Posted on Mar 31, 2015
Do officers have more difficulty transitioning to civilian life after 20 years?
4.74K
19
16
1
1
0
This question has several fronts and reasons.
Becoming a military officer is one of the most respected positions in the US.
The military officer earns his respect, and is respected with titles like, Sir and Captain....all that stops when you end your career.
Is it more difficult for an officer to transition to civilian life then the difficulty an enlisted person would experience? We live in a very disrespectful society, and I would imagine there are a dozen situations per year where you would want to choke someone by the way they are acting or being overtly disrespectful.
"Sir", the official greeting is a title of yesteryear...no one uses that any more...unless you grew up in the south. Manners and etiquette have all been brushed aside in an attempt to level the playing field, not make any one man better than another. Not all officers are arrogant, but again is transitioning to civilian world difficult because you spent 20,30,40 years being respected because of your title and position and decision-making power? Just curious...seems like it would. Obviously this is for officers that have over 20 or more years under their belt. I wonder how many retired officers are on RP?
Becoming a military officer is one of the most respected positions in the US.
The military officer earns his respect, and is respected with titles like, Sir and Captain....all that stops when you end your career.
Is it more difficult for an officer to transition to civilian life then the difficulty an enlisted person would experience? We live in a very disrespectful society, and I would imagine there are a dozen situations per year where you would want to choke someone by the way they are acting or being overtly disrespectful.
"Sir", the official greeting is a title of yesteryear...no one uses that any more...unless you grew up in the south. Manners and etiquette have all been brushed aside in an attempt to level the playing field, not make any one man better than another. Not all officers are arrogant, but again is transitioning to civilian world difficult because you spent 20,30,40 years being respected because of your title and position and decision-making power? Just curious...seems like it would. Obviously this is for officers that have over 20 or more years under their belt. I wonder how many retired officers are on RP?
Posted in these groups: 
Transition
Transition
Posted 11 y ago
Responses: 8
4
4
0
2
2
0
I mean no disrespect whatsoever, but this consideration helped drive my thinking about transitioning at 8 years vs 20.
(2)
(0)
SSG(P) (Join to see)
Elaborate Sir, did it work. I had trouble transitioning to civilian work after only 7 yrs, 3 month in the Suck....so can't imagine 20 years....but as a Reservist now, at 18.5 yrs it's been a lot easier.
(0)
(0)
Capt Richard I P.
SSG(P) (Join to see) Unfortunately I can't yet elaborate on any success. I have yet to execute separation so right now its a theory only. I do subscribe to the idea that the longer you do things in one way the harder it is to change that. Old dogs and new tricks. I know now I am spoiled by the high quality of people I work with and that I am given more credit off the bat than I would be based solely on my appearance (the only real qualifier in a cold meet in the civilian world) than I will be in the 'real world.' I have broader tools to reward and punish and a better sense of dedication to mission. I'm going to lose a lot of those.
I'm going to transition, so are we all, whether after 4 years or 30 we all transition back to the 'real' world. I'm worried if I don't do it now it will be much harder later, and I'm worried people on the outside will look at me as institutionalized and not worth re-training. Now, I've got some valuable experience but I'm young enough to learn new tricks and bring value to your company for years to come.
I'm going to transition, so are we all, whether after 4 years or 30 we all transition back to the 'real' world. I'm worried if I don't do it now it will be much harder later, and I'm worried people on the outside will look at me as institutionalized and not worth re-training. Now, I've got some valuable experience but I'm young enough to learn new tricks and bring value to your company for years to come.
(2)
(0)
2
2
0
While I can not speak for the officers, I do not think it is any more difficult for an officer than for an NCO...maybe different, but not more difficult.
(2)
(0)
MSG Brad Sand
@SSG (P) Michael LoGiudice DC
Short timers and lifers each have their challenges...they are just different. For me, the retirement hitting the bank each month...today...it made things a bit simpler, but I still remember walking into a classroom and thinking "WTF, don't these students know they are supposed to stand up...oh yeah, they don't do that anymore."
I still find it hard to explain to people about what the veteran is bring to the table. They just don't get it.
Short timers and lifers each have their challenges...they are just different. For me, the retirement hitting the bank each month...today...it made things a bit simpler, but I still remember walking into a classroom and thinking "WTF, don't these students know they are supposed to stand up...oh yeah, they don't do that anymore."
