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Posted in these groups: 
Election 2016
Donald Trump
Election 2016 Donald Trump
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 87
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I am just befuddled how someone can view someone's opinion as treason...my head hurts from reading what amounts to another vitriolic attack on anything and everything Republican by the poster...smdh.....
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Capt Walter Miller
President Lincoln knew better.
"Take the particular case mentioned by the meeting. They assert [It is asserted] in substance that Mr. Vallandigham was by a military commander, seized and tried "for no other reason than words addressed to a public meeting, in criticism of the course of the administration, and in condemnation of the military orders of that general'' Now, if there be no mistake about this -- if this assertion is the truth and the whole truth -- if there was no other reason for the arrest, then I concede that the arrest was wrong. But the arrest, as I understand, was made for a very different reason. Mr. Vallandigham avows his hostility to the war on the part of the Union; and his arrest was made because he was laboring, with some effect, to prevent the raising of troops, to encourage desertions from the army, and to leave the rebellion without an adequate military force to suppress it. He was not arrested because he was damaging the political prospects of the administration, or the personal interests of the commanding general; but because he was damaging the army, upon the existence, and vigor of which, the life of the nation depends. He was warring upon the military; and this gave the military constitutional jurisdiction to lay hands upon him."
http://www.abrahamlincolnonline.org/lincoln/speeches/corning.htm
Vallandigham was damaging the military power of the United States. He was arrested. Trump is damaging our ability to resist ISIS by helping them to incite people to attack us. It is exactly the same concept.
Walt
"Take the particular case mentioned by the meeting. They assert [It is asserted] in substance that Mr. Vallandigham was by a military commander, seized and tried "for no other reason than words addressed to a public meeting, in criticism of the course of the administration, and in condemnation of the military orders of that general'' Now, if there be no mistake about this -- if this assertion is the truth and the whole truth -- if there was no other reason for the arrest, then I concede that the arrest was wrong. But the arrest, as I understand, was made for a very different reason. Mr. Vallandigham avows his hostility to the war on the part of the Union; and his arrest was made because he was laboring, with some effect, to prevent the raising of troops, to encourage desertions from the army, and to leave the rebellion without an adequate military force to suppress it. He was not arrested because he was damaging the political prospects of the administration, or the personal interests of the commanding general; but because he was damaging the army, upon the existence, and vigor of which, the life of the nation depends. He was warring upon the military; and this gave the military constitutional jurisdiction to lay hands upon him."
http://www.abrahamlincolnonline.org/lincoln/speeches/corning.htm
Vallandigham was damaging the military power of the United States. He was arrested. Trump is damaging our ability to resist ISIS by helping them to incite people to attack us. It is exactly the same concept.
Walt
Letter by Abraham Lincoln to Erastus Corning
Horace Greeley, editor of the influential New York Tribune, said the letter was "the most masterly document that ever came from his pen. I doubt that Webster could have done better -- I am sure he could not have so clearly and so forcibly appealed to the average apprehension of his countrymen..."
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SPC Brendan Kearns
Just to point out, at that time the right of habitus corpus and quite a few other rights were suspended at the time bye Lincoln using what was arguably one of the biggest overreaches ever committed by a president
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SPC (Join to see)
SPC Brendan Kearns - NTM, Lincoln Incorporated our country (putting it into Law of Sea Jurisdiction and out of the Law of the Land) ...he was a lawyer remember!
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Freedom of Speech, 1st Amendment, US Constitution.
Words do not provide material "aid and comfort to the enemy", no matter how ill-advised they are.
If you don't like what he has to say, don't vote for him. It is pretty simple.
I only hope that my choices are not Hillary or Trump.
If you'll indulge me for a moment, let's explore the logical consequences of such a ban on immigration.
Let's say that Trump is elected, enacts this ban, it somehow passes Constitutional muster, and he builds a border wall.
People who already hate us and are members of ISIL will continue to do so.
New recruits may be spawned by this, but I think honestly the effect is negligible. Far more motivating is the military action we take in the Middle East.
Since "all Muslims" are banned from entry, they'd have to sneak in. Since the Southern wall will be the "best wall ever (!), they'll have to come in through Canada or any of the numerous ports of entry on the coast.
Let's just say that Trump can lock all of that down (he can't). The obvious threat in this eventuality is the same as it is now - that the real threat is from radicalized individuals already within our borders.
Basically, Trump is trumpeting (pun intended) the precise counterpoint to the President's "save the women and children" rhetoric. Both are poorly formed and undoubtedly poorly executed ideas.
