Posted on Feb 11, 2022
SPC 11 C Indirect Fire A Infantryman
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We just got a new Corporal who recently reclassed to mortars. He’s highly motivated (hooah), and during a training event, we had a disagreement over how to perform large deflections. He told me to "drop," but the fire mission he was calling would’ve put us outside the safety fan during a live fire and could have potentially caused injuries to other elements participating in the exercise.

Now, I understand and respect his rank, but I’ve been a mortarman longer and currently serve as the Gun 2 gunner. The fact is—he was wrong. He just became an 11C, and when he wouldn’t listen to correction or reason, I told him (admittedly out of frustration) to eat a bag of d***s.

I’m curious to hear what others think—especially when it comes to situations where rank clashes with experience and safety is on the line.
Edited 5 mo ago
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Responses: 358
Cpl Landing Support Marine
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Was his order contrary to regulations and unsafe to you or anyone else? If so you have a right to RESPECTFULLY refuse it on grounds that it is unlawful. If not both of those things, then you were wrong for not obeying. You will always be wrong ordering unlawful punishments that fall under hazing, and as per regulations you are authorized to RESPECTFULLY refuse that as well, although it may not be the wisest course of action. Under no circumstance is it ever correct to tell a person in a higher rank or billet to eat a bag of dicks. You are still in the military and are still required to be tactful. As for contradicting an incorrect but lawful order, this too can be done tactfully. A few things to remember:
1. Make sure it is a one on one conversation: nobody responds well to public criticism and if possible, will almost always immediately dig in and go on the defensive.
2. Be right: make sure that you actually are correct, there is nothing worse than making a big to-do and then finding out you were the idiot all along.
3. Phrase it neutrally: phrase it in such a way that it sounds like something he wants to learn rather than something he got wrong.
4. If the corrected leader still refuses and the mistake is not endangering anyone, let him fall on his sword so he can learn the learn the lesson. Don't gloat when things go wrong, because that breeds resentment and makes your life harder with very little benefit. The goal isn't to be the one who was correct, it is to help him learn the lesson.

While both of you could be brought up on charges under the UCMJ, If I was your Cpl, I would use EMI, either writing the regulations broken repeatedly or writing an essay on how to better handle the situation. I say this in case you are ever in this situation yourself, now you have lawful ways of handling it. Just remember that ALL punishment should be directed at correcting the problem with maximum efficiency.
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SGT Matt Squires
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yes, you were absolutely in the wrong. As an 11C NCO, if I had caught you telling a CPL to eat a bag of dicks, you would have been smoked until I got tired or the PSG told me to let you up. You do what the NCO told you to do and then pull him aside later and explain to him where he was wrong. It would have been the correct thing to do.
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MSgt Retired
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Oh, Lordy, I was pretty easygoing, but even I wouldn't have tolerated that! I don't care how much you might like or dislike a person; if you are military and they outrank you even if it is only one pay grade, and especially if they are in a leadership position, you show respect and telling them that is not respectful. I was TDY and worked in a shop when I was an E-7, but the NCOIC was an E-5, but he was still in charge. He got respect.
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Robert Jewkes
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Leadership and NCO. He's wrong for flexing muscle he don't have, your wrong for Disrespecting answer. In the military, if they put a PFC in leadership position as unlikely as that may be, he is the top man in regards to the project he is overseeing. If you think he/she has dropped you wrongfully talk to Squad leader.
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Cpl Rosemarie SantaAnna
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I do agree
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SGT Robert Urbaniak
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You always have to respect rank, and this is why we have this in the military.The only way I'd refuse an order if I was told to do something that I knew for sure it would kill me, BUT I might volunteer for a mission like that.
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SGT Kenneth Rand
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A corporal is an NCO, and to disrespect an NCO is to disrespect the uniform! I see you only as a disgrace that doesn't know what the military is. While you may have years of experience obviously he has more experience as a leader. I have seen plenty of horrid leaders but I've also seen many shit bag specialists that claim they can do their job better. If this were true you'd have the promotion points but you can't manage 350 automatic promotion points. My secondary mos was 790 for E-5 I knew everyone's job even yours that doesn't give me the right to disrespect the person above me because I think I'm intelligent. It only makes me a better tool for him to use in his arsenal.
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Cpl George Matousek
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Yes , you were very wrong, he outranks you and you must follow is orders. Semper Fi
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SSG Watis Ekthuvapranee
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If that corporal was directly your immediate supervisor and you did something wrong that he clearly warned you first. However, whether he is right or wrong to literally tell me what you said, you have just given him a real reason to fault you for real. Military discipline means having the ability to force oneself to do or not to do something required by your honor, loyalty, duty, and responsibility. Without that we would never win as many battle as we have had. It's not just following order, but to do the what the sworn oath one has pledged.

On the other hand, that corporal should not have done that in the first place. He should have warned you first couple of times, while you should have stopped and obeyed that warning. This was call respect. You respected his rank/title/position, and in return, he respected you as an equal warrior.

If I was your CO., I would relief him of his duty while I am giving you summarized Article 15, 7/7 no pay cut. And if you refused, I would refer this case to BN Cdr.

You lucky, I work for the living. ;)
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SPC Matt Ovaska
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Unbelievable!
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