Posted on Apr 12, 2015
Does God exist? Or, is there a God?
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What are the best arguments for or against the existence of God?
I mean an omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent, omnibenevolent Supreme Being -- the eternally and necessarily extant Creator of the universe.
Atheists, Theists, Agnostics, Polytheists, Pantheists and anyone else are all welcome to weigh in!
I'm not asking what you believe, I'm asking about the best arguments for or against the existence of God.
To clarify omnibenevolence, I mean simply 'perfect goodness,' not "the quality of being kind and generous towards everyone and everything." CH (CPT) (Join to see)
I mean an omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent, omnibenevolent Supreme Being -- the eternally and necessarily extant Creator of the universe.
Atheists, Theists, Agnostics, Polytheists, Pantheists and anyone else are all welcome to weigh in!
I'm not asking what you believe, I'm asking about the best arguments for or against the existence of God.
To clarify omnibenevolence, I mean simply 'perfect goodness,' not "the quality of being kind and generous towards everyone and everything." CH (CPT) (Join to see)
God
Religion
Atheism
Edited 9 y ago
Posted 9 y ago
Responses: 332
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I do not believe there are any gods.
As for proof, if you believe in gods, what is your proof for the countless other gods other than the one(s) you believe in? I just apply that to yours as well.
As for proof, if you believe in gods, what is your proof for the countless other gods other than the one(s) you believe in? I just apply that to yours as well.
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WO1 (Join to see)
Not proven false, does not equal true. You haven't proven false the idea that I am a magic dragon, who is typing to you under this avatar, it does not make it true. Your proof is not a proof.
The resurrection has not been proven, and it hasn't been for nearly 2,000 years. There is plenty of evidence that disputes it. The lack of Roman records, no non-Christian sources acknowledging or affirming the existence of the man, let a lone a man who might be the son of god from the time period by contemporaries. Meanwhile plenty of historical people from before famous Greeks, Romans, Arabs, Asians, etc. are talked about cross culturally. Even if Jesus did exist, it doesn't mean he was the son of god, it doesn't disprove, Allah, Ra, Vishnu, Odin, or any of the thousands of other gods.
You could be right, but you have yet to demonstrate any proof.
Until then I am a magic dragon.
The resurrection has not been proven, and it hasn't been for nearly 2,000 years. There is plenty of evidence that disputes it. The lack of Roman records, no non-Christian sources acknowledging or affirming the existence of the man, let a lone a man who might be the son of god from the time period by contemporaries. Meanwhile plenty of historical people from before famous Greeks, Romans, Arabs, Asians, etc. are talked about cross culturally. Even if Jesus did exist, it doesn't mean he was the son of god, it doesn't disprove, Allah, Ra, Vishnu, Odin, or any of the thousands of other gods.
You could be right, but you have yet to demonstrate any proof.
Until then I am a magic dragon.
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SPC Elijah J. Henry, MBA
WO1 (Join to see) "The resurrection has not been proven."
Look up Simon Greenleaf. He was an agnostic, at first. He held three honorary Doctor of Laws degrees, including one from Harvard, where he was a principal founder of the Law School. He was a foremost expert on evidence, and he concluded that the Resurrection was among the most proven events in history.
I'm quite surprised that you would say "even if Jesus did exist," since no serious student of history can deny a historical Jesus.
Look up Simon Greenleaf. He was an agnostic, at first. He held three honorary Doctor of Laws degrees, including one from Harvard, where he was a principal founder of the Law School. He was a foremost expert on evidence, and he concluded that the Resurrection was among the most proven events in history.
I'm quite surprised that you would say "even if Jesus did exist," since no serious student of history can deny a historical Jesus.
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SPC D W
"it was IMPOSSIBLE that the apostles could have persisted in affirming the truths they had narrated, had not JESUS CHRIST ACTUALLY RISEN FROM THE DEAD, . . ."(Simon Greenleaf, An Examination of the Testimony of the Four Evangelists by the Rules of Evidence Administered in the Courts of Justice, p.29).
WO1 (Join to see):
You claim there are no non-Christian sources acknowledging or affirming the existence of the man.... That's quite an anti-historical position.