Words do not provide material "aid and comfort to the enemy", no matter how ill-advised they are.
If you don't like what he has to say, don't vote for him. It is pretty simple.
I only hope that my choices are not Hillary or Trump.
If you'll indulge me for a moment, let's explore the logical consequences of such a ban on immigration.
Let's say that Trump is elected, enacts this ban, it somehow passes Constitutional muster, and he builds a border wall.
People who already hate us and are members of ISIL will continue to do so.
New recruits may be spawned by this, but I think honestly the effect is negligible. Far more motivating is the military action we take in the Middle East.
Since "all Muslims" are banned from entry, they'd have to sneak in. Since the Southern wall will be the "best wall ever (!), they'll have to come in through Canada or any of the numerous ports of entry on the coast.
Let's just say that Trump can lock all of that down (he can't). The obvious threat in this eventuality is the same as it is now - that the real threat is from radicalized individuals already within our borders.
Basically, Trump is trumpeting (pun intended) the precise counterpoint to the President's "save the women and children" rhetoric. Both are poorly formed and undoubtedly poorly executed ideas.
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1SG (Join to see)
Capt Walter Miller, you thought you were wrong, but posted anyway?
What are you, an agent provocateur?
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What are you, an agent provocateur?
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Capt Jeff S.
MAD - Spy vs Spy - Season 1 Complete (Download in Description)
Wait -.- For The Download Please! :) 41Mb! In HD, FLV Format :P
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CW3 Jim Norris
Well, a nation that cannot control it's border isn't actually a nation, is it? - 15-30 million illegal aliens currently resident within the borders of the Continental United States (CONUS) - Alaska and Hawaii don't seem to have much of an issue here....seems to indicate that some form of security - other than that which now exists along our southern border with Mexico needs to be instituted - perhaps a wall, perhaps simply actual enforcement of already existing law - which would include withholding federal dollars from any local jurisdiction not complying with federal immigration law...Or here's another plan - just dissolve the nation and let whomever, from wherever come and take residence? I would recommend that we return to a immigration policy that is beneficial to this nation be followed - you know, you're a rocket scientist or particle physics genius you get a green card and citizenship...etc. However we cannot continue to spend billions of dollars to take in the worlds poor - first off it will not fix 'poor' and it will destroy the last best hope of mankind - this nation. Let me recommend the following you tube video -
Immigration, World Poverty and Gumballs - NumbersUSA.com
Shows how exactly this is going to go.....
Immigration, World Poverty and Gumballs - NumbersUSA.com
Shows how exactly this is going to go.....
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PO1 William "Chip" Nagel
CPT L S - Spy vs Spy, I hung up my Cloak and Dagger 18 years ago. I'm retired Thank You Very Much.
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Walter, what Trump said was wrong and has ramifications of its own. However, you pose a severe logical fallacy to infer zealous misguided patriotism is treason. At worst it is bad judgement. I do become concerned about your posit on the matter because of your command level. In my professional opinion I would recommend you unplug the terror tube (tv) for two weeks and put your ear to the deck to listen to what's going on around you. Talk with your men about their lives and families. Talk with ops and make sure you're running as finely tuned as possible. Take some extra time to do pt with the men/women. This posit of yours indicates that current politics may adversely influence your processing and may otherwise cause you to have predisposition on decisions that could affect personnel or other actions. It would be woeful to let politics of the sheeple affect us as more than hot air. Time focused tending our immediate responsibilities is paramount at this time.
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CPL(P) (Join to see)
You guys are great for keeping it light hearted. The nation is drunk with taking the wrong things too seriously and this barrage of wonderful banter is a reminder of how we all are not a mirror for the sheeple. To quote a 2nd battalion ranger I asked about his thought on USAF SOF, he said, "PJs are awesome, they are the ones that rescue us when we're in trouble." Another fun thing to think about is there are more planes in the navy than air force, and more ships in the army than navy. We have a very confused military perhaps.
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Capt Jeff S.
PO1 John Miller - We don't borrow Navy lingo. We had to learn it to talk to Sailors in a language they understand. And besides, it's a part of our Sea Service heritage and tradition.
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Capt Jeff S.
