Posted on Jul 23, 2015
Have you ever been present when a weapon was accidentally discharged?
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The incident regarding the civilian firing his weapon at a recruiters office caused me to think about my own time with and around weapons. I can think of two times when a weapon was accidentally discharged. Both times the handler thought the weapon was unloaded.
http://www.policeone.com/police-products/firearms/articles/1354124-Causes-and-cures-for-the-negligent-discharge/
http://www.policeone.com/police-products/firearms/articles/1354124-Causes-and-cures-for-the-negligent-discharge/
Weapons
Soldiers
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 18
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I had an AD while hunting with my personal weapon. Missed my foot by a millimeter. I learned my lesson.
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SSG Paul Setterholm
Not really an accidental discharge but we were on an ambush and it was on a hillside trail. We were at the end of the kill zone around a curve. After the convoy pasted we were to drop the tree to block their escape. Some civilians crossed into the military reservation hunting. Their dog picked up our scent I'm guessing and pointed up the hill. The hunters got out and began firing shotguns at the position. One of my soldiers (a former marine) literally pissed his pants. We were screaming "cease fire" at them. We were the opfor and had patrol caps and cuc-v's so they thought we were game wardens not guardsmen and kept showing us their licenses. I kept telling them there is a guy up there. I thought they had hit him when he didn't come down or reply. He was just scared and embarrassed that he "wet" his pants. I can't blame him.
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I've been around NDs several different times. Mostly in country.
Can be quite nerve racking!
Can be quite nerve racking!
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My brother has, and lost a best friend as a result. This happened right after he lost two friends while deployed.
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This one could spawn several other discussions.
Yes-I've seen some ADs over the years. Mostly, they occur (beyond Basic) because service members are not trained adequately for the weapons systems they are handed. When I deployed to the 'Stan, the M-4 and M-9 were "standard" issue for pretty much everyone...regardless of rating , designator, prior experience...etc. Yes, everyone got the "crash course" (executed quite well, considering). Still, there's an enormous difference between basic quals and sufficient competency to carry a weapon like the M-4 carbine and not have incidents. Unfortunately, the typical approach taken was to default to controlling the circumstances, rather than ensuring the user has the skills to handle them.
Giving someone a weapon, then requiring them to carry it without a mag is just adding a useless weight for them to carry around and possibly lose.
Worse...sending "Private", "Airman" or "Petty Officer" Smith out on convoy with a M240G with the belt un-fed is placing a target in a vulnerable position for the sake of appearances.
We all know that certain weapons are "prone" to this sort of incident...especially weapons that charge by essentially going to Condition 1. Most of the incidents we saw involved the M240G and the M249- Personnel would "rack" a round when rolling out, then inadvertently have the bolt snap shut at the first "bump". Command response was to require vehicles to roll out into Indian Country without the weapon loaded! I was shocked at how many personnel were unfamiliar with the mechanisms of these two weapons, and how terrified they were of pulling the charging handle back. My SEL and I got together, consulted the pubs and held training on the weapon with all members on convoy...eventually, we convinced the CO that there was a "safe" way to leave the wire with our teeth out.
Same thing applies for any other weapon...safety catches exist for a reason, as do procedures for treating a firearm as "always loaded".
Furthermore, this illustrates concerns I've long held with the "Operator" cult following leading to personnel using ever more complex weapons and gear originally designed for the warrior elite. The M-1 and M-14 were rugged, simple, reliable weapons in their day...their "SpecOps" counterparts were purpose engineered for expert shooters' needs. What happens to "Joe" when the battery on his CQB scope is dead (because he hasn't thought about it since retrieving it from the depot six months prior), or its been knocked off zero, or the first round in his mag (that's been loaded for four months) is dented from the mag banging against the bolt?
Ammo is expensive...but not THAT expensive!
Get the guys out on the range, shoot a lot, get them comfortable with their tools.
