Posted on Feb 8, 2021
Considering career change - interested in Engineer Officer (12A), but recruiter suggested Enlisted (12B) first, then go to OCS - is he right?
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Apologies for the duplicate post - I posted an updated originally. Please delete
Hello,
I have a BS and an MBA in my field, have worked 10 years and have gotten to the point where I feel I've accomplished everything I want to in my field, from pay to title. While I haven't exactly decided what I want to do yet, I have always wanted to be an officer in the military (considered other branches too); however it was never the right time, but I realized it's never going to be the 'right' time. Either way, my desire to do something else and desire to become an officer have me here considering joining the army, either national guard, or just regular army. I am seriously leaning towards doing three years of active duty in order to have my schooling paid for and some salary while I go to school once I complete my active duty service. As I said I wanted to have a career change, so that is definitely a big incentive for me.
In looking at my 'choices', I have been strongly leaning towards combat engineering, and while I understand officer's don't pick their job assignments, a recruiter told me to sign up as an enlisted, 12B, and once I complete training, apply to OCS where I would have a better chance at becoming a 12A since I would already be a Combat Engineer. Is there any truth to that? Are there any downsides to that approach? I imagine it's based on number of openings, so could I see myself playing the waiting game and be stuck as enlisted for a while? Or would I be able to do OCS almost immediately after, then play the waiting game for an opening in EBOLC? I have this concern that I'm going to be stuck as enlisted for an indefinite amount of time until something opens up on the officer side.
Thank you.
Hello,
I have a BS and an MBA in my field, have worked 10 years and have gotten to the point where I feel I've accomplished everything I want to in my field, from pay to title. While I haven't exactly decided what I want to do yet, I have always wanted to be an officer in the military (considered other branches too); however it was never the right time, but I realized it's never going to be the 'right' time. Either way, my desire to do something else and desire to become an officer have me here considering joining the army, either national guard, or just regular army. I am seriously leaning towards doing three years of active duty in order to have my schooling paid for and some salary while I go to school once I complete my active duty service. As I said I wanted to have a career change, so that is definitely a big incentive for me.
In looking at my 'choices', I have been strongly leaning towards combat engineering, and while I understand officer's don't pick their job assignments, a recruiter told me to sign up as an enlisted, 12B, and once I complete training, apply to OCS where I would have a better chance at becoming a 12A since I would already be a Combat Engineer. Is there any truth to that? Are there any downsides to that approach? I imagine it's based on number of openings, so could I see myself playing the waiting game and be stuck as enlisted for a while? Or would I be able to do OCS almost immediately after, then play the waiting game for an opening in EBOLC? I have this concern that I'm going to be stuck as enlisted for an indefinite amount of time until something opens up on the officer side.
Thank you.
Potential Recruit
12B: Combat Engineer
12A: Engineer Officer
OCS
Officer
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 27
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If you have a undergraduate and graduate degree it is absolutely rediculous for you to enlist. You would be a Specialist (E-4).
You should speak to an officer recruiter. Just simply ask your recruiter, "who is the officer recruiter in the area?".... They know who they are.... If your recruiter doesn't tell you then speak to the person that runs the recruiting station.
Clearly you would submit an OCS packet. Depending on your your degrees, GPA, athletics, volunteering, etc will determine how competitive you are.
Your not at the point to be concerned about MOSs, jobs. Realistically, submit for OCS, do your 3 years and either get out or stay in..... Thousands of officers do this early, they join just to pay for school......
But don't waste your time with the resume you have just to be enlisted... You will kick yourself everyday complaining..... I promise, you don't want that!
You should speak to an officer recruiter. Just simply ask your recruiter, "who is the officer recruiter in the area?".... They know who they are.... If your recruiter doesn't tell you then speak to the person that runs the recruiting station.
Clearly you would submit an OCS packet. Depending on your your degrees, GPA, athletics, volunteering, etc will determine how competitive you are.
Your not at the point to be concerned about MOSs, jobs. Realistically, submit for OCS, do your 3 years and either get out or stay in..... Thousands of officers do this early, they join just to pay for school......
But don't waste your time with the resume you have just to be enlisted... You will kick yourself everyday complaining..... I promise, you don't want that!
