Posted on Sep 2, 2020
Can I be forced to shave if I have a shaving profile?
94.5K
1.42K
363
118
118
0
What’s up everybody I’m pv2 jones and I been in the army a little over 9 months, I love serving until it comes to shaving. I’ve tried everything and my face bumps up terrible man I’m talking about it looks disgusting, plenty of my Drill Sgts in AIT tried teaching me how to shave but it doesn’t work. So I just got to my new unit about 2 and a half months ago and I was still shaving even though it was painful and it looked Terrible, one day an NCO From another unit told me that I NEED to go get a shaving profile because my face just looks terrible and she can tell I was in pain so I promised her I will go get one and have them check it out . After my first appointment the dermatologist gave me a permanent shaving profile and told me that I don’t need to shave atleast until my bumps are clear. So a few weeks go by and I have a little beard (still in regulation 1/4 of an inch) so After pt my squad leader pulls me to The side and starts cursing me out at the top of his lungs saying I need to shave , I told him respectfully I have a shaving profile and it hurts for me to shave he stares at me and replied Under his breath “like every other black person in the army that can’t use razors” I didn’t say anything but it kind of hurt because I don’t want to be a odd ball in my company (I’m in a infantry company btw) so later that day we go into work to clean weapons and he calls me over and apologizes about this morning and I told him it was ok he then said that I need to shave still if I want to make it in the military and I replied and told him I’m not shaving so he can F’ing forget about it he then told me since I cursed him my punishment will be to shave or receive a article for disrespecting a NCO so later I went to my barracks room and shaved during lunch and came back in he then told me that no matter what my profile says I need to listen to him and shave I told my platoon sgt about this whole Situation and he told me I need to listen to my squad leader and shave because the army just gives shaving profiles to anyone. Is this right?
Platoon Sergeant
Platoon Leader
Commander
CCMSgt
NCO Academy
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 254
0
0
0
1. A little understanding would go a long way in enhancing your grooming standards and quality of life as a junior enlisted man. I grew a deployment mustache I only shaved it twice, once when a General was coming and the LTC asked me to and once for R&R (my wife is not a fan either).
2. It is a stretch, but I am guessing that you come from an African or Middle Eastern or Mediteranean descent. The hair is different (more curly) than caucasians, and tends to get caught in the follicle before getting out of the skin after shaving to the surface; causing what is known as "Pseudofolliculitis." or pimples. I had a black friend in college who used Nair depillatory as shaving cream and a kitchen spatula to shave. The below website has other suggestions for how to keep within regs while avoiding pizza face.
https://www.uspharmacist.com/article/pseudofolliculitis-barbae-prevention-and-treatment
2. It is a stretch, but I am guessing that you come from an African or Middle Eastern or Mediteranean descent. The hair is different (more curly) than caucasians, and tends to get caught in the follicle before getting out of the skin after shaving to the surface; causing what is known as "Pseudofolliculitis." or pimples. I had a black friend in college who used Nair depillatory as shaving cream and a kitchen spatula to shave. The below website has other suggestions for how to keep within regs while avoiding pizza face.
https://www.uspharmacist.com/article/pseudofolliculitis-barbae-prevention-and-treatment
Pseudofolliculitis Barbae: Prevention and Treatment
Nathaniel E. Eraikhuemen, PharmDAssociate Professor of Pharmacy PracticeCollege of Pharmacy and Pharmaceutical SciencesFlorida A&M University–Davie Instructional SiteDavie, Florida
(0)
(0)
MAJ Mark Steskal
The superficial statement about 'like every other black person in the Army,' myay have been more ignorance than racism. If I had not been a Navy Coirpsman in a previous life, I may not have had sense enough to understand what the problem was or been unabashed enough to ask about it.