I got to work with the Army CBRN folks and let's just say they aren't at the top of the list when it comes to the Army's best units. My unit (CBIRF) did a few exercises with them and they got tired of us making them look like the "B" team. Our L/Cpl's knew more about chemical detection and identification than their officers did. They would do okay at the exercises, and we would do just a little better. They would see what we did and the next time we would see them, they would be about as capable as we were... but by then we had upped our game and moved on. We weren't going out of our way to try to show them up or poke them in the eye; we were simply there doing what we were supposed to do, to the best of our ability, and we kept improving. The CBRN folks found themselves playing catch up with us, and rather than raising their game, they started shmoozing the FBI and tried to get us disinvited from exercises they were in. Just before I retired and the unit moved from Camp Lejeune NC up to Indian Head MD, the last big FBI exercise we did was Westwind. That was about 16 years ago... I can't speak to what the unit has done since they moved up to Indian Head.
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Capt Jeff S.
PO1 John Miller - The Marine in the Dress Blues needs to square himself away. Check out the EGA on his cover!
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If you want to follow that same thread of thought the president should be immediately impeached and charged with treason for trying to open our borders to military aged males Siriain refugees.
But both aren't and can't happen. Let's put aside the first amendment side of your statement and just look at it with an eye to the courtroom. Where is your proof that his statement is aiding ISIS? It's all well that you believe it but you can't prove his statements are doing such a thing. You are talking about a man passing secrets to a foreign power you ar trying to say his words gave aid and comfort to the enemy. If we use that thought process then Hillary Clinton would be charged for her email alone not to mention the Libya embassy where her actions lead to the death of American citizens.
But both aren't and can't happen. Let's put aside the first amendment side of your statement and just look at it with an eye to the courtroom. Where is your proof that his statement is aiding ISIS? It's all well that you believe it but you can't prove his statements are doing such a thing. You are talking about a man passing secrets to a foreign power you ar trying to say his words gave aid and comfort to the enemy. If we use that thought process then Hillary Clinton would be charged for her email alone not to mention the Libya embassy where her actions lead to the death of American citizens.
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Capt Jeff S.
1SG (Join to see) - You might want to take a look at the following. The question we must ask ourselves is, "Do we want to uphold the Constitution and vision of our Founding Fathers, or do we want to twist it to suit our agenda?" McCain, and Romney by strict interpretation of the term don't qualify.
http://www.birthers.org/USC/Vattel.html
I really don't think those we elected care much about the Constitution because if they did, they'd have listened to George Washington and not allowed parties and special interests to dominate our political landscape.... Congress wouldn't have abdicated fiscal responsibilities to the Federal Reserve... Congress would have heeded Jefferson's advice on borrowing, and we would not be $19 Trillion in debt... Congress would be holding the Executive responsible for enforcing the laws they created... Our borders would be secure... etc. etc.
http://www.birthers.org/USC/Vattel.html
I really don't think those we elected care much about the Constitution because if they did, they'd have listened to George Washington and not allowed parties and special interests to dominate our political landscape.... Congress wouldn't have abdicated fiscal responsibilities to the Federal Reserve... Congress would have heeded Jefferson's advice on borrowing, and we would not be $19 Trillion in debt... Congress would be holding the Executive responsible for enforcing the laws they created... Our borders would be secure... etc. etc.
Vattel’s Influence on the term Natural Born Citizen
What is a natural born citizen? Where did the framers come up with this term? Where was it used before? So many questions, and the answers are right there if anyone wishes to search out the truth.
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PO1 Todd Cousins
And to my understanding impeachment is just away to remove someone from office. They would still have to be brought up on charges and go through the Judical system afterword. There isn't anything congress can do since they make laws. It is all about division of power. Congress makes the law, the president enforces the law and the courts interpret.
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1SG (Join to see)
Capt Jeff S. - Sounds good to me, except often the alternative to the incumbent is not preferable. I had to hold my nose and vote for Michelle Bachmann for years because the alternatives that were presented stunk so bad.
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Capt Jeff S.
Y'all might want to take a gander at this...
http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/thepresidentandcabinet/a/impeachment.htm
http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/thepresidentandcabinet/a/impeachment.htm
The Process for Impeaching the President of the United States
The process of impeachment of the President of the United States.
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Capt Walter Miller Not sure how using ones 1st Amendment rights constitutes treason. However, I can see how using ones freedom of speech can make you look like an racist idiot.
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MAJ (Join to see)
Capt Walter Miller
You sir are completely demented. How to you become so biased that you equate restricting entry of non-citizen Muslims into this country with It's ok for ISIS to kill Americans. Your mindset that ISIS is attacking America due to American actions is so fundamentally and historically flawed, ISIS is committed to a world wide caliphate nothing we say or do will change or impact their views, their ideology will never allow for coexistence. They are our enemy and will always be.