Bart Erhman, non-Christian historian, says he has never met a serious historian who doubts the existence of Jesus the man, and ironically his first piece of evidence FOR Jesus are Paul's letters, and Paul himself.
Why would you be ignorant of such an important piece of information such as that?
Even more interesting, is why you are unaware of the dozens of non-Christians sources that DO testify to the existence of Jesus...
But, given your comments, I suspect you will "tl;dr" and then give some lame excuse why it's not your responsibility to actually speak truth instead of lies.... A pity, really....
9 Traditional New Testament Authors
Matthew
Mark
Luke
John
Paul
Author of Hebrews
James
Peter
Jude
20 Early Christian Writers Outside the New Testament
Clement of Rome
2 Clement
Ignatius
Polycarp
Martyrdom of Polycarp
Didache
Barnabas
Shepherd of Hermas
Fragments of Papias
Justin Martyr
Aristides
Athenagoras
Theophilus of Antioch
Quadratus
Aristo of Pella
Melito of Sardis
Diognetus
Gospel of Peter
Apocalypse of Peter
Epistula Apostolorum
4 Heretical Writings
Gospel of Thomas
Gospel of Truth
Apocryphon of John
Treatise on Resurrection
9 Secular Sources
Josephus (Jewish historian)
Tacitus (Roman historian)
Pliny the Younger (Roman politician)
Phlegon (freed slave who wrote histories)
Lucian (Greek satirist)
Celsus (Roman philosopher)
Mara Bar Serapion (prisoner awaiting execution)
Suetonius
Thallus
WO1 (Join to see):
You claim there are no non-Christian sources acknowledging or affirming the existence of the man.... That's quite an anti-historical position.
Bart Erhman, non-Christian historian, says he has never met a serious historian who doubts the existence of Jesus the man, and ironically his first piece of evidence FOR Jesus are Paul's letters, and Paul himself.
Why would you be ignorant of such an important piece of information such as that?
Even more interesting, is why you are unaware of the dozens of non-Christians sources that DO testify to the existence of Jesus...
But, given your comments, I suspect you will "tl;dr" and then give some lame excuse why it's not your responsibility to actually speak truth instead of lies.... A pity, really....
9 Traditional New Testament Authors
Matthew
Mark
Luke
John
Paul
Author of Hebrews
James
Peter
Jude
20 Early Christian Writers Outside the New Testament
Clement of Rome
2 Clement
Ignatius
Polycarp
Martyrdom of Polycarp
Didache
Barnabas
Shepherd of Hermas
Fragments of Papias
Justin Martyr
Aristides
Athenagoras
Theophilus of Antioch
Quadratus
Aristo of Pella
Melito of Sardis
Diognetus
Gospel of Peter
Apocalypse of Peter
Epistula Apostolorum
4 Heretical Writings
Gospel of Thomas
Gospel of Truth
Apocryphon of John
Treatise on Resurrection
9 Secular Sources
Josephus (Jewish historian)
Tacitus (Roman historian)
Pliny the Younger (Roman politician)
Phlegon (freed slave who wrote histories)
Lucian (Greek satirist)
Celsus (Roman philosopher)
Mara Bar Serapion (prisoner awaiting execution)
Suetonius
Thallus
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SPC D W
Apologies on a slight exaggeration, I had my numbers off.... There are not "dozens" of non-Christian sources (from the contemporary time period) that testify of Jesus. I know my list of sources, and mixed up the 20 with the 9.
That said, my point is still valid. 9 is FAR greater than none.
And this is only those from near Christ's time; we haven't addressed the normal historical time frame for sources of 400-800 years after the events (consider Plutarch for Alexander the Great).
That said, my point is still valid. 9 is FAR greater than none.
And this is only those from near Christ's time; we haven't addressed the normal historical time frame for sources of 400-800 years after the events (consider Plutarch for Alexander the Great).
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Well it's simple. You can't see the air you breath, yet you know it's there! That's the way I know there is a creator. Besides have you ever seen order after disorder? Two examples:
1. If you blow up something have you ever seen order come from that? ie Big Bang theory
2. I can take my car and make anything out of that car a box, swing set, table and chairs, however I cannot create that out of nothing.
