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I wanted to address the stratification of service that exists within the military. There isn't much of that in the Air Force due to the very limited number of actual "Combat" AFSCs. I mean, I feel I did an important job in Iraq by being the COR of a contract that provided employment to LNs doing manual labor around JB Balad. Every Iraqi we gave a paycheck to was one less that was collecting a paycheck for picking up a gun and shooting at coalition forces. However, I am not a combat veteran. The mortars that came down around us on a daily basis doesn't qualify as "combat". Although I feel I earned my hostile fire pay, I still don't feel like I should get the same regards and benefits as combat vets. I get the good natured ribbing that goes down the line from grunts to "fobbits" (of which I proudly consider myself) to those who never deployed. I've never seen that kind of exchange as hostile... it's just part of the military pecking order.
How do you all feel about that? I know they don't have unnecessary jobs and that every job in the military is important... But how do you combat vets really view fobbits and non-deployers? How about inter-service? Is anyone genuinely hostile towards those of different branches?
How do you all feel about that? I know they don't have unnecessary jobs and that every job in the military is important... But how do you combat vets really view fobbits and non-deployers? How about inter-service? Is anyone genuinely hostile towards those of different branches?
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 70
As an "E" ... I deployed to SEA during Vietnam (Thailand, Phillipines and Okinawa) and flew a little over 30 hrs of "Combat Time" on air refueling missions. Did several deployments in my just under 4 years of total E time, not to mention many, many days on SAC Nuke Alert. As an "O" ... I deployed to Germany (I know ... tough gig) and flew another 55 hrs "Combat Time" aeromedical evac missions into Iraq, Afghanistan and Kuwait on C-17s. I personally realize the difference between my flight time and the warrior outside the wire as NOT being the same "combat". But remember we all did what we needed to do to support the mission. Take care of each other and watch over each other ... just like we did then. When I came home after my "E" tour (1974) ... the WWII and Korea guys at the local VFW didn't really recognize the fact that we "non-boots-on-the-ground" were even Vets. As one might expect ... that local VFW is closed its doors ... all the WWII and Korea guys died off and since they never really "accepted" us ... no one to carry it on. Don't lever let that happen in your community.
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Quote by Ernie Pyle...“All the rest of us—you and me and even the thousands of soldiers behind the lines in Africa—we wanted terribly yet only academically for the war to be over. The front-line soldier wanted it to be terminated by the physical process of his destroying enough Germans to end it. He was truly at war. The rest of us, no matter how hard we worked, were not. Say what you will, nothing can make a complete soldier except battle experience.”
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I am not a combat vet, but I would think they really wouldn't think less of anyone who is truthful and not claiming to be a combat vet, someone has to feed those who went/go out into the red zone , maintain the equipment, take care of pay, clothing, etc
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There are those of us who were on the front lines, those that were in the FOB and those that were never deployed. To me, it doesn't matter which category you fit into just as long as if you were asked to go to the front lines, you would proudly do so. I think what makes people angry is those that try to get out of doing what they took an oath to do.
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I got out as PFC with an honorable. Partly because of my own stupidity and party because of the black hole where I was stationed. When I meet someone that is an actual combat vet, I can honestly say I get a little jealous. Not because of the benefits or the treatment they receive, but because I wish I could've had the chance to serve and fight for my country. But as a tank mech on a base that had no tanks and no deploying units, I was kind of screwed.... That being said, if there was a way I could fight, I mean really FIGHT for my country today, I would. Even if it meant dying for. Because freedom isn't free.
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I dont think there is any "real" animosity between MOS, Branch, or non-deployers. There may be some ribbing. But that is more boosting self morale. "My team is better than your team". All said and done, we all served.
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There is always someone who was farther out or had it worse. Veterans are such a small % of the population, we don't really need to fight among ourselves. Just don't claim to be something you are not. I say I am an Afghanistan vet not a combat vet. I always figured you at least needed to fire your weapon in anger and not into the clearing barrel to be considered having been in combat. ;)
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I think under normal circumstances, nobody is going to hold a fellow serviceman's service or status against them in any kind of serious way. (Joking or ribbing doesn't count.)
Where people start getting seriously annoyed is when someone gets pretentious. That could be in the form of someone who hasn't deployed telling someone who has deployed the way things are or the way things should be, or the person who has deployed treating people who haven't deployed as if they have no credibility simply because they have not deployed. Nobody likes being looked down upon, especially if it's for something beyond the person's control.
Where people start getting seriously annoyed is when someone gets pretentious. That could be in the form of someone who hasn't deployed telling someone who has deployed the way things are or the way things should be, or the person who has deployed treating people who haven't deployed as if they have no credibility simply because they have not deployed. Nobody likes being looked down upon, especially if it's for something beyond the person's control.
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A lot of joking around happens, thats just the nature of the military, i have done some of the joking. In reality and in the grand scheme, everyone plays an important role to the overall mission success and with everyone, regardless of their role, doing their job, the different pieces of the pie dont function.
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The only things that truly bothers me is when those who haven't seen combat or haven't even deployed talk themselves up like they have, especially around civilians. I can almost always tell a true "war story" from a fake one, even if the fake one is being told by an actual veteran. Or when someone doges deployments. You joined the Military, regardless of the branch you are expected to do your job and lay down your life if you need to. However, if someone just misses deployments that is another story. I deployed as a 12B under a SGM who had never been to a combat zone before. As far as I know, he never tried to get out of deploying, it just never happened to him because of circumstance. but then that would lead to a debate on whether he should even have been promoted to that rank especially in a combat-centered MOS, that would derail the conversation. So I guess it really all just depends on circumstance for me. As a general rule, I don't like to think that I am better than anyone because I have deployed, been blown up, shot at, etc. but sometimes when I talk to other service members, the way the present themselves and act when talking about the fact that they have never did anything like I did can cause me too feel anger and resentment, and yes I am better than those people.
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A combat veteran is someone who deployed to a combat zone and earned hazardous duty pay. So if you deployed to Iraq, Afghanistan, etc., you are a combat veteran. The majority of people who deployed were like you. I was the same. I had to volunteer for three of my overseas tours and never was shot at or attacked by an IED. I tried to get off base as much as my duties allowed me to. I do have a special place in my heart for the combat Infantrymen and one regret I have is that I never earned a CIB. But as a LTC, my duties required me to spend most of my time on base. You are a combat veteran and should be proud to be one. Most Americans do not understand what we have done or do. What frustrated me more than anything though was seeing senior officers in the USAR get promoted without a deployment. I have no time for them when I volunteered 3 times at the expense of my career.
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Sailors get the shortest end of the stick in my opinion.
"Did you ever deploy?"
"Yes I did."
"Where to?"
"Pacific, Gulf of Aden, Strait of Hormuz, etc."
"So just the ocean, not Afghan or Iraq?"
"Just the ocean."
"Oh"
So what are we?
"Did you ever deploy?"
"Yes I did."
"Where to?"
"Pacific, Gulf of Aden, Strait of Hormuz, etc."
"So just the ocean, not Afghan or Iraq?"
"Just the ocean."
"Oh"
So what are we?
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How did that old saying go? For every combat soldier there are 10 support soldiers who enable him to do his job?
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I don't spend anytime thinking about this; you either served or you did not.
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We are BROTHERS and SISTERS. As a combat vet I was appreciative of all support roles from ammo humpers to mess hall cooks. I do wish I had been issued a pair of clean, dry socks for every 10 gooks I killed. I remember calling in mortar fire on my own position and crawling, sliding backwards in the mud until my fatigue blouse was full of mud and pulled loose of my web belt... :-)
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