Posted on Dec 6, 2018
Joe Collins
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Currently an MS2 with a 3.2 gpa and a 240 pt score. Not on scholarship or in the guard but looking to join or receive a scholarship. Cadre told me I would be competitive for a scholarship but if I don’t get it then it’s to late to sign up for SMP program (basic training summer date). Also if I do the guard/ complete basic and don’t get a contract then I’m stuck in guard. Should I go for scholarship or risk the guard. Asked cadre and he said I will have no problem contracting in future.
I’m asking this because our top rated MS3 just got declined a contract. If he got declined then why will they contract me junior year after basic
Posted in these groups: Thcapm08l9 ROTC
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Responses: 28
COL John McClellan
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Edited >1 y ago
Hard to answer without knowing more about the school, and the current resources going to scholarships in Cadet Command - but I would tell you to trust your Cadre and meet any/all deadlines they give you for applications, medical exams, etc. etc. Keep your grades up and try to get that PT score to 270+ As a PMS, I had a good deal of latitude on 2yr-3yr on-campus scholarships and what I would have been assessing is: intelligence, character and desire! Live the Army Values and never, never, never quit! Avoid sentences such as "stuck in the Guard..." Good Luck!!
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COL Dana Hampton
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It disappoints me to read your views that being in the National Guard is some sort of a bad thing. I was a 3-year scholarship cadet. Earned an Active Duty commission and after 4-years of Active Duty switched to the Reserves and and the to the Guard. After 33 years of successful service leading at the platoon, battery and battalion levels, I retired with nearly half that time serving on Active Duty and 3 overseas deployments. The Guard is an operational force and is used as such. The sooner you realize we are a Total Force to defend this Nation, the better we all will be as an Army.

Service in any component is honorable if served well and faithfully. Take care of your Soldiers and your mission, the rest will take care of itself.
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CPT Zachary Brooks
CPT Zachary Brooks
>1 y
Sir, the Guard was considered a joke and looked down upon by some of my peers in ROTC. I myself made my career in the Guard, so I feel down that that was the view they had.
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COL Dana Hampton
COL Dana Hampton
>1 y
We over come these stereotypes by our performance. Some of my best OERs came from rating by Active Duty senior Officers I worked for when mobilized. They saw that Guard officers are every bit as capable and knowledgeable as AD peers.

As Guard / Reserve Officers we are part of the Total Force Army. The more our Active Component peers work with us, the more these stereotypes will fade.

Keep the faith and always do your best for Soldiers and the mission.CPT Zachary Brooks
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CPT Zachary Brooks
CPT Zachary Brooks
>1 y
COL Dana Hampton - Sir, this was my experience while deployed under an active LTC in Kuwait. He initially felt poorly of Guard soldiers, but began to feel much better about us by seeing my work ethic and performance while assigned to his unit.
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COL Jon Thompson
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If you were in my office asking about this, there are 2 questions I would ask you . First, what is your goal after graduation (active duty, Reserve, or Guard). Second, what concerns do you have in paying for college. My default recommendation is for you to compete for a 2-year scholarship. This scholarship option keeps all of your options open for commissioning. If you enlist and become an SMP cadet, your scholarship options limit you to reserve forces duty. If that is your commissioning goal, that would work. Also in many cases, combining state provided NG benefits with an ROTC scholarship becomes the biggest amount of financial benefits you can receive. If you enlist in the NG, there are only a few MOSs that allow you to complete basic and AIT in the same summer. Most others would require you to miss a semester. So you have to look at that as well. I would not worry about what the top-rated MS3 cadet encountered. There are numerous reasons why someone could be refused a contract, many of these you would not have any visibility on to protect privacy rights. Base your decision solely on what you want to do. Again, my recommendation is to go for the scholarship.
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As a non-scholarship ROTC cadet, should I pursue an ROTC scholarship or join the Guard (and pursue SMP)?
Lt Col Jim Coe
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I didn't get an AFROTC scholarship until my Jr year. One of the best deals ever. Recommend you apply for a scholarship. If there's more than one Service's ROTC programs near you, then apply to all of them. Don't be inhibited by the record of others that did or did not get a scholarship. You don't know their entire record in most cases.

My daughter spent about 10 years in the Air Guard. It was a good experience for her overall. Being "stuck in the Guard" may not be a bad thing. Except for basic and ait it shouldn't interrupt your schooling. Be sure to talk to Guard recruiters from the Army and Air Force before choosing a unit.
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1LT Executive Officer
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Just continue on as a non scholarship cadet. You’ll contract at the beginning of your MS3 year and You still get to compete for active duty. I’d recommend you bring your APFT score up to increase the likelihood of AD.
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1LT Christopher Gonzales
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I went Guard to AD. I think that it gives you a valuable perspective that's worth it. You get your education paid for and you have drill. Once I went E to Cadet, my unit placed me in charge of things and pushed me to learn what makes an Officer an effective resource for Soldiers and not the single point of failure because he or she thinks everything goes through them.

Going through the Guard and getting that small taste really helps you see perspectives from junior Enlisted and NCOs, people you are going to rate.

Any exposure you can get that helps you understand not just rank structures and regs, but what's important, right now, to Soldiers and how to solve that is worth the time.
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LTC Michael Brantley
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At lot depends on the school and the State you are in. When I was an APMS I could never recommend my students take a 2 yr scholarship. In my state the guard tuition reimbursement was much better for my students plus it gave them additional experience and TIS for pay purposes. Having good Guard and Reserve units in the area helped. Way too many variables to give you absolute recommendations.
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MAJ T. W.
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If you do SMP, that is fine. Just do not accept a reserve scholarship. You will not be able to go active. Also, your SMP years will add on to your time in service when you retire.
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CPT Lawrence Cable
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OK, I think your big concern is that it restricts you to a Guard commission, which isn't true. While you can contract for a guaranteed Reserve Commission, you don't have to do that even if you did enlist in the Guard and you just compete with everyone else for the Active Duty slots. On the plus side, have an MOS exempts you from the first two years, not much help in your case, gives you a lot of experience as enlisted and as a SMP, you get GI Bill and Drill Pay, plus some states add a kicker for in state schools, and when you commission, you should have over two years Time in Service toward pay. So if you are looking for College money, enlisting in the Guard is the probably a surer route than competing for the scholarships. A ROTC Scholarship does not guarantee an Active Duty commission, but a Guard SMP isn't restricted to going just National Guard either.
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MAJ T. W.
MAJ T. W.
>1 y
SMP is not the same as accepting a GRFD scholarship. If he takes a GRFD scholarship, he is stuck in the Guard. He he is a junior, he can enlist in the Guard and sign a nonscholarship contract and will be exempt from IET. He can then commission active.
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CPT Lawrence Cable
CPT Lawrence Cable
>1 y
I wasn't very clear on that, but yes, SMP is not the same as GRFD or even DEDNG and he can compete with the rest of the cadets for Active Duty slots as long as he did not contract for either scholarship program.
My experience with SMP''s were all enlisted and MOS qualified before College and were attending school on GI Bill, State Tuition Assistance, and Drill Pay. Having an MOS allowed them to skip the first two years of ROTC and join as a non scholarship cadet as an SMP. As an OCS Officer, it always seemed a lot more sensible than the OCS hassle.
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Capt Daniel Goodman
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naval_Postgraduate_School

This is the Navy version, I had a serious recommend for my masters there full-time when I'd been in, I couldn't get that one, either, I'm afraid...they have a fully online Ph.D. in systems science you might also care to glance at...you'd likely need to do a couple of tours perfectly to have a serious chance here or at AFIT, I merely mention them, as many generally don't even know they exist....
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