone would make most people blink in shock, trust me...</div><div> Sure, most of us were not as strong physically, but I know that most WMs can blow half the male marines out of the water on their rifle range scores, so I always thought it was pretty even in the long run.</div><div> This double standard is alive and well, and probably always will be, because we are not the same. We can, given the right training and the right PT time, accomplish the same things, but we weren't raised to do those things, so it will take time for women to get those muscles trained and strengthened. </div><div> </div>
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CW3 (Join to see)
Corporal Sakowicz, would you mind sending me a private message? I'm coming to Houston this weekend for a conference, and I'm bringing my wife with me. While I'm in meetings all day Saturday, she's looking for things to do and see downtown.
I wanted to get your advice on things to tell her to go do and/or see. We're staying at the Crowne Plaza on Smith Street, and we can rent a car if we need to. We're arriving on Friday evening, and leaving on Sunday afternoon, so she's pretty much got Saturday during the day.
I wanted to get your advice on things to tell her to go do and/or see. We're staying at the Crowne Plaza on Smith Street, and we can rent a car if we need to. We're arriving on Friday evening, and leaving on Sunday afternoon, so she's pretty much got Saturday during the day.
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SSG (ret) William Martin
I always have a shaving kit and maybe an extra belt and socks for those just incase incidents.
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Like everything in the Army, this changes will have its pros and cons. But my favorite one is the regulation on Tattoos, is not just about Them being offensive or extremist, is all about looking professional and how Soldiers like to push regulations and standards to the limits. That's what makes higher leadership to make those regulations and standards more strict so they can maintain control of them
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SSG (ret) William Martin
I don't judge a person by their tattoos unless those tattoos are extremist or racist and then I will have some perceptions of that person.
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SFC Billy Webb
I agree with you to a point, I will use me as an example I have two sleeves and my legs are tattooed as well. Ok when I do PT you can see them BUT when I wear ACUs you can't see them at all. The Only one that you can see is my wedding ring that is tattooed ONLY if i dont have my wedding ring on... I know when co workers that are Military and Civilian see me for the first time in short sleeve shirts and what not, I always get the same response Wow I didn't know you had all those tattoos. My answer to them is always the Same, Does that change the way you view my work ethic and how I conduct my self as a Senior NCO. There answer is always similar No not at all... I will say neck tattoos and huge hand tattoos are not a good look. I also didn't get sleeves until I knew that the Army was my career path and I was a SSG.
My wife is an active duty SSG and she has a sleeve as well with many other tattoos and she gets the same responses that I get when people see her for the first time.
These are just my opinions
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SGT (Join to see)
I may be thinking too hard but are they going to do medical screenings during PCS to denote tattoos? If PV2 Snuffy gets a tattoo during his PCS leave from AIT or his last duty station how am I to know he's not grand fathered? What about me? If i extend my half sleeve to my fingers during PCS leave how would my unit know that it wasn't prior to the reg?
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These are the exact word for word "changes" that army times posted about in Summer 2012. Like literally straight from the article. Obviously nobody knows what the changes will be exactly. I would best a lot of the MILPERS concerning 670-1 are just being added, BDU and Class A stuff is being removed, and the tattoo policies are being adjusted. It's not like the entire AR is being rewritten...
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SFC (Join to see)
unless it takes effect on october 1st, Class A's would have to be included as they're still authorized
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Suspended Profile
By far the worst is the sideburns above the ear! I think we will look pretty funny walking around like that unless you keep a shaved head. I honestly can't
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The first cut of that AR 670-1 came out almost a year and a half ago, and it still has not been approved. The reason...legality. It would be a far stretch to tell a Soldier that they have to be shaven while they are on leave if they are at their house off post. Put it in this context, the military cannot tell you, you have to register your weapons on post if you never bring them on post, that is because there is no such thing as military authority in the civilian community. Now if you are on post that is something different completely.
I would not worry about this too much. Three years ago SMA wanted to make business casual the standard for wear off duty, it was nixed (if you are going to set a uniform, you have to provide special pay to accommodate the uniform). Much of this will go the same way. Dont stress until someone tells you what the new rules are.
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SFC Matthew Parker
SGM,
What changes? oh you mean the dusting off of local post policy from Ft. Devens 1985, Ft. Stewart 2000 and so on. I stop soldiers ON POST with saggy pants and torn clothing and tell them to pull them up and patch them up. Off post they look like civilians and since they look like fools instead of soldiers why bother.
It's because of lazy NCO's and lax standards the reg was changed to begin with.
I think the "changes" are silly but I'm concerned the CSM and COS felt it necessary to make them to begin with. As a NCO I take the appearance of my soldiers personally and I don't like being told by the leadership in DC Pvt Snuffy isn't up to their standards.
What changes? oh you mean the dusting off of local post policy from Ft. Devens 1985, Ft. Stewart 2000 and so on. I stop soldiers ON POST with saggy pants and torn clothing and tell them to pull them up and patch them up. Off post they look like civilians and since they look like fools instead of soldiers why bother.
It's because of lazy NCO's and lax standards the reg was changed to begin with.
I think the "changes" are silly but I'm concerned the CSM and COS felt it necessary to make them to begin with. As a NCO I take the appearance of my soldiers personally and I don't like being told by the leadership in DC Pvt Snuffy isn't up to their standards.
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My two cents, for what it's worth, most of the proposed changes have been put out in the Army Times. My opinion is the Army Times is not much better than PNN(private news network.) Also, no reason to get bent out of shape over "proposed" changes. Wait until the update is finally signed and put out to the Troops and then determine what has changed and what new standards we need to enforce as NCO's.
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I have had a change in heart recently about this. Previously I did not see anything wrong with growing your beard while on leave. However, in a world where social networking and websites are the norm; how do you tell your Soldiers they need to be doing the right thing even while they are not wearing the uniform, when they can easily access your FB or LinkedIn or RP page and see you doing the opposite of what you are telling them?
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MSG (Join to see)
I don't allow any people in my current unit to become a FB friend for just that reason.
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I agree with the original post, If you are on leave you should be able to relax and be comfortable in your own personal setting.
as long as you are not acting out and violating any UCMJ, Legal, or disciplinary guidelines, why restrict a soldiers leave?
as long as you are not acting out and violating any UCMJ, Legal, or disciplinary guidelines, why restrict a soldiers leave?
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