Posted on Nov 3, 2015
Are there any other RP Members who were denied the GI BILL due to VEAP?
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http://www.benefits.va.gov/gibill/veap.asp
When I entered the service I had no idea I would NOT be eligible for the GI Bill. My father got the GI bill and suggested I join to be able to use it for college too.
Unfortunately, I found out after joining that those who joined any branch of the Military from 1977 to 1985 were NOT eligible for the GI Bill....the government took it away! Instead, the only way we could possible get help for college was through VEAP. This is where we had to contribute our own money and the government doubled it...but you could only contribute up to $2000 per year.
I'm wondering if any one else on RP fell under this group....and I'm wondering if there is something that can be done.
While I was active duty, I went to night school and school on Saturdays and managed to get two Associates degrees. After getting out I used the money I contributed to VEAP and got a BFA....but still I feel like I was jilted out of something i should have been eligible for.
I went through a gazillion phone calls, but got no where. It seems it is what it is....BUT I feel it is totally unfair.
All Military after 1985 were given the GI bill.... How is this right and or fair?
When I entered the service I had no idea I would NOT be eligible for the GI Bill. My father got the GI bill and suggested I join to be able to use it for college too.
Unfortunately, I found out after joining that those who joined any branch of the Military from 1977 to 1985 were NOT eligible for the GI Bill....the government took it away! Instead, the only way we could possible get help for college was through VEAP. This is where we had to contribute our own money and the government doubled it...but you could only contribute up to $2000 per year.
I'm wondering if any one else on RP fell under this group....and I'm wondering if there is something that can be done.
While I was active duty, I went to night school and school on Saturdays and managed to get two Associates degrees. After getting out I used the money I contributed to VEAP and got a BFA....but still I feel like I was jilted out of something i should have been eligible for.
I went through a gazillion phone calls, but got no where. It seems it is what it is....BUT I feel it is totally unfair.
All Military after 1985 were given the GI bill.... How is this right and or fair?
GI Bill
Education
Edited 10 y ago
Posted 10 y ago
Responses: 43
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"Given" is a misnomer. Contributed to, and reaped the benefits of is a more accurate statement.
I fall under two categories of the GI Bill. First was the Chap 30, where I contributed $1200 ($100/month for first 12 months) and in turn the government "matched" at a sizable amount. But it had an expiration 10 years after my EAS. The second was the Chap 33, where because of the timing of my EAS I qualify for 60% tuition coverage (15 years from EAS).
Each of the "GI Bills" or "VEAPS" over the years have had advantages or disadvantages depending on how you look at them. My father initially joined in 1956, but had broken time, and his initial benefits expired while he was still serving. I pay out of pocket for my advanced degree, regardless of which GI Bill I use just because of the timing I served.
It's not about "right and fair." It's a product of how the laws were set up when they were enacted.
I fall under two categories of the GI Bill. First was the Chap 30, where I contributed $1200 ($100/month for first 12 months) and in turn the government "matched" at a sizable amount. But it had an expiration 10 years after my EAS. The second was the Chap 33, where because of the timing of my EAS I qualify for 60% tuition coverage (15 years from EAS).
Each of the "GI Bills" or "VEAPS" over the years have had advantages or disadvantages depending on how you look at them. My father initially joined in 1956, but had broken time, and his initial benefits expired while he was still serving. I pay out of pocket for my advanced degree, regardless of which GI Bill I use just because of the timing I served.
It's not about "right and fair." It's a product of how the laws were set up when they were enacted.
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Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS
Sgt Kelli Mays - I'm familiar with the Hazelwood Act. I joined from San Antonio TX, and was a TX resident all through my military career.
The issue with any Social Program, which is what all Dept of Veterans Affairs programs are, is that they must evolve with the times. The $1200 for $14400 when I joined wouldn't have paid for 1 year of schooling, let alone 4 (3). That's why they had to come up with Chap 33 (Post 9/11). Post 9/11 has it's own issues, and it will change. There is no perfect (benefits) program. It's not about fairness. It's about doing the research when you take employment, whether it is civilian or military and gauging whether the juice is worth the squeeze.
