Posted on Jan 8, 2015
Does every MOS/Rate need the same level of fitness? What about an MOS/Rate specific PT test or events?
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I really hope this happens. Not all MOS require the same level of Fitness. I wouldn't use it for an promotion packet against all MOSs as it wouldn't be the same for everyone but I would like to see additional events that address some of the specific tasks that are measures of fitness for some MOSs. For infantry I would add pull ups or even a ruck. If you were a mechanics you might have to be able to hand carry a certain weight over a short distance. I would let senior NCOs in that MOS decide what they would require. The Army should not make every MOS have a different tst. This would impossible. But an example of how this would look is that any one in combat arms or in a combat arms unit would be required to perform pulls and a ruck. If you were in a field medical or medical support unit you may have to do a body drag.
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Be advised. The standard should not be LOWERED. The base APFT with 180 should not be lowered. I think it should be higher. I think it should be especially higher for some areas, such as the combat arms. What this would look like is using the standard test for everyone but adding an additional event. So if you are a soldier that doesn't much physical labor you wouldn't be effected by this. If you were a combat engineer in the 82ND you would be required to a bit more.
*****************************EDITED*************************************
Be advised. The standard should not be LOWERED. The base APFT with 180 should not be lowered. I think it should be higher. I think it should be especially higher for some areas, such as the combat arms. What this would look like is using the standard test for everyone but adding an additional event. So if you are a soldier that doesn't much physical labor you wouldn't be effected by this. If you were a combat engineer in the 82ND you would be required to a bit more.
MOS
APFT
Fitness
Edited 9 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 198
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I think there should be one standard for everyone on the APFT. However, I think it would make sense to have a separate skills test for certain MOS's that are physically demanding. If you can't meet the physical demands of your job, it should be reclass.
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CPT (Join to see)
That is exactly what I would be looking for. I think there should be a higher expectation of fitness in some MOSs. It is realistic. It is fair, it doesn't matter when you go to combat. We all go to war but Infantry do a bit more than the standard soldier.
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the thing in the Marines that got me was SNCO's who couldn't pass swim qual.
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I tend to see it like this
When the tires on my car start losing their tread I go and get them replaced. The same brand, size, all at the same time. I'm sure most folks do this too. It's basic common sense. Nobody wants to risk a flat tire or blow out on their commute or trip or whatever.
If you begin to divide levels of readiness based on MOS then you are putting four different sets of tires on your vehicle. You might get to where you want to go, but it wont be a smooth ride.
When the tires on my car start losing their tread I go and get them replaced. The same brand, size, all at the same time. I'm sure most folks do this too. It's basic common sense. Nobody wants to risk a flat tire or blow out on their commute or trip or whatever.
If you begin to divide levels of readiness based on MOS then you are putting four different sets of tires on your vehicle. You might get to where you want to go, but it wont be a smooth ride.
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So if you get a new car would you keep the same tires? What if you get Jeep that is supposed to go off road?
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Cpl Aaron Nelson
Yea tires is a bad analogy but I didn't want to retype it all. Either way you're just splitting hairs now. The make and model doesn't matter. Some people do use retreads In lieu of new.
How about a table. Let's say I just built a table. I've stained and treated the legs, but not the top. Which is going to wear out first?
Fact is you are attempting to lower the standards for the individual, not require the individual to raise their level of excellency. You might as well say "its ok POG, you can be a shitbird."
How about a table. Let's say I just built a table. I've stained and treated the legs, but not the top. Which is going to wear out first?
Fact is you are attempting to lower the standards for the individual, not require the individual to raise their level of excellency. You might as well say "its ok POG, you can be a shitbird."
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The Army has something similar to an MOS specific APFT that is conducted by the Occupational Therapy medical field with a referral from a Soldier's PA/ PCM. It's called the FUNCTION CAPACITY TEST/ EVALUATION. This test is currently used for Soldiers who are attempting to return to duty (RTD) after MEB/ IDES, evidence in the MRII process and a few others. With a recommendation from ones Commander it has the capability of allowing a Soldier to be retained or potentially allowing a Soldier to be retained in a new MOS in demonstrating MOS specific physical ability.
http://www.ebooksde.org/pdf/functional-capacity-evaluation-in-army.html
http://www.ebooksde.org/pdf/functional-capacity-evaluation-in-army.html
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Hey LT, are you saying that if you put a standard for your men to meet that they wouldn't train and meet that standard? If you want your men to be able to do pull ups after a pt test, put the standard out there and have them do it. Think it's a great idea take it to the captain, he can make it a company standard. He thinks it's great he can take it to the BC and implemented for that bat. No need to change standards when units can do it for themselves.
I know crazy right? Not really its been going on off the books for a long time, just like all the cold weather gear we get issued but can't wear. Units have the power to change standards for themselves without involving the whole army.
I know crazy right? Not really its been going on off the books for a long time, just like all the cold weather gear we get issued but can't wear. Units have the power to change standards for themselves without involving the whole army.
