Posted on May 6, 2014
How can we keep young service members from getting married just to receive BAH?
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It seems to me that many young service members get married just to get out of the barracks. They see this as a quality of life issue and to be honest I can see their point. What should the DoD do to make barracks life better? I for one would prefer to see barracks that were more like an apt vice a dorm room especially for the more seasoned or higher ranks. Always having another person in your room can be frustrating as sometimes you just want to get away. By keeping young Marines in the barracks could cut down on many of the problems that as leaders have to deal with when a young immature individual tries to live a lifestyle that they are not ready for.
BAH
Marriage
Marine Corps
Posted 10 y ago
Responses: 36
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I lived in open barracks. 40 men one head. Plus we had to ask permission to get married, Back then.
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SSgt Gregory Guina
Cpl Robert Passerelle Jr. Sometime I wish the getting permission thing were still true. Hell even if I couldn't stop them from doing it I wish they would at least talk to me so I can make sure they understand what they are getting into because a lot of the time they don't understand.
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Whatever happened to the axiom that if the military wanted you to have a spouse, they'd issue you one?
Ah yes, that was only true in those halcyon days before the all-volunteer force.
The simple truth is that no matter how carefully you craft the rules, someone will always find a way to "game the system". Look at welfare.
I suppose that $20,000 (E2 <2 years) per year looks like a lot of money to a kid just 18 and barely out of high school. Most of his civilian peers back home aren't earning that much flipping burgers.
I wonder if some of these junior personnel would be getting married and having kids if they see what I see. We are delivering food and diapers to their young wives and babies while they're deployed because $20,000 just isn't cutting it. Maybe they need to see this before they start their families.
We trust these young men and women to make some serious life and death decisions in the military service. Of course, we provide them with the best training we can so that they'll be prepared. Maybe we need to spend a little time educating them about the "real world" of family responsibilities. I bet they would be making much better decisions if they had something more to base them on.
I'd trust them. Would you?
Ah yes, that was only true in those halcyon days before the all-volunteer force.
The simple truth is that no matter how carefully you craft the rules, someone will always find a way to "game the system". Look at welfare.
I suppose that $20,000 (E2 <2 years) per year looks like a lot of money to a kid just 18 and barely out of high school. Most of his civilian peers back home aren't earning that much flipping burgers.
I wonder if some of these junior personnel would be getting married and having kids if they see what I see. We are delivering food and diapers to their young wives and babies while they're deployed because $20,000 just isn't cutting it. Maybe they need to see this before they start their families.
We trust these young men and women to make some serious life and death decisions in the military service. Of course, we provide them with the best training we can so that they'll be prepared. Maybe we need to spend a little time educating them about the "real world" of family responsibilities. I bet they would be making much better decisions if they had something more to base them on.
I'd trust them. Would you?
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Well, my daughter is currently in the USN and this very subject came up, it appears there were about a dozen Sailors that ran out and got married right before deployment, some of rhe couples were gay, and some actually found men to marry them in exchange for a little money, so they could move out into town with someone else, sounds like fraud to me. But I digress.....
My daughter mentioned it to me sort of asking my opinion, I asked about her sutuation, her bf is going on deployment soon, and when he comes back, she goes on deployment, so it will be a true test....I told her if she is still dating after the one year, they are probably destined to be together, but to never marry for the extra money. A fee extra dollars and being able to live out in town is hard to argue with...when you are an E3....But the heart ache and headache isn't worth it if you don't love them, or if they turn you in for fraud. So PO2 William Allen Crowder it does happen and is happening....right under our noses.
My daughter mentioned it to me sort of asking my opinion, I asked about her sutuation, her bf is going on deployment soon, and when he comes back, she goes on deployment, so it will be a true test....I told her if she is still dating after the one year, they are probably destined to be together, but to never marry for the extra money. A fee extra dollars and being able to live out in town is hard to argue with...when you are an E3....But the heart ache and headache isn't worth it if you don't love them, or if they turn you in for fraud. So PO2 William Allen Crowder it does happen and is happening....right under our noses.
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Well, in my experience, having been stationed in camp Lejeune, would be to say this, most likely, when young Marines first get to their unit or get back from deployment, making them cutting locks off of a condemned barracks and clean black mold off of literally every surface.
In general having to spend around ten hours cleaning a barracks before having a room, in not only unhealthy, and lowers morale, but it also tends to make you want to live out of said building ASAP.
In general having to spend around ten hours cleaning a barracks before having a room, in not only unhealthy, and lowers morale, but it also tends to make you want to live out of said building ASAP.
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Sgt (Join to see)
I think if they make NCO and is a responsible Marine, I think they should have the option of moving off of base but without getting BAH. I know many Marines who gets a place with another Marine to make rent cheaper for them and they are doing great. I believe grown adults who is being treated like a child all because they live in the barracks is making Marines get married just so they can move out and get the BAH.