I still find it hard to explain to people about what the veteran is bring to the table. They just don't get it.
(1)
(0)
1
1
0
My case may be the minority but I would say not. Since becoming an officer came with a degree that has helped me in my transition.
(1)
(0)
1
1
0
Again, I am odd (compared to an AC Officer) in that transitioning for me will be "going to the same job I've been doing for years and stopping that Army stuff." So I will go off of my observations of the two cultures and absurd things I've heard retiring Officers saying over the last few months.
First, the baseline of respect is enormously different between the military and civilian worlds. Sir, Ma'am/Standing when the boss enters the room, 2 steps behind, all that stuff. It doesn't exist in the civilian world.
(I actually kind of have the same problem in reverse every time I come on active duty. I have a very informal work environment, and it would never occur to myself to jump to my feet because the Agency Director walked into my office.)
Second is ingrained positional authority. People deferring to your opinion based on your rank, being able to overrule other people's decisions based on your position. People taking ALL of your input seriously, even when everyone knows its out of your lane...
The civilian world definitely has role power - the boss is in charge and CAN fire you. But it has a completely different flavor than that of "respect the rank."
Third is place on the pecking order. This is a bit different from #2. In the military, your rank pretty much determines approximately where you are going to fall in the food chain, even when you change jobs. If you are a signal MAJ, you are not the guy swapping circuit boards or installing the software updates. If you a signal MAJ and you go to a Trans unit, you aren't turning wrenches. You are a MAJ doing a MAJ job....
This is so ingrained that a lot of military people don't get that that is exactly how it DOESN'T work in the rest of the world. A lot of Officers, once they hit CPT are used to NEVER BEING THE FNG. There is an unstated assumption among many that they will apply for a few positions that they have evaluated as being roughly equivalent to their rank (based mostly on the pay and position in the org chart), obviously get two or three offers and take the best one. In CAN work that way, especially if the Officer was actually performing at a high level and the job market favors the seeker at the time. But it doesn't always. When it doesn't, it can challenge that Officer's conception of themselves.
I don't think it's necessarily intentional, it is just part of the background of stuff that they know without thinking about - like the mechanics of driving a car. That's just how the world "works." I even see this in people who actually know better. I am thinking here of one recent retiree, whom I counseled (used in the civilian meaning here!!) before he retired. He basically said "yeah, I get that they'll have to start me in the mailroom, but they'll promote me based on my merits and I'll have a corner office in 6 months." Well, I saw him yesterday (not quite six months later), and turns out that's not how it works.
Fourth, they (I think this is especially true of ALL Active Component members, not just Officers - But I think because of the numbers, it is a more stark change for the Os) don't realize just how much all of the various military benefits and allowances add to their bottom line and quality of life. I did a fairly decent analysis a while back on another thread recently (don't remember exactly where), but the math worked out that in order for a MAJ with 15-18 YOS to make the same quality of life, they would need to earn a total compensation (pay + all benefits) of roughly $180K. Very few jobs do that. This is more a concern for the QSP/QMP guys, since if you retire you have your military pension & benefits to pick up a fair amount of that slack. Nonetheless, they often look just at base pay and expect that they should make what they did when leaving active duty. They are often unpleasantly surprised.
NOTE: None of this should be read as "woe for retiring Officers." If they've earned a retirement, they have a pretty decent pension to help cushion the transition. However, they tend to minimize the impact of the transition because they are no longer used to being the FNG, are used to a certain status, and are uprooted from a culture that they understood their place in. When they encounter reality, it can be quite jarring.
First, the baseline of respect is enormously different between the military and civilian worlds. Sir, Ma'am/Standing when the boss enters the room, 2 steps behind, all that stuff. It doesn't exist in the civilian world.
(I actually kind of have the same problem in reverse every time I come on active duty. I have a very informal work environment, and it would never occur to myself to jump to my feet because the Agency Director walked into my office.)
Second is ingrained positional authority. People deferring to your opinion based on your rank, being able to overrule other people's decisions based on your position. People taking ALL of your input seriously, even when everyone knows its out of your lane...
The civilian world definitely has role power - the boss is in charge and CAN fire you. But it has a completely different flavor than that of "respect the rank."