I saw tuition assistance get cut pretty heavily right after I got out. Doesn't make it less fair. Just makes it a reality of the program. We're seeing the retirement program change in the next couple years. Who knows what we'll see next...
The issue with any Social Program, which is what all Dept of Veterans Affairs programs are, is that they must evolve with the times. The $1200 for $14400 when I joined wouldn't have paid for 1 year of schooling, let alone 4 (3). That's why they had to come up with Chap 33 (Post 9/11). Post 9/11 has it's own issues, and it will change. There is no perfect (benefits) program. It's not about fairness. It's about doing the research when you take employment, whether it is civilian or military and gauging whether the juice is worth the squeeze.
I saw tuition assistance get cut pretty heavily right after I got out. Doesn't make it less fair. Just makes it a reality of the program. We're seeing the retirement program change in the next couple years. Who knows what we'll see next...
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Sgt Kelli Mays
Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS - I contributed to VEAP so was able to take advantage...I put the maximum amount in every year.
I was not able nor offered to transfer my VEAP to MGIB.
I was not able nor offered to transfer my VEAP to MGIB.
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Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS
Sgt Kelli Mays - And I was not able to invest the extra $500 into Chap 33 for the extra 12 months for Post 9/11 GIBILL. The guys who got out before me didn't get to use that option at all. It's a product of the eras in which we served.
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Sgt Kelli Mays
Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS - oh well. Some of us entered at a good time with good benefits and some of us didn't. Luck of the straw I suppose.
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VEAP was the worst deal ever. Yeah, I knew that's what I had, but I thought then, and do now, that is sucks. Congress should correct it retroactively and give us all the same GI Bill benefits that every other group of veterans has gotten since the GI Bill was established.
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PO2 Nick Burke
But they won't...... There are too many freebee handouts to give. Vets continue to be treated worse than illegals.
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I served 78-82, so I also fell under VEAP. It wasn't very good, but I still thought I'd be getting $2 for every $1 I put in. After I got out, I went to use it, and that was where I found the biggest drawback - you could only withdraw at the rate you put in! IIRC, there was an upper limit on the amount I could put in each month - $100? Anyway, you got it back at $300/month if you put in $100/month. There was no way to take it back as a lump sum for expenses such as tuition. At the time, I was making enough money to cover living expenses, but I had no savings, so I couldn't pay the tuition bill. I was so upset about that particular wrinkle that I just pulled all my money out, losing the government match, and walked away in disgust.
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I enlisted in DEP in 1984 and my only option was VEAP. Before I actually started basic and still in high school, I was given the option of keeping VEAP or getting the then new Montgomery GI Bill. The dollar amounts were about the same but the contributions were different as well as what you could recover if not used for education. I believe VEAP was a total contribution of $2700 + $5400 (200% matching) and then the "Army College Fund" which was $15,000. The MGIB was a total of $1200 in contriubutions and then about $20,000 provided (unsure since I didn't use this). The VEAP had the option to get some money back and MGIB did not. Granted the contribution to VEAP was higher, but I ended up getting some money back even after going to school for four years. Must be the VA math... lol
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TSgt Donnie Meaders
Yes sir, VA math I believe is based on "common core" standards because it sure does not add up!
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Sergeant Mays, First thanks for your service. I also enlisted under VEAP. I had no benefits until I went to Iraq for operation lraqi Freedom. I earned my MA with tuition assistance. Having served for 5 years post-911 I received post-911 VA benefits and am now working on a doctorate. Had I not stayed in for 30 years I would have been ineligible for any benefits under VEAP. I agree with you it is not right but our group, who enlisted under VEAP, received the worst educational benefits this country ever offered to veterans. I am glad the government fixed the education system. Unfortunately if we stayed for our first term and only earned VEAP, we reap the benefits of Department of Defense cutbacks after Vietnam. I am sorry that you, like hundreds of thousands of others, got the short end of the stick. As far as I can tell there there is nothing that we can do about those benefits. I was married and could not afford the $100 a month minimum and so figured I had no educational benefits whatsoever. Unfortunately, I was still on active duty when 9/11 happened. Because I served until 2008 I became eligible post-911 educational benefits. I applaud you for earning your MFA.
