Posted on May 2, 2017
As a fairly new NCO, am I supposed to give my soldiers initial and monthly counsellings (PSG is asking for monthly)?
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I'll take this further. Write an initial counseling and make it a good one. Write about what you expect from your Soldiers. Get the help of your seniors if you need it. Give that counseling to all of your Soldiers from here on. Mass counseling on this one is ok. You should have one standard and one set of expectations for all your Soldiers, so have one counseling that reflects it. You may have to tweak it in certain cases, but no need to reinvent the wheel every time you get a new Soldier. As mentioned prior, don't just read it and sign. Actually talk to the Soldiers and elaborate on what the counseling is saying.
For the monthly counselings, sit down with the Soldier and a BLANK 4187. Fill it out by hand. Discuss with the Soldier about his strengths, weaknesses, concerns, and anything else (education, promotion potential, past and future ops are all important talking points). It doesn't have to be line-for-line, just enough to capture the conversation. Discuss the plan of action together. Both of you sign it.
Then, get on your computer and type up a more refined copy. Go over it again, sign the new one, and put both counseling in his/her packet. This process seems like a lot of work but it's not and it does many things. First, it's how counseling are supposed to be done, but rarely done with the often high optempo. It gives the Soldier a sense of participation in his own development which is important. With that handwritten counseling done, the other one almost writes itself. Lastly in a more selfish aspect, it will make you look good when you take the Soldier to a board. Not only are you doing your job to counsel, but you are taking time and care to do it the right way.
Positive counseling: As stated, never done enough these days but it is a easy and impactful way to reward your Soldiers.
Negative counseling: A one-way counseling, but still take the time to elaborate and discuss.
You can counsel a Soldier for ANYTHING: Buying a car, getting married, getting divorced, having a baby, attending college. Another way to look at counseling is this: a counseling form is proof that a conversation took place between you and the Soldier. If you have a concern for your Soldier about something, put it on paper. It's not a negative thing. If your catch wind that your Soldier is doing something dangerous or at least something that
He shouldn't be doing, counsel him and express your concerns. If he does it anyway and something happens, you have proof that you advised him not to.
Save your event-oriented counseling. If you have one Soldier who was late to PT, clear the administrative data and save it. If you have another Soldier late to PT later down the road, all you have to do is fill out the top and change the facts to reflect the situation. Don't keep this on a gov't computer. Keep a file on your personal computer or in your email so it isn't lost. This practice will come in handy later when you start writing things like awards, NCOERs, and so on.
Hope this helps. Best of luck!
For the monthly counselings, sit down with the Soldier and a BLANK 4187. Fill it out by hand. Discuss with the Soldier about his strengths, weaknesses, concerns, and anything else (education, promotion potential, past and future ops are all important talking points). It doesn't have to be line-for-line, just enough to capture the conversation. Discuss the plan of action together. Both of you sign it.
Then, get on your computer and type up a more refined copy. Go over it again, sign the new one, and put both counseling in his/her packet. This process seems like a lot of work but it's not and it does many things. First, it's how counseling are supposed to be done, but rarely done with the often high optempo. It gives the Soldier a sense of participation in his own development which is important. With that handwritten counseling done, the other one almost writes itself. Lastly in a more selfish aspect, it will make you look good when you take the Soldier to a board. Not only are you doing your job to counsel, but you are taking time and care to do it the right way.
Positive counseling: As stated, never done enough these days but it is a easy and impactful way to reward your Soldiers.
Negative counseling: A one-way counseling, but still take the time to elaborate and discuss.
You can counsel a Soldier for ANYTHING: Buying a car, getting married, getting divorced, having a baby, attending college. Another way to look at counseling is this: a counseling form is proof that a conversation took place between you and the Soldier. If you have a concern for your Soldier about something, put it on paper. It's not a negative thing. If your catch wind that your Soldier is doing something dangerous or at least something that
He shouldn't be doing, counsel him and express your concerns. If he does it anyway and something happens, you have proof that you advised him not to.
Save your event-oriented counseling. If you have one Soldier who was late to PT, clear the administrative data and save it. If you have another Soldier late to PT later down the road, all you have to do is fill out the top and change the facts to reflect the situation. Don't keep this on a gov't computer. Keep a file on your personal computer or in your email so it isn't lost. This practice will come in handy later when you start writing things like awards, NCOERs, and so on.
Hope this helps. Best of luck!
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PFC Bradley Campbell
so are these 4087's in live PDF form? where you can write(type it up) and do all the cool spell check on it? and get signatures and hard copies for all involved? after all, we are in the Information Age. and get a scanned copy or a high resolution pic to keep on your laptop/computer to use as backup. IF regulations allow this.
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SFC (Join to see)
Yes. There are fillable PDF forms available that can be digitally signed. This is what I go to if I don't have printing capability, or I have to email the counseling somewhere and don't have a scanner.
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The "book answer" is absolutely yes you should do an initial and monthly counselings on every troop assigned to you. You should also do other counselings as needed. For instance, when that Troop does something really well and distinguishes himself from his peers. It's also a great idea to counsel that Troop when she gets married or has a baby. Why? Because those are significant life events that bring lots of challenges very fast. A good counseling can identify those potential challenges and resources to help manage them. Basically, I'm saying that there is really not a bad reason to counsel your troops. But, I think that too many NCOs have gotten wrapped around the wheel with it and they limit counselings to filling out a DA4856. Not every counseling session has to involve paperwork. But, you must be involved with your troops. That can involve a conversation at the smoke pit. It can involve a discussion over lunch. Basically, I'm saying that there are lots of ways to counsel your troops. Some stuff does absolutely need to go on paper, but if you're doing your job and mentoring your troops, the paperwork is easy. Just don't do the paperwork so that you can "check the block."
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As everyone else already answered your question, I'll throw some advice out there. Once a month set aside two days. One day to prepare your counseling forms (you may have to use your own off time) and another to counsel (workday). Try to put all the scheduled sessions on your training calendar on days that fit into your unit schedule.
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When I was promoted to SGT, I wore the rank for about 9 months before I attended PLDC. I had some awesome NCO's myself, so I had guidance on this issue. (This was in 2001) I got a digital copy of FM 22-100 and tried to follow the guidelines with a tweak here or there as it pertained to my MOS. I became pretty proficient at keeping notes on my troopers throughout the month so that I wouldn't just be BS'ing my way through the counseling sessions. Getting proficient at this task helped me greatly when I finally went to PLDC. But, counseling isn't just a piece of paper that you fill out every month or if Joe screws up. Counseling is an on-going process that includes training, mentoring, corrections, and at-a-boys. I hope that something I have said can help you. Thanks for your service.
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Yes , it shows that you are interested in their progression and that way you'll become a better leader.
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PSG request is a minimum requirement. Nothing wrong with going above and beyond, unless he/she says otherwise.
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You do the Initial when you first receive the Soldiers. Then, do Monthly Counselings.
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