You sir are completely demented. How to you become so biased that you equate restricting entry of non-citizen Muslims into this country with It's ok for ISIS to kill Americans. Your mindset that ISIS is attacking America due to American actions is so fundamentally and historically flawed, ISIS is committed to a world wide caliphate nothing we say or do will change or impact their views, their ideology will never allow for coexistence. They are our enemy and will always be.
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PO2 Mark Saffell
I would have to say IF what Trump said is Treason what the Capt is doing here does the same or more so he is also guilty of Treason. All this is Leftwing BS as usual
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SGT William Howell
Capt Walter Miller Make no mistake being and American is reason enough to get you head cut off. His statements just make him a jerk. Pretty much he opens his mouth and I get inflamed, it still is not treason.
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Capt Jeff S.
Well SGT William Howell, I hope that jerk is able to undo some of the mess that this unvetted, unqualified, poser is leaving for the next Administration. He's light years better than ANYTHING the Democrats have to offer.
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Mr Trump is certainly spouting off some craziness that many of us find disturbing but he is not committing treason. I believe many of his anti Muslim ideas are just ways to drum up the fear base of his constituents, if elected he could be impeached for trying to implement any of them as they are clearly unconstitutional.
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Capt Jeff S.
Migrant Crisis: The Footage the Media Refuses to Broadcast
Why are mainstream media outlets like CNN and BBC only broadcasting footage which shows the migrants in a positive light? http://infowars.com
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We already have a significant background check to buy any firearm in the United States, adding a list of excluded individuals will just give the government the ability to add anyone they want to the list. We can make as many laws as we want, individuals who have ill intent will always get what they need to do harm.
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Capt Walter Miller
Gun show loophole - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Gun show loophole, gun law loophole, Brady law loophole (or Brady bill loophole), private sale loophole, or private sale exemption is a political term in the United States referring to sales of firearms by private sellers, including those done at gun shows, dubbed the "secondary market".[1] The term refers to a perceived gap in the law regarding the sale or transfer of firearms between private citizens.[2] As of September 2015, 18 states and...
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CPT Gary Mattson
Good point, there is that loophole. I am not sure there is any number of laws to stop weapons from getting into the wrong hands. For example illegal drugs, there is no loophole and yet they are readily available. Even if the evil doers can't get a weapon and the rest of us loose our right to have them, can't they just drive an F-250 into a crowd outside a busy stadium, way more effective than a AK and no background check needed to to acquire one? Or maybe we should need a security check to my the most deadly weapon in the US, a motor vehicle? Thoughts?
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PO3 (Join to see)
CPT Gary Mattson - ... that is not Gun Show loophole ... that is privates sale transfer. They are just trying to shut down Gun show :P lol In my state, people sell and trade firearms everywhere, bulletin, local AD, post them at the laundry area.
Then why they use "Gun Show" loophole to address this issue? Don't that make you think?
Then why they use "Gun Show" loophole to address this issue? Don't that make you think?
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Walt: Once again your political bias is sticking out like a badly buried land mine! If you want to examine a case of treason you can start with Hillery. Really... Run the traps on that and tell me the analysis shows she is qualified to be the CinC. Snowden committed treason, Bergdhal may have committed treason, Hillery and her entire staff have committed treason, but Trump at best committed stupid. Both you and Trump need to review and understand the UCMJ.
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Capt Walter Miller
Gen. Hayden was saying the other day what I said months ago when I posted this thread.
Walt
Walt
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Unlock your head from your ass Captain. First of all it is not necessary to name call. It just lowers your credibility to that of whale dung or lower. Now to put his comments in context, he said (paraphrasing) that all immigration of mooslims must be halted until those alleged refugees can be vetted properly. A process BTW, the POTUS is trying to circumvent. If you do not want such a vetting, then I suggest the first 10K come live with you.
You need to learn to have a civil tongue. If I were your CO you'd be getting paper for conduct unbecoming. You are an officer and a gentleman only by order of Congress and so far I don't see your actions (via the comments) as representing either.
Your comments represent the hate and vitriol of the those liberals who throw names when they cannot make their case with comments based in fact.
At ease, Captain!
You need to learn to have a civil tongue. If I were your CO you'd be getting paper for conduct unbecoming. You are an officer and a gentleman only by order of Congress and so far I don't see your actions (via the comments) as representing either.
Your comments represent the hate and vitriol of the those liberals who throw names when they cannot make their case with comments based in fact.
At ease, Captain!
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