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I agree ... I was in the same boat ... Joined in 1985 and left in 1989.
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I signed up in '83, went active duty in '84, fell under VEAP. I made the maximum contribution to VEAP, entitling me to the full $8200, spread out over about three years. No, I didn't spend it all in one place.
You are correct; you only get the veteran benefit under which you signed. About three years ago, someone decided to re-visit the VEAP veterans, and the VA offered VRAP for a limited time, to a limited number of eligible veterans. Any veteran between ages 35 and 60 who had not completed his first Bachelor degree was eligible for a one-year benefit toward a degree in a high-demand occupation. I was already working on another associate degree, so I used my VRAP to earn yet another associate degree. Now, I have three associate degrees and two certificates and I'm most of the way toward earning another certificate (I don't plan to finish that one). One of these days, I'd like to earn a Bachelor degree, though.
You are correct; you only get the veteran benefit under which you signed. About three years ago, someone decided to re-visit the VEAP veterans, and the VA offered VRAP for a limited time, to a limited number of eligible veterans. Any veteran between ages 35 and 60 who had not completed his first Bachelor degree was eligible for a one-year benefit toward a degree in a high-demand occupation. I was already working on another associate degree, so I used my VRAP to earn yet another associate degree. Now, I have three associate degrees and two certificates and I'm most of the way toward earning another certificate (I don't plan to finish that one). One of these days, I'd like to earn a Bachelor degree, though.
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Sgt Kelli Mays
PO3 Richard Alexander I'll have to look VRAP up. I've not heard of this program...though you said it was limited time. I wonder why they do that? offer it only for a limited time....and I bet they didn't go out of their way to contact VET under VEAP to let them know. Bummer.
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PO3 Richard Alexander
Sgt Kelli Mays - VRAP was a weird program in many ways. Normally, once the military or VA has paid the agreed obligation, it forgets about the veteran. It's odd that Congress would revisit us, so many years after their obligation had passed. Of course, the national sentiment was ripe for it. VRAP was part of the VOW to Hire Heroes Act of 2011. At a time when concern ran high regarding unemployment in general, and unemployment among veterans in particular, this program drew attention to us. I heard about it through my state workforce commission, where I was registered as an unemployed veteran. You can bet that I jumped on it as fast as I could!
The program was also strange for the period that it covered. Rather than beginning and ending at a logical division, it began (as I recall) in a Fall month and ended in March. In fact, there was talk of extending the program so that veterans who were using it to cover their tuition could finish their semester. Why would a tuition program end coverage in the middle of a semester?
Fortunately, I had my timing planned out enough in advance that I had no problem completing a year of college before the program ended. In fact, the program could not have worked better for me, as it came exactly at the right time for me to finish off two associate degrees within that year.
The program was also strange for the period that it covered. Rather than beginning and ending at a logical division, it began (as I recall) in a Fall month and ended in March. In fact, there was talk of extending the program so that veterans who were using it to cover their tuition could finish their semester. Why would a tuition program end coverage in the middle of a semester?
Fortunately, I had my timing planned out enough in advance that I had no problem completing a year of college before the program ended. In fact, the program could not have worked better for me, as it came exactly at the right time for me to finish off two associate degrees within that year.
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I agree. This was a total flop that went under the heading of "Benefits". The VEAP program was a sham! Why would I want to put money into a program that had a CAP of $2,000.00? As an E-1, my funds were limited and was used up usually on food. My unit in Germany was only allowed to go to the chow hall 1 time a day, the rest of my meals were out of pocket! I had no money to put into VEAP!
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Hello Sgt Mays, I joined in 1977 and fell under VEAP, I contributed for about 5 to 7 yrs and then stopped, when the new GI Bill was introduced in tried to switch but because I my contributions were gapped I needed to bring them up to date before I could switch and I just couldn't afford the large one time payment so I basically had to pay my own way through college.
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Sgt Kelli Mays
I went in the Navy in 1992, so I got the MGIB but converted it to the Post 9/11 GI Bill.
I went in the Navy in 1992, so I got the MGIB but converted it to the Post 9/11 GI Bill.
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