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SSgt Gregory Guina
I agree if someone wants to not live in the barracks don't make them. Also don't make them be there Thursday night for Field Day.
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Cpl Christopher Bishop
If/when Ive lived "out in town" I should be home Field-Daying my own spot during those same hours. Of course Im not expecting a senior Marine to come "inspect" afterwards, that's more between me and my Landlord or family. Singles should have the option so long as they can demonstrate they can handle it financially.
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SSGT Gregory G.......we can't know for sure if younger military men and women getting married just for the BAH unless they come out and say it. The only thing you can do is to let them know the economy outside of the base can be rough, other than that let them figure it out for themselves when their pockets start getting low fast what you was saying will sink in. It is the same with newly E-2's and E-3's fresh out of their MOS School into their first duty assignment, they go out and buy a brand new automobile not thinking about the high payments and insurance. My son did it in the Marine Corps in Hawaii at 1st MAW, he had learned the hard way by getting a part time night job to supplement his income.
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SSgt Gregory Guina
I think the biggest thing is that they marry after a few months of knowing each other to get out of the barracks. Then when things get rough you have the mess to deal with which usually involves at least one kid.
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MSG Floyd Williams
SSGT Gregory G......I understand, you probably feel like it is now a babysitting job or now you have to be a father figure holding their hand. As a NCO you wear many hats to motivate, lead, train, and teaching young Marines about the facts of life keep in mind of lot of them is "green as grass" without understanding about the responsibility of being young adults, some weren't taught prior to enlisting into the military. You are gaining experience in the process as your career is moving to a higher level, and preparing you with future skills that will be useful in the civilian world mentoring kids and young adults who will appreciate you reaching out to them.
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Short-term and time tested from personal experience back in the FMF- counsel the SM on their decision and ensure they understand the financial hardship and the strain it will cause their marriage.
I remember E5-E6's that were single living out in town- but do not recollect any E-4's or below living anywhere other than the barracks.
- Long-term and tested at TBS when I was there- BAH (scaled) provided to all service members from private to general.
I remember E5-E6's that were single living out in town- but do not recollect any E-4's or below living anywhere other than the barracks.
- Long-term and tested at TBS when I was there- BAH (scaled) provided to all service members from private to general.
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SSgt Gregory Guina
Sir I try to counsel and explain it all to them but these kids just don't get it.
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Fort Leonardwood has amazing single soldier barracks. I shouldn't even call them barracks, when I first seen them I thought it was housing. They look like an apartment complex. I never had a chance to go inside one though.
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SSgt Gregory Guina
Yeah that is what I am talking about. In the Marine Corps we are still putting two Marines in a room E-4 and below.
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SFC (Join to see)
SSgt Guina,
Im at Hood now and the barracks we have are terrible. Just my opinion.
Let me change that. The WLC barracks are the standard all single soldiers should have. There are still "old school" barracks that have two Soldiers in them. They have no privacy at all. Im glad I don't have to live in there and i feel bad for the Soldiers that do.
Im at Hood now and the barracks we have are terrible. Just my opinion.
Let me change that. The WLC barracks are the standard all single soldiers should have. There are still "old school" barracks that have two Soldiers in them. They have no privacy at all. Im glad I don't have to live in there and i feel bad for the Soldiers that do.
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Cpl Westin Sandberg
SSH, every barracks I had lived in was at least three marines to a room, but most of the time it was four, in a ton that should, and realistically did, only accommodate two.
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SSgt Guina, do the Marines still have 2 Marines living in the same room? Bunk beds, or beds side by side, or seperated by a wall locker?
If so then that is a major problem. In the Army we have 1+1 barracks (mostly) where you have your own 4 walls and share a common area with someone else. Common area has a sink, fridge sometimes a hotplate, a place for a small table and chairs and a bathroom.
To keep our service members "happy" then I would say when you become a SGT, you get both rooms to yourself. And it creates a bedroom and living room for that Soldier.
Our young Military will always have these issues. getting married to move out of the barracks is not a new thing. I am sure they have been doing it since the first time someone got BAH for being married. It's just our job as NCOs to know that it will happen and try and midigate it as much as possible.
If so then that is a major problem. In the Army we have 1+1 barracks (mostly) where you have your own 4 walls and share a common area with someone else. Common area has a sink, fridge sometimes a hotplate, a place for a small table and chairs and a bathroom.
To keep our service members "happy" then I would say when you become a SGT, you get both rooms to yourself. And it creates a bedroom and living room for that Soldier.
Our young Military will always have these issues. getting married to move out of the barracks is not a new thing. I am sure they have been doing it since the first time someone got BAH for being married. It's just our job as NCOs to know that it will happen and try and midigate it as much as possible.