Yes-I've seen some ADs over the years. Mostly, they occur (beyond Basic) because service members are not trained adequately for the weapons systems they are handed. When I deployed to the 'Stan, the M-4 and M-9 were "standard" issue for pretty much everyone...regardless of rating , designator, prior experience...etc. Yes, everyone got the "crash course" (executed quite well, considering). Still, there's an enormous difference between basic quals and sufficient competency to carry a weapon like the M-4 carbine and not have incidents. Unfortunately, the typical approach taken was to default to controlling the circumstances, rather than ensuring the user has the skills to handle them.
Giving someone a weapon, then requiring them to carry it without a mag is just adding a useless weight for them to carry around and possibly lose.
Worse...sending "Private", "Airman" or "Petty Officer" Smith out on convoy with a M240G with the belt un-fed is placing a target in a vulnerable position for the sake of appearances.
We all know that certain weapons are "prone" to this sort of incident...especially weapons that charge by essentially going to Condition 1. Most of the incidents we saw involved the M240G and the M249- Personnel would "rack" a round when rolling out, then inadvertently have the bolt snap shut at the first "bump". Command response was to require vehicles to roll out into Indian Country without the weapon loaded! I was shocked at how many personnel were unfamiliar with the mechanisms of these two weapons, and how terrified they were of pulling the charging handle back. My SEL and I got together, consulted the pubs and held training on the weapon with all members on convoy...eventually, we convinced the CO that there was a "safe" way to leave the wire with our teeth out.
Same thing applies for any other weapon...safety catches exist for a reason, as do procedures for treating a firearm as "always loaded".
Furthermore, this illustrates concerns I've long held with the "Operator" cult following leading to personnel using ever more complex weapons and gear originally designed for the warrior elite. The M-1 and M-14 were rugged, simple, reliable weapons in their day...their "SpecOps" counterparts were purpose engineered for expert shooters' needs. What happens to "Joe" when the battery on his CQB scope is dead (because he hasn't thought about it since retrieving it from the depot six months prior), or its been knocked off zero, or the first round in his mag (that's been loaded for four months) is dented from the mag banging against the bolt?
Ammo is expensive...but not THAT expensive!
Get the guys out on the range, shoot a lot, get them comfortable with their tools.
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I've been around quite a few, but they were all done in Basic Training. Was even guilty of one myself, luckily I was in the prone and my weapon was down range. Didn't save me from the ass chewing I got from my DS that I rightfully deserved.
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Yes, I have. While clearing our weapons and going "green" upon entry to Kabul Airport. A NATO ally soldier, I think he was Bulgarian, discharged a round into the clearing barrel next to the one I was using. Unsettling to say the least, especially given that tensions were all ready high being in Afghanistan.
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CPT (Join to see)
Not really an accidental discharge, but we were doing an M16 shoot off an aircraft elevator on the USS Nimitz and the person next to me thought their weapon was on safe (it was on semi-auto), was told to make their weapon ready to fire, and fire. Person flipped the fire selector switch (to auto fire) and emptied their mag in a few seconds. They got pulled off the line and had their rifle qual pulled.
Not really an accidental discharge, but we were doing an M16 shoot off an aircraft elevator on the USS Nimitz and the person next to me thought their weapon was on safe (it was on semi-auto), was told to make their weapon ready to fire, and fire. Person flipped the fire selector switch (to auto fire) and emptied their mag in a few seconds. They got pulled off the line and had their rifle qual pulled.
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#DOGECOIN This has to be the dumbest thing I have evr seen a cop do. That is saying a lot (thanks chocogirl105). For those who may think it is not real snope...
Yes, I have. It is inevitable over time. Even professionals make mistakes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=am-Qdx6vky0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=am-Qdx6vky0
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Twice- once when I was a unit armorer, and they were turning in wpns from the range- I asked if wpns were clear (3 of my worst scumbags)- they said yes. I told them to point them at the ceiling and pull the trigger- BANG!, we duck the ricochet. Both CO and 1SG dragged him away. Last time instructing USMA summer camp- hot shot did not clear wpn at the firing line, shot a hole in the lower part of range tower- several Professors drug him away!
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Happened a couple of times when we had an indoor range at the Armory.
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