Posted on Oct 24, 2017
2LT Infantry Officer
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I deal with cadets a lot, and they insist they out "rank" every NCO in the army. My usual response is somewhere around the guides of "uh-huh." Can I get some clarity of this?
Posted in these groups: Thcapm08l9 ROTCEnlisted logo EnlistedGeneral of the army rank insignia Officer
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Responses: 1044
AN Michael Wilder
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If I might interject a Navy perspective here, I was stationed at NAS Pensacola, Florida for Aircrew and Rescue Swimmer schools and that was also one place where they had OCS, so we had a lot of people around with strange collar insignia (cadet ranks) and occasionally we'd have these newly minted ensigns walking around the base. Our instructions in regards to these people and their training/ living area were to steer clear and basically ignore them. Don't start none, won't be none so to speak. So, anyway, one day a couple of my buddies and I are headed somewhere that caused us to be passing the base command building and we were witness to an epic incident that I will never forget.
As fate would have it, the Command Master Chief was exiting the building at the same time one of these new ensigns was entering and the little genius (he looked like he was about 15 years old) had the audacity to stop the CMC and berate him for not saluting. The old master chief, without a word or change of demeanor, reached into his pocket, pulled out a bit of change, handed the kid a quarter, and told him to "go call someone who gives a damn." It was the saltiest thing we'd ever seen...lol! This ensign then becomes somewhat apoplectic and demands the master chief's name, etc. so that he can report him for insubordination and whatever else he could pin on him and the master chief then proceeds to launch into what master chiefs, especially CMC's are made for and that is the ass-chewing of the century. He scares this kid so bad he has him popped tall and rigid as he just chews him up and spits him out, pointing out that he is the "COMMAND MASTER CHIEF for NAS PENSACOLA, the next thing to GOD, who is the CO upstairs" and then says something along the lines of "In fact, come with me and let me introduce you to Him" as he leads this poor guy back into the building. My buddies and I are at first all just stunned at what we've witnessed but after a couple of seconds we realize what we've just seen and just die laughing and we talked about that for the rest of our time there and then some...lol!
The moral of this story? There is rank and then there is position of authority and the Command Master Chief of pretty much ANY command is going to be, by virtue of position of authority, that being the enlisted right hand to the CO, and anyone short of a Commander, heck, maybe even a Captain depending on who the CO is, would be wise to recognize this and act accordingly. Most of them do but that poor ensign had apparently not got that memo and paid for it dearly. It was probably the best lesson he ever got...lol!
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Cpl Eric Ramsey
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Cadets are students not NCO's or a Officer. They have no rank in the REAL military. They will become officers or become enlisted. Until that time, they are naught. They cant even give a legal order.
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CSM Cannon Crew Member
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Look at their LES it should show E5.
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SSG D. B. Messkit - Small Arms Master Gunner
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Edited 5 y ago
New to the Platoon, and in fact arrived during a field exercise, I was at parade rest 5' from the PltSgt as he instructed the brand new 2LT (who gave me a ride out) to never come near the Platoon again, unless he had hot chow, hot coffee, or beer, and to take care of our business from the orderly room.

Never saw that LT ever again.
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SSG Cavalry Scout
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in my combat line unit NCOs sometimes give strong advice to 2nd LT never mid cadets they are equal to a E-5 but they have no command auterity yet
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PO1 Christopher GĂłmez
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Not sure about the Army, but in the Navy, they technically rank between E-9 and W-1/W-2. We do not usually acknowledge this though so it isn't a hard rule, at least in my experience.

When I was stationed on a destroyer as a Navigator and Special Operations team member, we went to Annapolis and took some Midshipmen (middies) out to sea to teach them what being in the fleet is like. Most of them were pretty cool and actually listened to what we had to say. A few of them were complete fucktards and acted like we owed them something. I was an E-5 who had deployed twice already so I was pretty experienced by that point. There was this one middie who was a real asshole and I ran into him topside one day. He stopped me as I was walking by him and said "where's my salute, Sailor?" I looked at his rank patch and saw he was a second-year middie so I told him "when you earn your commission, come find me and I will give it to you" then walked away to go about my duty. He didn't say anything else to me the rest of that cruise.

We were on the flight deck undergoing weapons training for the middies one day. My buddy, a former Marine turned Sailor, and I were doing hand grenade training at the time. We would put a flak jacket and Kevlar helmet on the middies and teach them one at a time to pull the pin and throw the grenade over the side of the ship. We had this one who pulled the pin, reached her arm way back, and as she was swinging her arm forward to throw, she dropped the grenade on the deck. We grabbed her and hit the deck as we watched the grenade bounce along the flight deck, dink-dink-dink, until it finally rolled off and over the side. It exploded right at the waterline from what we could tell. We got up and said something to the effect that we were done, collected all the weapons and gear, stowed it all, then went to report to our superiors. I think I went to the head to check my underwear after that. LOL
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1SG Mark Tillman
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When I was a unit 1SG in GTMO, we had a couple of Cadets over the summer months. We had one Cadet actually tell a SGT that they were "just an NCO". I then watched the CDR pull that Cadet into her office and commence to explain to the Cadet that without the NCOs mentorship and ability to work with her, she would ultimately fail as an officer.
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Maj Charles Dusch
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Interesting, however Academy cadets and midshipmen are not actually on active duty, per se, if memory serves.
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CPO Don Campbell
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This is very interesting...I certainly wouldn't loose any sleep over any officer candidate out ranking me but the real opportunity is to mentor and mold this soon to be officers...as U climb the enlisted ranks Ur responsibility includes training and taking care of both junior enlisted and junior officers...as a Chief my people were E-1 to E-6 and O-1 to O-3 and I changed just as many officer diapers as enlisted diapers...0-4s were pretty much potty trained but there was the occasional accident...mostly it was treating boo boos when they fell on there butts...0-5s just needed a little help as they were still a little wobbly having just learned to ride bicycles...0-6s needed a little help with their homework but I was probably just as confused as they were with the homework...little bit off topic here but to be able to work with future officers at the cadet level is quite an opportunity to influence future leadership...but I presume that a cadet has not actually received their commission yet so I wouldn't hesitate to address them up or down if needed...by the way a neighbor occasionally reminds me he outrank me...sleep like a baby whenever he does so...WOW I think this is the first time I have replied without venting my frustration with the VA
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SP5 Richard Welch
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When they train with active duty troops, the instructor is in charge of them as long as class continues. Saw interesting interaction at Bragg when I was there. A cadet threatened everyone with the fact that he was being assigned to Combat Engineer unit l was in. He couldn't function in field as a cadet, was transferred within battalion when he broke down and cried after he had to carry the pig (M60) in Jungle Training. He was medivaced and was gone from unit before we got back.
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