I believe in Jesus Christ my Lord and personal Savior! It's a free gift his offer of salvation. That is all. Yes I believe!
1. If you blow up something have you ever seen order come from that? ie Big Bang theory
2. I can take my car and make anything out of that car a box, swing set, table and chairs, however I cannot create that out of nothing.
I believe in Jesus Christ my Lord and personal Savior! It's a free gift his offer of salvation. That is all. Yes I believe!
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SFC A.M. Drake
Also it's not enough to believe that their is a God, the Devil believes in God and they tremble! The key question is:
He has offered the opportunity for every person to come into a personal relationship with him and accept his offer of salvation by what he has done at Calvary. That's everlasting life.
1. Believe
2. Obey him
3. Live throughout eternity with him.
Or you can go your own way and his wrath will be on you without the blood of Christ to cover you.
He has offered the opportunity for every person to come into a personal relationship with him and accept his offer of salvation by what he has done at Calvary. That's everlasting life.
1. Believe
2. Obey him
3. Live throughout eternity with him.
Or you can go your own way and his wrath will be on you without the blood of Christ to cover you.
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CW3 (Join to see)
Um, I know the air is there because of the scientific method. That's been long figured out.
You seem to be missing the body of the big bang. I would say you might want to actually read about it befoire making statements about something you don't quite seem to grasp.
Order from chaos. Yes, have you ever seen ice form? it goes from an unstable chaotic phase to an orderly, lower density state. Nice and orderly, and pretty too.
You seem to be missing the body of the big bang. I would say you might want to actually read about it befoire making statements about something you don't quite seem to grasp.
Order from chaos. Yes, have you ever seen ice form? it goes from an unstable chaotic phase to an orderly, lower density state. Nice and orderly, and pretty too.
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SFC A.M. Drake
I'm not going to debate my faith with you. You obvious have an agenda which is ok with me. So anyone can debate the physical universe all day as that is evident. What is not evident in your case is....faith!
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SFC A.M. Drake
Also I didn't want to say it but "before" you tell me I ought to read up on the Big Bang Theory....I would suggest you check your grammar "befoire" you send out your next statement of suppose fact.
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I strongly believe God does exist. If one were to take the time to look around, examples and facts are all around us. It's honestly not really something that can be put into words when you feel His presence and love in your life.
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CW3 (Join to see)
Soooo what are those examples and facts that you ahve? the rest of us can't come up with a single fact to prove his existence.........
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Yes, Elijah, God is VERY REAL and does exist. I know this for an absolute fact, I see it verified day by day. I can prove it. Read this and you will understand.
It has been said that there are no atheists in foxholes, and true or not none of us can tell. What I CAN tell is what I do know, what I have seen and heard. This is my personal experience and sorry, but not open to anyone else to interpret for me, I was there. Here Goes...
My wife, also a Soldier, went into labor with our first child 6 May, 1999. The doctors at Womack Army Medical Center found something wrong and she was MEDEVAC'd to the University of North Carolina Medical Center, Chapel Hill, NC. Those Blackhawk crew members were great to her! When I arrived, she had given birth to a daughter, but before the Doctors would let me see her, they informed us that she was going to die, that very day. I would have only part of a day with my child. I did not want to waste it. Elijah, my daughter AJ Ayscue, died right there in my arms. At the moment that I was about to slip into a depression that I may well never have come out of, I HEARD the Voice of God Almighty. He very simply said, "She is with me now. You left me but I have never left you, Why don't you come home?"
Elijah, lots of reasons I had for not trusting in God really did not matter anymore. So I hit my knees, and I prayed...Really prayed...for the first time in years. "Lord if You are willing to forgive me for all the people I have hurt, for all the things I have done, if you can forgive me for all that, then I will live for you the rest of my Life. Right there, I accepted the free gift of salvation that God gives to all that ask, in Jesus Christ.
