Posted on Jul 12, 2023
Is it standard or even typical as a form of disciplinary action for an NCO to call a soldier's parents to complain about the service member?
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Hello Rallypoint Members!
I have a question regarding disciplinary actions that I have received from my detachment SFC. So I got myself into some trouble with an MP (argued with an MP after having a few beers), not gonna go into great detail (I own the mistakes that I made) but I am confused about one thing that my detachment sergeant has done regarding my disciplinary actions. The day after my altercation with the MP’s, my detachment SFC called me into her office, she informed me about what reprimands I could be facing (which I expected) but she also made me write down my mother and father’s phone numbers and she actually called them to tell them how much of a dirt bag I had been (which I did not expect). I am a grown man and can face the legal and moral repercussions of my own actions but was taken aback to find out that my NCO had called my family to inform them of the mistakes that I had made. Is this standard procedure in the military or even a typical form of disciplinary action for an NCO to make?
Any and all input is appreciated!
Thanks!
I have a question regarding disciplinary actions that I have received from my detachment SFC. So I got myself into some trouble with an MP (argued with an MP after having a few beers), not gonna go into great detail (I own the mistakes that I made) but I am confused about one thing that my detachment sergeant has done regarding my disciplinary actions. The day after my altercation with the MP’s, my detachment SFC called me into her office, she informed me about what reprimands I could be facing (which I expected) but she also made me write down my mother and father’s phone numbers and she actually called them to tell them how much of a dirt bag I had been (which I did not expect). I am a grown man and can face the legal and moral repercussions of my own actions but was taken aback to find out that my NCO had called my family to inform them of the mistakes that I had made. Is this standard procedure in the military or even a typical form of disciplinary action for an NCO to make?
Any and all input is appreciated!
Thanks!
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 217
I'd never heard of something like this. On reading the comments, my question would be "Is this an Article 15 punishable offense?" if your NCO is calling your parents as a way of applying pressure instead of pursuing UCMJ action, say "thank you" and drive on.
If this is a case of using humiliation on top of UCMJ it's starting to look like a vendetta, and I would run it up the chain of command.
If this is a case of using humiliation on top of UCMJ it's starting to look like a vendetta, and I would run it up the chain of command.
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Completely unprofessional. If soldiers are adult enough to enlist then any punishment levied should be be fit for an adult. Calling a soldier's parents is something a school teacher would do, and not a professional military action.
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Suspended Profile
I did have several responses and after some consideration, opted for the mature approach. Leadership isn't easy. Regardless of your MOS, your training, years in service, leadership position(s), etc...leadership skills come to us differently. It's a trait that some say you are born with, others say it's something you learn. I believe both are true. But, I truly believe it comes from observation and seeing how others have effectively using the tools they've developed. And, your scenario is but one more observation that you will hopefully put in your kit-bag and use to develop your own leadership skills and style. I want to share three examples of interacting with parents and then you decide how to use this information because everything everyone says below is both right and wrong. #1: in my first six months in the service, I received two ART 15s. The second was when I went AWOL during my second AIT (my first ART 15 resulted in reclassification). Still doing stupid stuff, me and a friend went AWOL from Fort Jackson. After three days, I called my father to ask for bus money home. He told me to wait where I was and he would call me back. About 30 minutes later, my commander came to where I was, I saw him but he didn't see me, and I immediately left. The next duty day, I returned to my unit and turned myself in (in retrospect, I don't think they knew I was missing). I took my punishment and moved on. My father to this day denies turning me in and also says he doesn't remember this happening. I still don't believe him but I am also grateful of the outcome, specifically, that I used these events to help formulate my own leadership styles. #2: While sitting in for the 1SG while he was out for surgery and recovery, I was handed a problem soldier. This guy was a dirt bag. I already knew his history; he had already received one ART 15, was pending a second, and probably was going to get discharged. During this period of punishment and confinement to the barracks, he would still take off during the duty day without authority and using varying excuses to justify his absences. One day while walking past him in the hallway, he was on the phone with his mother whining about how the Army was picking on him and without justification, was going to discharge him, probably under other than honorable conditions. As I walked by, he wanted to hand me the phone to talk to his mother because she wanted to know why the Army was picking on him. In a clear and loud voice so she would hear me, I told him if I talk to your mother, I'm going to tell her all the things you've done wrong and just how lousy of a soldier you truly are. #3: A good friend who lost several soldiers during operations in Iraq, would call (and still does) the parents of the soldiers killed. But, one in particular died not in combat, but during the commission a horrific crime. The solider killed was incidentally killed by another soldier. But, what frustrated the parents of the victim was how the Army went about with the investigation and sharing of information. Beyond their loss of their son, which goes beyond comprehension, these very patriotic people lost faith in the Army. But, it was this one CSM, who to this day, still communicates with the parents, that the parents were able to find some semblance of faith that the Army does have some good leaders. There is no answer to your question, at least no firm yes or no. But, for you, it's just one observation that you can use to form your own leadership style and start building the skills necessary to lead those under your charge. As you move along your life and career, whether in the military or other, you will be able to look back and evaluate the effectiveness of this incident and the ones I've described and decide for yourself if this is an effective tool or how to use something similar. If there is one change I have noticed during my final years in the service (the period after 911) was family was far more involved with their children's entry into the military, whether it was at the recruiting station, graduating from basic and AIT, or returning from deployment. The military as a whole is far more family oriented than it was prior to 911 and that includes the extended family. Your NCO might be a product of this evolution of the military and sees contacting your parents as normal, whereas in the era prior to 911- at least from my POV- it was unheard of to talk with extended family except in certain circumstances.
Last I heard, disclosure of personal information can be a legal civil rights issue. Might be OK to suggest to parents that they ask their son/daughter whether they are staying out of trouble. Don't blindside your personnel.
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If you were still "a juvenile" aged 17 or younger, then perhaps that would have been warranted, but as an adult soldier responsible for your own actions, your parents were "beyond that scope". Somebody should call that SFC's parents and tell them what an out-of-bounds jerk SHE's being!
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no this is not standard procedure. you were not required to give the senior NCO your number. I believe that might be overstepping on the senior NCO's part. You could file a complaint if you want to against that NCO (but I don't see the point) or you could just tell the NCO tactfully that you do not appreciate her involving your family. She had no right to do that. Your family is a personal matter. I think that was rather ridiculous. If you truly feel bothered by it then use your chain of command to address the matter.
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I've done it. I've talked to the wife and explained howthe member's actions could get them discharged. The goal of counseling is a change of behavior. If you are a good military member then that is the goal of the supervisor. Otherwise I would do that paperwork for discharge.
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Generally speaking, I would be surprised to see a parent contacted in a disciplinary matter. That said, if the NCO saw value or thought the soldier was worth the effort to "save", then I can see reaching out to the parents. I would not expect it as a routine or standard action.
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