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Your recruiter is trying to screw you for his personal benefit. One more thing you need to know is that your desire to become a 12A isn’t entirely in your hands. You still have to place well enough at OCS to get high enough in your class to pick your career field. Even then, it isn’t a guarantee that you’ll get your choice because it all depends on the number of slots available for each branch.
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Andrew Ruiz
Understood. Thank you. I understand I shouldn't take his approach, but is there any logic to it whatsoever - coming is as a 12B to give me a better chance at becoming a 12A?
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MAJ (Join to see)
There is no logic whatsoever. Your enlisted MOS has nothing to do with being an officer. Your degree doesn’t matter either. It comes down to the needs of the Army. I have a degree in marketing and I enlisted as Field Artillery to pay for my school loans, switched to Military Intelligence, and now I’m Electronic Warfare. You also need an endorsement from at least three people to even be able to submit an OCS packet. In my case it was my Battery Commander, Battalion Commander, and Brigade Commander. If you run into the wrong group of personalities, you may be screwed. I enlisted after college and got lucky. I’ve been on an OCS board and I can tell you that even if you get that far in the process it isn’t a guarantee that you will get selected. We had to deny a Soldier for lying in their essay. The Soldier didn’t think anybody would notice.Andrew Ruiz
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If you are qualified to go Officer route from the beginning... GO THAT ROUTE! I serve with a bunch of 12B's that thought the same thing. They could for sure go OCS now, but they are just not going to. Do your self a favor and just go officer from the start. Your enlisted will not sway your Officer job at all ...
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Andrew Ruiz
Thanks. I had this suspicion I would end up stuck as enlisted for an indefinite amount of time if I went that route.
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CW4 William Kessinger
I concur... your enlisted MOS is not relative to any Officer MOS.. your branch choice is..in the past, as a duel rated Aviator (held both mos’s in some assignments) I was in Armor Branch.. was not considered an equal to other Armor Officers (for promotion ) by Army lever promotion boards. Had to hold Armor position in a TO and E slot for higher rank.Long after I got out (retired) they finely got an Aviation Branch for those that only wanted to fly..
I will never forget the bias I saw at Ft Knox toward AIT Commanders that were qualified Aviators.. Some were not allowed to ware their aviation badges (wings) in their own company command..
I will never forget the bias I saw at Ft Knox toward AIT Commanders that were qualified Aviators.. Some were not allowed to ware their aviation badges (wings) in their own company command..
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This is a simplified way to explain, but think of your recruiter as a salesman at a local Chevrolet truck dealer. Based upon what you've told him, he knows you're really interested in getting a GMC. But he doesn't sell GMC, he sells Chevrolet.
He's not going to get anything out of it by sending you to the GMC dealer, and he knows this. Because they're both owned by General Motors, he'll try and sell you on an idea that's it's better to buy the Chevy first and get the GMC later.
And if you were evaluating a truck purchase, you'd probably see right away that he's trying to play you for a sucker.
He's not going to get anything out of it by sending you to the GMC dealer, and he knows this. Because they're both owned by General Motors, he'll try and sell you on an idea that's it's better to buy the Chevy first and get the GMC later.
And if you were evaluating a truck purchase, you'd probably see right away that he's trying to play you for a sucker.
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Let me suggest another option. The National Guard has a loan forgiveness program for Federal Student Loans that is available for enlisted and Officer Candidates. The reason I suggest that is the Guard Candidates have more say in their Branch in addition to having different programs to attend OCS.
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LTC (Join to see)
In the Guard you’ll be a promotable Captain for about 15 years while waiting for that old Major to finally die or retire unless you happen to be a well-connected good ol’ boy. I’m exaggerating a little but I’ve met several promotable Captains from the Guard who were promotable for several years while waiting for a job to open up in their state.
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CPT Lawrence Cable
LTC (Join to see) - Depends on the state. There are lots of jobs for Majors. I didn't see any fully qualified Captains get passed over for Major in Kentucky and Ohio, at least in the Combat Arms and Engineers. You still have to make rank by the second board or your out, just like in the Active Army. The issue is sometimes that the Captain isn't fully qualified for Promotion, usually schools.