Let's not play the racist card in every hand. There are times when it is righteous and times when cultural bias and ignorance are a problem that can be fixed with a soft word (
"By patience and a calm spirit a ruler may be persuaded, And a soft and gentle tongue breaks the bone [of resistance]." Amplified Bible Proverbs :25:15)
Let's not play the racist card in every hand. There are times when it is righteous and times when cultural bias and ignorance are a problem that can be fixed with a soft word (
"By patience and a calm spirit a ruler may be persuaded, And a soft and gentle tongue breaks the bone [of resistance]." Amplified Bible Proverbs :25:15)
(0)
(0)
0
0
0
Your squad leader committed an EO violation with his remark about “every black person in the Army”. That’s a serious offense on his part if he wants to make the Army a career.
You did the right thing by getting the profile AND BEING RESPECTFUL.
Stay respectful. Never disrespect an NCO even when they’re in the wrong.
You were wrong to curse at him, but at the most that’s a counseling statement. Not an Article 15.
Your PLT SGT is wrong to not stomp on your team leader’s ass for what he’s doing. Go up one more, even to your 1SG or Commander if necessary.
A correct profile should be signed by your Commander, so make sure that your Commander has signed it. Stand up for yourself, but be respectful.
You did the right thing by getting the profile AND BEING RESPECTFUL.
Stay respectful. Never disrespect an NCO even when they’re in the wrong.
You were wrong to curse at him, but at the most that’s a counseling statement. Not an Article 15.
Your PLT SGT is wrong to not stomp on your team leader’s ass for what he’s doing. Go up one more, even to your 1SG or Commander if necessary.
A correct profile should be signed by your Commander, so make sure that your Commander has signed it. Stand up for yourself, but be respectful.
(0)
(0)
0
0
0
The only way anyone can order you to shave is the commander and it has to be for a real world NBC threat. The squad leader and PSG were out of line and need to be educated on the regulation.
(0)
(0)
0
0
0
Whats worse disobeying noncoms or disobey the officer that wrote that profile???
(0)
(0)
0
0
0
You should file an EO complaint. That's a racist and disrespectful thing to say.
(0)
(0)
0
0
0
I would recommend that you request to speak with your company commander through your platoon leader on his open door policy immediately. Depending on how the conversation goes with your company commander, I would report the matter through EO channels. This is to ensure that if anything else happens with this same NCO the chain of command has a full picture of the situation.
(0)
(0)
0
0
0
As long as you follow you profile, these things should not happen. i would guess your profile was signed off by an O-6, which carries alot of weight. If some fool E-5 waants to argue with that, well then , go through your chain of command about it.
On a different tack, I suggest trying a Braun beard trimmer to shave with, they cut very close . I have the same promblem with any type of "rotary electric razor" , my face will bump up and I am white LOL. Also I always had problems with just normal shaving before I joined and for my first few months in ., until a comrade in my first unit suggested "sensitive skin" shaving cream. You might want to try that , if you have not. Avoid razors with any kind of "glue strip" as well, they irritate skin. Plain double or single edge razors seem to work best, . The triple/quads are just a waste of money and they go dull super fast , even faster than single/double edge ones. always use a sharp razor , even if you just use it once. (I use shick slim twins or Bic single edge) if I want something closer than just using the Braun beard trimmer as a razor.
Now as far as any racial issues, and also losing your cool as well. Avoid that stuff, and fuggettaboutit. On the medical issue of having a profile is the key thing of import. People have all kinds of biases and sometimes they don't like people for a variety of reasons. I've seen officers look down on enlisted just because they make less pay. I have seen several "ethnics" look down on anyone else. This is just not a white-black issue. I saw whites look down on blacks , blacks look down on whites . and the same stuff with Hispanics , Jews , Masons, against other "clicks", you name it, Fuck it, do your job and follow the regs . Assholes will hang themselves. Keep your own cool , things will work out of their own accord.
On a different tack, I suggest trying a Braun beard trimmer to shave with, they cut very close . I have the same promblem with any type of "rotary electric razor" , my face will bump up and I am white LOL. Also I always had problems with just normal shaving before I joined and for my first few months in ., until a comrade in my first unit suggested "sensitive skin" shaving cream. You might want to try that , if you have not. Avoid razors with any kind of "glue strip" as well, they irritate skin. Plain double or single edge razors seem to work best, . The triple/quads are just a waste of money and they go dull super fast , even faster than single/double edge ones. always use a sharp razor , even if you just use it once. (I use shick slim twins or Bic single edge) if I want something closer than just using the Braun beard trimmer as a razor.