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SSG (Join to see)
SSgt Guina, I heard that Marines still do the 2 men to a room deal. Not a big fan of it. When I first came into the army I shared rooms with 2 other Soldiers (korea) and then in TX with one other Soldier. For your first few years its not that bad. Being young etc, you get used to it. but after a few years you grow out of that and want your own space. No matter what you do you can never please everyone. People will always complain. Soldiers complain because they feel they have a small room, and their roommate is a pig. (in the other room) And never cleans the common area. Marines, I am sure would kill to live in Army barracks, and get the privacy that Soldiers get. Well Soldiers would kill to live in AF barracks, as we all know they always have the "good life".
I found an article that stated that AF E4s with 3 plus years get to live off base, same thing with the Navy. hmmm....maybe they have the right idea? E4 or E5 and above gets BAH. BTW here is the article, its got some good info on Marine barracks too. As for your Marine barracks problem, if I was in charge, I would move to the Army 1+1 standard. That would keep more young Marines in the barracks, then chasing the first thing they find trolling the local club and saying "i do"
http://projects.militarytimes.com/benefits-handbook/housing/base-housing/
I found an article that stated that AF E4s with 3 plus years get to live off base, same thing with the Navy. hmmm....maybe they have the right idea? E4 or E5 and above gets BAH. BTW here is the article, its got some good info on Marine barracks too. As for your Marine barracks problem, if I was in charge, I would move to the Army 1+1 standard. That would keep more young Marines in the barracks, then chasing the first thing they find trolling the local club and saying "i do"
http://projects.militarytimes.com/benefits-handbook/housing/base-housing/
BASE HOUSING | Housing | Benefits Handbook | Military Times
The services call unaccompanied personnel housing by different names, such as bachelor enlisted quarters, barracks and dormitories. All services are upgrading their facilities through renovation and new construction. The primary focus is to eliminate inadequate living conditions such as overcrowding and common-area ("gang") latrines.
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SFC (Join to see)
SPC can move off post and collect BAH in the Army as well if the barracks are manned at 90%. This is a requirement in the AF as well and individuals are given statement of non-availability (authorization) by precedence. The services require 90% percent manning because otherwise no one would choose to live in the barracks. Of course it sucks for some SGTs who could live elsewhere but are stuck for a time, but I still agree wholeheartedly with the barracks requirement, especially for young uns. The last thing we need is a bunch of kids renting a house together to save money and throwing away their moral compass because they have "escaped." Since I brought it up I find it pretty funny that Soldiers will bitch about space and privacy when desiring to move out of barracks but then the same children will move 5 or 6 into a 4 bedroom house in order to "make" money off of BAH.
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SSG (Join to see)
When I was stationed at Fort Monore VA over ten years ago they closed the barracks for renovation. I think it was 2 years or so. Everyone was given BAH and allowed to move off post. We had zero issues in the aspect of junior Soldiers being "away from the nest"
Soldiers bitch about privacy for a few reasons
1) get away from Sarge's inspections.
2) get away from CQs judging eyes.
3) Have the chance to have a girl (or boy)spend a night (or 2). In a way allowing Joe to have a "live-in girlfriend" is alot better then having joe marry said GF and go thru the mess of a divorce. It's a lot easier to kick out the girlfriend then the wife.
As for Fort Monroe we were a small det of MPs (45 total). TRADOC HQ had about 1000 Soldiers staioned on base, about 600 of them were field grade officers. And about 10-12 General officers.
Plus when we (and I am guilty of it too) call them Children, then they will continue to act like children.
Soldiers bitch about privacy for a few reasons
1) get away from Sarge's inspections.
2) get away from CQs judging eyes.
3) Have the chance to have a girl (or boy)spend a night (or 2). In a way allowing Joe to have a "live-in girlfriend" is alot better then having joe marry said GF and go thru the mess of a divorce. It's a lot easier to kick out the girlfriend then the wife.
As for Fort Monroe we were a small det of MPs (45 total). TRADOC HQ had about 1000 Soldiers staioned on base, about 600 of them were field grade officers. And about 10-12 General officers.
Plus when we (and I am guilty of it too) call them Children, then they will continue to act like children.
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GySgt (Join to see)
I wonder how many of these people that bitch about living in two man rooms or privacy or anything else have ever lived in a squad bay probably all of them at boot camp. Boot camp it what prepares you for the military so you lived in a squad bay when whats wrong with a two man room. I say bring the squad bays back.
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Make BAH and BAS a part of Basic Pay and have the barracks and DFAC's be optional.
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SSgt Gregory Guina
SSgt Hasbun I could see a situation like that possibly working especially if you allow them to live in a room by themselves.
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SFC Michael Hasbun
Agreed, me too. That's precisely what I have in mind, except rank is not a factor.
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SSG (Join to see)
Well when its filled mostly with SSGs and LTs. I have never been in those units. But from From what I heard its not bad.
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