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CPT Lawrence Cable
On a real computer now instead of my phone. If you chose that route, you would still end up completing Basic Combat Training (Active Duty with the regular Army), pick one of the three methods of going to OCS in the Guard, Federal OCS, a National Guard Accelerated OCS (don't recommend, high drop out rate) or the "Tradition" National Guard OCS that is done over 14-16 months of attending OCS instead of drilling with a unit, plus 2 Annual Training Periods. Federal OCS is not always available since seats for that school are very competitive. I would make sure there are slots available for Engineer Officers in the State before I signed on the line. After you commission, you are scheduled to attend Basic Officer Leadership Course, in your case for the Engineers, which is 5 months at Ft Leonard Wood in Missouri. Then back to your unit.
In my day, there were opportunities to pick up some active duty time on special projects. Civil Action Programs in Central and South America were going strong when I was in and there was always calls going out of officers to do extended tours. I turned down a 2 year tour in Panama that I kick myself every time I think about it, even though there were some very strong reasons why I turned it down. I assume that is still true today since so much of the Engineering capabilities of the Army are in the Guard and Reserves.
In my day, there were opportunities to pick up some active duty time on special projects. Civil Action Programs in Central and South America were going strong when I was in and there was always calls going out of officers to do extended tours. I turned down a 2 year tour in Panama that I kick myself every time I think about it, even though there were some very strong reasons why I turned it down. I assume that is still true today since so much of the Engineering capabilities of the Army are in the Guard and Reserves.
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If you have a college degree (even an associate) then I would NOT go enlisted. Go ROTC and then apply for active duty once you are a graduate.
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I don’t think the recruiter is being honest with you. If you have a bs and ms already plus 10 years in the field I and meet the medical and age requirements(limits) it would seem you should be able to go direct OCS and commission as engineer. If you can’t we (military) are being stupid. I was a 62 E in usaf for a while and while many of the engineers I worked with were prior enlisted I don’t think any had bs let alone a ms when they enlisted. Some on here went the OCS route — I would look for a direct call to OCS for your desired branch to talk to them. Skip that recruiter, if I were you or talk to another one. Consider what you want to do as well— USAF and space Command (which I was a part of as 62E) has some really great engineering opportunities in space and technology — they would likely love to have someone like you as a lieutenant!
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Andrew Ruiz
I clarified in another post that I am not an engineer by trade, but noted possible interests as I look for a new career once I'm out. Space is definitely an interesting field. Are there openings for non-engineering degreed officers in the space field?
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Your standard Canvassing Recruiter will suggest you enlist because that is their job and what they get credit for. I would recommend you speak to someone in regards to commissioning.
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Here's a clue. The Recruiter survives the tour of duty by writing enlisted contracts. With your degrees you should be able to figure the rest out. There's nothing wrong with being enlisted, but at your age time is not on your side. There are more people and great opportunities in the Army, but at least talk to a USMC Officer Selection Officer (OSO, or whatever they call it now) first. You may be outside the age requirement already. I was in Engineers and it is a tight knit community. The Engr initiation many years ago was a hoot. Involves a hatchet, stump and blindfold. If you can hit the stump blindfolded you pass. They remove your cover and place it on the stump first, unbeknown to you. Late 70s.
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If you go active duty you don't get to choose what field you will be branched into. You won't be any more likely to be selected as a 12A just because you were a 12B, ultimately the needs of the Army trump all.
It might be worth going enlisted first if you aren't offered a Student Loan Repayment as an officer. I don't know anything about Recruiting, so I can't answer that. You can apply for OCS at any point you want if you do choose to enlist first. Your concern about being stuck enlisted while waiting for something to open up is unfounded, that's just not how the process works. When you go to OCS you will immediately be slotted for your BOLC afterwards. You will also be pinned to 2LT immediately upon graduation of OCS. Shortly before you graduate you will find out what branch you were given.
It might be worth going enlisted first if you aren't offered a Student Loan Repayment as an officer. I don't know anything about Recruiting, so I can't answer that. You can apply for OCS at any point you want if you do choose to enlist first. Your concern about being stuck enlisted while waiting for something to open up is unfounded, that's just not how the process works. When you go to OCS you will immediately be slotted for your BOLC afterwards. You will also be pinned to 2LT immediately upon graduation of OCS. Shortly before you graduate you will find out what branch you were given.
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