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I am aware that many units already do this. I was in a unit that had a 270 pt standard. But it is not common among all units and if this unofficial standard were to become official it would clear up a few things. If a SGT, Infantry team leader, only scores a 186 on the APFT should you send them to the board for SSG. We both know that is pretty bad but he is still passing. You really can't use that against him.
In addition it would apply to everyone in said unit. If it was an infantry company the docs, FO, and anyone else would have to meet the same standard. I only makes sense. With commands officers come and go. What one commander does won't stay there forever. Another commander can change it. If policy were made it can't be altered. For me I am looking at XO, Staff, CO, then maybe an instructor or Staff again. The policy may just go away at a company level. And in a Combined Arms Battalion it may be challenging to talk the BC into that if they are not infantry.
In addition it would apply to everyone in said unit. If it was an infantry company the docs, FO, and anyone else would have to meet the same standard. I only makes sense. With commands officers come and go. What one commander does won't stay there forever. Another commander can change it. If policy were made it can't be altered. For me I am looking at XO, Staff, CO, then maybe an instructor or Staff again. The policy may just go away at a company level. And in a Combined Arms Battalion it may be challenging to talk the BC into that if they are not infantry.
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SGT (Join to see)
If that soldier was an outstanding leader, did well in NCOER of the month board, or some other qualifications that put him as a great NCO sure. A PT stud doesn't mean he's a good NCO. If he's counseled that he won't be sent to the board till he reaches a standard then he can be kept from going. You can't use an argument of whether a soldier deserves promotion off one thing when there are several things to consider in coming to that decision.
You are right that unit standards are changing as leaders change but I think as a whole the combat arms units are requiring stricter requirements for PT then minimums and will continue to be the case. I think in mixed units you would just breed animosity between soldier who have to meet the different standards. We are all soldiers and if units want higher standards it should stay at unit level.
You are right that unit standards are changing as leaders change but I think as a whole the combat arms units are requiring stricter requirements for PT then minimums and will continue to be the case. I think in mixed units you would just breed animosity between soldier who have to meet the different standards. We are all soldiers and if units want higher standards it should stay at unit level.
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I think all service members should have to do the same physical fitness test. I also believe that every service member should have to do a MOS physical test as well. Let's just say that I'm some young buck that wants to whoop but as an ranger. I should have to carry tons of weight and all that jazz. If I was wanting to do aviation the I should have to do something else in that field. We should keep the standard the same across the board, but have something a little extra for the different need'S per their MOS. Does an office clerk need to hump a rucksack 12 miles knowing they only need to move around 400-600 feet a day. Not picking on those office heroes, butt let's be real.
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Thanks for being so candid. I see it the same way. I think we are losing ourselves in the grandiose of it all. Not everyone is special and should be held to the same standard. What is wrong with holding some to a higher standard. We do it already.
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1SG (Join to see)
Honestly, we as a hole are getting softer due to the " I can do it just as well as he/she can" aligations from the ones what just canny physically do it. We all have our mental and physical limits. I hops anyone and everyone that tries to better themselves and try those demanding MOS'S have much success. We are in a world where gender doesn't matter anymore. I'm really glad to see that everyone has the chance to whoop that but.
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Hell yes we all need the same PT test! Terrorists dont pause to ask what mos you have so they know to what level then can emgage you! I think everyone should be able to keep the EIB ruck standard too!
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I agree with you on the ruck also. When it comes to being attacked I also agree. But we don't even do that. A 18 year old female only has to do 19 push ups compared to 42 that a male has to do. I think if we all should be exposed to fighting there should be the same standard. On a side note. Can you explain the down vote. You, disagree I think?
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SPC Corey Johnson
I do disagree with you initial statement that we need the new mos based pt test. Im a little new to using this site and i figured thumbs up= agreement/like and alternatly a thumbs down would= disagreement/unlike. I think its this kind of mind set is going to be detramental to the army. Softer is not better! Enforcing the standards is what has gotten us through all of the conflicts we have been in this far, not relaxing them so that peoe can think they are doing better. What is going to happen when pvt snuffy whos a finance clerk is on a convoy somewhere and gets hit by an ied or sniper fire amd has to pull somone out of a burning truck or out of a hatch? Its ok, he passed his "finance clerk" mos PT test. Wrong answer!
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Bad idea. I'm a JAG, but if I'm in a convoy and get hit with an IED, it's on me to pull people out of a burning vehicle. Plus, physical fitness is a great equalizer in the Service. We all hit a standard. If we want to exceed it, we can. That's why I have Airborne and Air Assault wings. My 2 cents.
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How do you feel about females having to much less in the Army APFT? Should they be held to the same standard as the males?
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I think people are also forgetting that pt help with mental issues and physical issues! The standards shouldn't change across the board they should be enforced more frequently.
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Good Question. The best way to address it though would be a reminder when all else fails if you are a Soldier or a Marine you are a Rifleman same goes for the Navy when all else fails you are a Fireman and in both situations a certain degree of Physical Fitness is Required.
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