Third is place on the pecking order. This is a bit different from #2. In the military, your rank pretty much determines approximately where you are going to fall in the food chain, even when you change jobs. If you are a signal MAJ, you are not the guy swapping circuit boards or installing the software updates. If you a signal MAJ and you go to a Trans unit, you aren't turning wrenches. You are a MAJ doing a MAJ job....
This is so ingrained that a lot of military people don't get that that is exactly how it DOESN'T work in the rest of the world. A lot of Officers, once they hit CPT are used to NEVER BEING THE FNG. There is an unstated assumption among many that they will apply for a few positions that they have evaluated as being roughly equivalent to their rank (based mostly on the pay and position in the org chart), obviously get two or three offers and take the best one. In CAN work that way, especially if the Officer was actually performing at a high level and the job market favors the seeker at the time. But it doesn't always. When it doesn't, it can challenge that Officer's conception of themselves.
I don't think it's necessarily intentional, it is just part of the background of stuff that they know without thinking about - like the mechanics of driving a car. That's just how the world "works." I even see this in people who actually know better. I am thinking here of one recent retiree, whom I counseled (used in the civilian meaning here!!) before he retired. He basically said "yeah, I get that they'll have to start me in the mailroom, but they'll promote me based on my merits and I'll have a corner office in 6 months." Well, I saw him yesterday (not quite six months later), and turns out that's not how it works.
Fourth, they (I think this is especially true of ALL Active Component members, not just Officers - But I think because of the numbers, it is a more stark change for the Os) don't realize just how much all of the various military benefits and allowances add to their bottom line and quality of life. I did a fairly decent analysis a while back on another thread recently (don't remember exactly where), but the math worked out that in order for a MAJ with 15-18 YOS to make the same quality of life, they would need to earn a total compensation (pay + all benefits) of roughly $180K. Very few jobs do that. This is more a concern for the QSP/QMP guys, since if you retire you have your military pension & benefits to pick up a fair amount of that slack. Nonetheless, they often look just at base pay and expect that they should make what they did when leaving active duty. They are often unpleasantly surprised.
NOTE: None of this should be read as "woe for retiring Officers." If they've earned a retirement, they have a pretty decent pension to help cushion the transition. However, they tend to minimize the impact of the transition because they are no longer used to being the FNG, are used to a certain status, and are uprooted from a culture that they understood their place in. When they encounter reality, it can be quite jarring.
(1)
(0)
SSG(P) (Join to see)
I don't think civilians have the same harsh reality moment like a life might....are there transition suggestions for retirees from those that have been there. For me, transitioning to a reserve element helps me slow down and also keep my camaraderie and connectedness.
(0)
(0)
1
1
0
SSG (ret) William Martin
I understand why its done though because sometimes you need to practice where ever and when ever you can.
(0)
(0)
0
0
0
My personal theory on this is that I think while transitioning is very difficult no matter who you are, I think officers have a better success rate simply from being officers. when you look at a civilian resume, and the applicant lists that he was a junior enlisted, or perhaps an NCO, and you have another Applicant that puts down that he was an officer, I think the officer is more likely to get looked at, especially for better paying positions especially in areas of management.
Im a retired NCO and no one looks at the fact that I have 4 years of supervisory experience as an NCO. However should an Officer especially Captain or higher apply for the same management position, they will have a higher chance of getting it.
The only issue I see with officers trying to transition over is depending on the position they are applying for, they run a higher risk of being told that they are overqualified for the job. To sum it up, E6 and below struggle more in the civilian world, Senior NCOs are mildly more successful. Officers are by far the most successful although the also run a higher risk of rejection.
Im a retired NCO and no one looks at the fact that I have 4 years of supervisory experience as an NCO. However should an Officer especially Captain or higher apply for the same management position, they will have a higher chance of getting it.
The only issue I see with officers trying to transition over is depending on the position they are applying for, they run a higher risk of being told that they are overqualified for the job. To sum it up, E6 and below struggle more in the civilian world, Senior NCOs are mildly more successful. Officers are by far the most successful although the also run a higher risk of rejection.
(0)
(0)
0
0
0
I cant talk on the officer side yet since Ive just begun my career after coming from the civilian work force. However I can touch on my dad who is a SgtMaj with 22 years in and still going strong. All I know is that he will have a hard transition, as he feels that he is not in synch with society, and I believe that is a problem everyone who spends 15+ years in will face, regardless of rank.
(0)
(0)
Read This Next
Continue with Facebook 
Continue with Google