Posted on Feb 11, 2022
Can a corporal in a team leader position have me do corrective action (“smoke” me)? And was I wrong to tell him to eat a bag of dicks?
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We just got a new Corporal who recently reclassed to mortars. He’s highly motivated (hooah), and during a training event, we had a disagreement over how to perform large deflections. He told me to "drop," but the fire mission he was calling would’ve put us outside the safety fan during a live fire and could have potentially caused injuries to other elements participating in the exercise.
Now, I understand and respect his rank, but I’ve been a mortarman longer and currently serve as the Gun 2 gunner. The fact is—he was wrong. He just became an 11C, and when he wouldn’t listen to correction or reason, I told him (admittedly out of frustration) to eat a bag of d***s.
I’m curious to hear what others think—especially when it comes to situations where rank clashes with experience and safety is on the line.
Now, I understand and respect his rank, but I’ve been a mortarman longer and currently serve as the Gun 2 gunner. The fact is—he was wrong. He just became an 11C, and when he wouldn’t listen to correction or reason, I told him (admittedly out of frustration) to eat a bag of d***s.
I’m curious to hear what others think—especially when it comes to situations where rank clashes with experience and safety is on the line.
Edited 5 mo ago
Posted 4 y ago
Responses: 358
You should be enormously happy you were not in my Navy and not in my division; you would have been climbing ladders till you died if you tried that crap on any of my NCO's and the second helping would have come from me personally. Having said all that, you were both wrong. Yoo should have conferred with the young corporal in private while obeying in public, this would have voided the situation to begin with. I have no doubt however that you were disrespectful in tone and manner when you tried to point out his error and that couldn't have been helpful to an individual who was new to his leadership position and didn't need some disrespectful back talk. You pretty much gave him no option but to try to correct your attitude immediately. He was wrong in that he made an issue of punishing you in public. The basic rule of leadership is praise in public, punish and criticize in private.
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Having been a corporal myself your damn skippy he can smoke your ass. He's an NCO. Personally, I'd broke out the old paper and pen and put it in your record. And then wait for the 2nd time and have courts martial for patterns of misconduct. See how that works out for you in life.
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If you would have said "with all due respect" Eat a bag of dicks thats not UCMJ.
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1LT William Clardy
But it could still earn a top spot on the platoon sergeant's shit-list, or the first sergeant's.
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Specialist,
If you had acted that way to one of my Petty Officers, you would have found your way to the Mast and The Green Felt Table (Army parlance: Top would have sent you to the "Old Man"). It would be at that point when UCMJ happens. The military does not do things by committee or "union" seniority on a machine. Your best course of action would have been to respectfully offer your advice and then stop. If the Corporal is a good leader, he would thank you; however, if he persists on doing it his way, as long as lives are not in danger, then do as he says. You should always demonstrate better leadership and get ahead.
If you had acted that way to one of my Petty Officers, you would have found your way to the Mast and The Green Felt Table (Army parlance: Top would have sent you to the "Old Man"). It would be at that point when UCMJ happens. The military does not do things by committee or "union" seniority on a machine. Your best course of action would have been to respectfully offer your advice and then stop. If the Corporal is a good leader, he would thank you; however, if he persists on doing it his way, as long as lives are not in danger, then do as he says. You should always demonstrate better leadership and get ahead.
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I had several jobs where I was the senior person but not the highest ranking person. As in I was an E-3 with an E-6 working for me at one point. Sometimes you have to be tactful and explain why their idea will not work, also privately explaining to them that at some point they will be all trained up and still no one will respect them because they toss rank around more than knowledge can be helpful.
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You were insubordinate and thus very wrong. I do not know all of the circumstances involved but minor “corrective action” was a real break for you. In Vietnam while in contact I, as their Squad, leader told 2 soldiers to move from a very safe position into a field of direct fire from the enemy. Both men told me “hell no” but when we started to “Fire and maneuver” they did as they were told. Both of them later apologized and the issue was over. Both got much better after their 1st week of action. One man EARNED a Bronze Star for Valor.
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We had a lot of AJ (acting jack) SGT's that were in charge of TDY common teams. The strips were on his sleeve, hence he was & should be respected as an NCO.
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You were in the wrong. He would have been within his rights to write you up and put you in front of the company commander for an Article 15.
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Two egos getting in the way of professionalism. So much for lack of verbal skills. But, an opportunity to learn…for both sides. Either side could have approached the subject at hand differently, but chose not to because Mr. Ego reared his ugly head. If you’re the expert, did you use this opportunity to teach? Even one that outranks you doesn’t know everything. The best characteristic of knowledge is that it can be shared. It makes for a better team when everyone is onboard and not divided. The guys down range will appreciate not having uninvited short rounds dropping in. Telling anyone to eat a bag of dicks because of a technical disagreement means what? Time to put on the big boy pants, corporal included, and settle this as a team.
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