Now as far as any racial issues, and also losing your cool as well. Avoid that stuff, and fuggettaboutit. On the medical issue of having a profile is the key thing of import. People have all kinds of biases and sometimes they don't like people for a variety of reasons. I've seen officers look down on enlisted just because they make less pay. I have seen several "ethnics" look down on anyone else. This is just not a white-black issue. I saw whites look down on blacks , blacks look down on whites . and the same stuff with Hispanics , Jews , Masons, against other "clicks", you name it, Fuck it, do your job and follow the regs . Assholes will hang themselves. Keep your own cool , things will work out of their own accord.
(0)
(0)
0
0
0
Start reading some of the previous posts on this one. It comes up, seems once a month now. If you have a profile, it states what it can be. If you exceed that, your NCO would be wrong for not pointing it out.
(0)
(0)
0
0
0
A little late to "the party" but a link to an interesting piece I read today, from Dec 2020. I do think (as a retired female NCO) the services can and should accommodate medically driven profiles for those with the skin condition. Leaders of all ranks need to remove their heads from their nether regions, and respect those boundaries.
https://taskandpurpose.com/news/air-force-shaving-profile-bad-for-career/
https://taskandpurpose.com/news/air-force-shaving-profile-bad-for-career/
A shaving profile might be bad for your Air Force career
Airmen with shaving profiles said that the profiles had disqualified them from prestigious positions, leadership opportunities, or awards.
(0)
(0)
0
0
0
First, if you have a profile to not shave, that trumps a Squad Leader's wishes.
Second, his comment about, "like every other black person," while dead wrong for both fact and EEO issues, has SOME truth. When I was in Nam, the black guys used to joke about not having to shave, and SOME were known to take advantage. Still, if they had a profile, that was the end of it - and that was in the Marine Corps. NCO's didn't like it, but they weren't stupid about it.
I don't know if I would make an EEO complaint; at least not without asking him to speak privately. Give it one more shot to convince him that you have a LEGITIMATE reason for the profile. You can also tell him that his previous comment about "like" others was wrong. If he's smart, and if he's a decent NCO, he SHOULD not only agree with your profile, but apologize for his remark.
Your in a unique position. You can help educate the guy, or you can probably burn the guy. If I were him, I'd certainly appreciate a second chance.
It does NOT sound to me like you "cursed him." You literally used an adjective and did not directed it AT him (as a verb). Profanity is not illegal - unprofessional PERHAPS. I'm actually more disappointed in what your Platoon Sergeant said. Usually, it's good when someone sticks up for his Squad Leader, but YOU HAVE A MEDICAL PROFILE. As I said, that trumps everything else. Hopefully, you'll have the opportunity to demonstrate that you are otherwise a top-notch soldier.
Second, his comment about, "like every other black person," while dead wrong for both fact and EEO issues, has SOME truth. When I was in Nam, the black guys used to joke about not having to shave, and SOME were known to take advantage. Still, if they had a profile, that was the end of it - and that was in the Marine Corps. NCO's didn't like it, but they weren't stupid about it.
I don't know if I would make an EEO complaint; at least not without asking him to speak privately. Give it one more shot to convince him that you have a LEGITIMATE reason for the profile. You can also tell him that his previous comment about "like" others was wrong. If he's smart, and if he's a decent NCO, he SHOULD not only agree with your profile, but apologize for his remark.
Your in a unique position. You can help educate the guy, or you can probably burn the guy. If I were him, I'd certainly appreciate a second chance.
It does NOT sound to me like you "cursed him." You literally used an adjective and did not directed it AT him (as a verb). Profanity is not illegal - unprofessional PERHAPS. I'm actually more disappointed in what your Platoon Sergeant said. Usually, it's good when someone sticks up for his Squad Leader, but YOU HAVE A MEDICAL PROFILE. As I said, that trumps everything else. Hopefully, you'll have the opportunity to demonstrate that you are otherwise a top-notch soldier.
(0)
(0)
Read This Next
Continue with Facebook 
Continue with Google