It has been nearly 16 years and I can list things you would not believe that I have witnessed where God demonstrated His power. My daughter now was supposed to have Downes, all the tests confirmed it, but we would not abort her because we do not believe in that, so we proclaimed and trusted God would heal her, and she was born perfect. My son got a soda can pop top lodged in his throat but when the doctor had him xrayed from head to foot, not one single foreign object in his body anywhere and we know he did not cough it up nor swallow and pass it...The job I have now...the friends I have now....all a demonstration the God is real, He is here and He loves us. Just ask any of my friends on this site...they will tell you the change was real, and I am real and I mean what I say.
It has been said that there are no atheists in foxholes, and true or not none of us can tell. What I CAN tell is what I do know, what I have seen and heard. This is my personal experience and sorry, but not open to anyone else to interpret for me, I was there. Here Goes...
My wife, also a Soldier, went into labor with our first child 6 May, 1999. The doctors at Womack Army Medical Center found something wrong and she was MEDEVAC'd to the University of North Carolina Medical Center, Chapel Hill, NC. Those Blackhawk crew members were great to her! When I arrived, she had given birth to a daughter, but before the Doctors would let me see her, they informed us that she was going to die, that very day. I would have only part of a day with my child. I did not want to waste it. Elijah, my daughter AJ Ayscue, died right there in my arms. At the moment that I was about to slip into a depression that I may well never have come out of, I HEARD the Voice of God Almighty. He very simply said, "She is with me now. You left me but I have never left you, Why don't you come home?"
Elijah, lots of reasons I had for not trusting in God really did not matter anymore. So I hit my knees, and I prayed...Really prayed...for the first time in years. "Lord if You are willing to forgive me for all the people I have hurt, for all the things I have done, if you can forgive me for all that, then I will live for you the rest of my Life. Right there, I accepted the free gift of salvation that God gives to all that ask, in Jesus Christ.
It has been nearly 16 years and I can list things you would not believe that I have witnessed where God demonstrated His power. My daughter now was supposed to have Downes, all the tests confirmed it, but we would not abort her because we do not believe in that, so we proclaimed and trusted God would heal her, and she was born perfect. My son got a soda can pop top lodged in his throat but when the doctor had him xrayed from head to foot, not one single foreign object in his body anywhere and we know he did not cough it up nor swallow and pass it...The job I have now...the friends I have now....all a demonstration the God is real, He is here and He loves us. Just ask any of my friends on this site...they will tell you the change was real, and I am real and I mean what I say.
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CPT Carl Kisely
Happy is he who repays you for what you have done to us / He who seizes your infants and dashes them against the rocks. Psalm 137
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SFC (Join to see)
...implying it would be a bad thing. The bible records events in history. That does not mean those actions are condoned by G-d or his scribes!
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CPT Carl Kisely
SFC (Join to see) , maybe so, but what about the things god ordered or just did himself. God ordered genocide. God killed a woman for glancing back at a burning city, but saved her husband that used their teenage daughters for date rape fodder. Those two crimes are directly on bible god.
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SGT Anthony Rossi
Sir the events your referencing concerning Lots daughters is miss represented here. The Biblical record states it was his daughters themselves that originated the transgression. However, the whole point in the account of Lot and his family is to illustraite the depravity of mankind when they turn away from God.
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I believe God exist. No one knows all the mysteries of the universe. Scientists who have tried to disprove the existence of God only come to the conclusion that God could possibly exist. Unless you know all the mysteries of life and the universe, it would be closed-minded to deny the possibility of God's existence.
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CW3 (Join to see)
SPC Nathan Freeman -The big Bang theory was conceived by a scientist, and put to the test, verified, repeatedly to be true. Kind of the nature of human beings, to have two opposing thoughts in their brain at the same time.
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Difficult to be in the open desert, look up to the Milky Way on a moonless night and not see the face of God.
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SPC (Join to see)
Is there a constellation I'm not familiar with? Or, are you referring to a general sense of awe and wonder regarding the universe? Because if that's all, then I'm certainly on board.
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CW3 (Join to see)
Been there, been at the top of a mountain range too and stared up at the night sky and not once have I seen the face of god. I have seen the universe as it was billions of years ago as the light from those distant galaxies has finally reached my eyes. I have also seen the international space station and countless satellites, a few comets, but no face of god.
Is that only seen in the Southern hemisphere?
Is that only seen in the Southern hemisphere?
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