Posted on Feb 23, 2017
Does openly and aggressively berating or insulting people who voted for Hillary or Trump warrant an Article 134 violation under UCMJ?
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*First Edit*
There seems to be some misunderstanding: the nature of my question isn't about disrespecting or defying the POTUS, it's about when service members berate, insult or lash out at civilians, friends, peers or family members on social media or otherwise, simply because they voted for the opposite candidate.
*Second Edit*
Also, to clarify, I believe the behavior in question is wrong. I think some folks interpreted my question as asking for justification to be a jerk, but that couldn't be further from the case. I just wanted to generate discussion about people's opinions regarding whether being aggressive or hateful towards voters because of their choice was just being a crappy person, or a legitimate punitive breach of military bearing and discipline.
When President Obama won, there was a deluge of complaints, the birther movement, a different brand of "Not my president." Now that President Trump has won office, there's similar sentiment. On either side, there is a lot of aggression being thrown around. Do you feel Service Members have a higher responsibility to be respectful of the American voters, regardless of their choice?
Respect of the POTUS is a given, we're expected, as service members, to render that. My question is more in line with respecting the fellow Americans that voted; it seems antithetical to me to be aggressive and hurtful to fellow Americans, especially those that have dissenting opinions from ours, for exercising one of the fundamental rights we swore to uphold and defend.
There seems to be some misunderstanding: the nature of my question isn't about disrespecting or defying the POTUS, it's about when service members berate, insult or lash out at civilians, friends, peers or family members on social media or otherwise, simply because they voted for the opposite candidate.
*Second Edit*
Also, to clarify, I believe the behavior in question is wrong. I think some folks interpreted my question as asking for justification to be a jerk, but that couldn't be further from the case. I just wanted to generate discussion about people's opinions regarding whether being aggressive or hateful towards voters because of their choice was just being a crappy person, or a legitimate punitive breach of military bearing and discipline.
When President Obama won, there was a deluge of complaints, the birther movement, a different brand of "Not my president." Now that President Trump has won office, there's similar sentiment. On either side, there is a lot of aggression being thrown around. Do you feel Service Members have a higher responsibility to be respectful of the American voters, regardless of their choice?
Respect of the POTUS is a given, we're expected, as service members, to render that. My question is more in line with respecting the fellow Americans that voted; it seems antithetical to me to be aggressive and hurtful to fellow Americans, especially those that have dissenting opinions from ours, for exercising one of the fundamental rights we swore to uphold and defend.
Election 2016
UCMJ
Leadership
Character
Office of the President (POTUS)
Edited 9 y ago
Posted 9 y ago
Responses: 205
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We do not criminalized politics! The behavior you described is wrong, but it is free speech. Just keep your politics out of your miltary duties and don't use mititary status to support or oppose politicians or political causes.
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My experience with extreme political responses come from when I was part of a Veterans group online. During a political discussion/informal survey about who you where voting for and why, I stated that even though I disagreed with the politics of both Presidents Bush, that I felt they where basally good people who cared about the country in their own ways, however, I didn't get the same feeling about trump and wasn't going to vote for him because of that. The level of hostility I receive was just ridiculously extreme. I was called names like B*t@h, Wh***, Slut. I was told I should leave the country because I was a traitor and didn't deserve to live here. I was told that I should kill myself. I had people calling my military service into question. I finally left the group when I was threatened with death and rape by more than one person. The people making these comments where a mix of Veterans, military family members and active duty personnel.
While I had the option of leaving the group when they went to far, there are many situations where leaving isn't an option. In those cases, someone saying "I don't understand how you could vote for that person, they suck" doesn't reach the level where there should be UCMJ action. However, someone making the types of comments I was subjected to would create a very hostile environment and they should most defiantly be subjected to UCMJ action.
While I had the option of leaving the group when they went to far, there are many situations where leaving isn't an option. In those cases, someone saying "I don't understand how you could vote for that person, they suck" doesn't reach the level where there should be UCMJ action. However, someone making the types of comments I was subjected to would create a very hostile environment and they should most defiantly be subjected to UCMJ action.
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SP5 Arthur Ben Ephraim
By reason of National Security by reason of LETHAL Tran cession (sp) Pox Rx Vacc is TOP SECRET NEED TO KNOW ONLY and Bush ask for about half a million human experimentation test subject volunteers. Most POTUS give away Rx Vacc by law by taxpayer funding like candy and it is a WMD attack upon We the People.
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Your best bet is to worry more about everyday life and not some president you should be thankful that have a job and a secure pay check when I was Forced out after 16.5 years hoping
That I been retired and do the Job that I do now. so keep your self in check and start focusing on your career besides I wish I was serving my country.
SSG Mark Franzen
USA Vet
That I been retired and do the Job that I do now. so keep your self in check and start focusing on your career besides I wish I was serving my country.
SSG Mark Franzen
USA Vet
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You believe what you want to believe. I don't have to agree, and neither do you. That's the beauty of this country. Acting like and ass, because someone doesn't think like you (politically) is just stupid on your part. Running your mouth, is one thing; if you get physical due to your belief, then UCMJ action should apply! Opinions are like assholes; we ALL have them and they ALL stink!
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It is fine to have an adult conversation but to berate or degrade a fellow service member by their choice is unbecoming if it escalates.It merely shows how the military has lost a tremendous amount of common respect in the ranks these days.
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My answer is yes. The POTUS is also CINC. Therefore he falls in with Chain of Command. Disrespecting him is Disrespecting a Senior Officer thereby 134 or Art.92 would apply.
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Even though the POTUS is our Commander in Chief, when we are at war, the President still deserves the respect of the office. This was done when Barack Obama was in office the same with both of the Bush's. Several of our presidents in the current past has shown better leadership than others, but still they are basically the boss.
As far as discussing politics in the work place. I have always worked under the attitude that it is to be left at the door. Some business' have it as a actual 'no no' and you may be fired for it. I think the NFL should use this approach to get to the bottom of their problem since the football field is their work place.
If you want to discuss politics, it should always be off the job site and never at work no matter what your think of Hillary of Trump.
As far as discussing politics in the work place. I have always worked under the attitude that it is to be left at the door. Some business' have it as a actual 'no no' and you may be fired for it. I think the NFL should use this approach to get to the bottom of their problem since the football field is their work place.
If you want to discuss politics, it should always be off the job site and never at work no matter what your think of Hillary of Trump.
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So many in uniform talking mad ugly words on FB while still serving, yes you have an opinion but it should not be on any social media period or voiced. I do wonder why no one is doing anything about it. I guess when I served it was very strict on some things and other things were ignored maybe its business as usual.
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