Posted on Sep 2, 2020
How competitive is the OCS selection process? How will going enlisted first impact my competitiveness?
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Prior to Monday, my plan was to pursue the route of OCS. This would be going as a civilian and filing a packet. I have no prior service. I did not do ROTC. I graduated college with a few dings along the way, but I finished with a 2.879 (not the greatest, I know). Sharing all of this with the recruiter as well as telling them who would be writing my letters of recommendation, they gave me some honest feedback. That I am not competitive enough. My GPA wasn’t high, my letters aren’t from anyone notable (associate professor, professor/boss [with prior military service as an NCO], associate pastor [associate pastor is second in charge at this church]) and the current climate of applying for OCS as a civilian is very very competitive right now. They stated, “Instead of competing on a local level like you used to, now you’re competing on a national level.” With all of this being described and some further discussion, the plan is to enlist for a few years then push for an OCS packet. I have read on other places that that is next to impossible, but I know everyone on here, just like that recruiter is a straight shooter. This post is not meant to say that I don’t believe the recruiter, but only to do my due diligence and sure up any information. Moving on to the questions:
1) Is the climate for OCS more competitive now than it was, ex. 10 years ago?
2) Does the process consist of a national comparison rather than a local one?
3) Is going Enlisted first going to be a detriment to an OCS Packet?
4) Am I as uncompetitive as it seems?
Note: Whether I go Enlisted or end up going OCS, it does not really matter. My reasons for wanting to join remain the same. It was never about the money, benefits, or what ever prestige might come with it. I want to join because a multitude of other reasons. Again, this is not to discredit my recruiter or draw negative conclusions about anything, I am simply doing my due diligence. I apologize if this is not an appropriate question, the information online is rather fickle . Any information or opinion is appreciated. Feel free to be direct.
Update: After thought, some prayer, and some additional motivation, I’ve decided to Enlist. If all goes according to plan, MEPS will be next week and the report date is the 9th of October. Thanks for the advice everyone, I greatly appreciate it. God willing, I’ll be able to call myself one of y’all by the end of basic.
1) Is the climate for OCS more competitive now than it was, ex. 10 years ago?
2) Does the process consist of a national comparison rather than a local one?
3) Is going Enlisted first going to be a detriment to an OCS Packet?
4) Am I as uncompetitive as it seems?
Note: Whether I go Enlisted or end up going OCS, it does not really matter. My reasons for wanting to join remain the same. It was never about the money, benefits, or what ever prestige might come with it. I want to join because a multitude of other reasons. Again, this is not to discredit my recruiter or draw negative conclusions about anything, I am simply doing my due diligence. I apologize if this is not an appropriate question, the information online is rather fickle . Any information or opinion is appreciated. Feel free to be direct.
Update: After thought, some prayer, and some additional motivation, I’ve decided to Enlist. If all goes according to plan, MEPS will be next week and the report date is the 9th of October. Thanks for the advice everyone, I greatly appreciate it. God willing, I’ll be able to call myself one of y’all by the end of basic.
Posted in these groups: 
Recruiting
Officer Candidate School (OCS) (Army)
Recruiting Officer Candidate School (OCS) (Army)
Edited 5 y ago
Posted 5 y ago
Responses: 13
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If you want to be an Officer submit a package. If you want to enlist then Enlist. What you shouldn't do is enlist because the recruiter who has a quota to fill says you should. Don't take advice from folks who haven't been through the process. Worst case you don't get accepted and you enlist anyway. You miss every shot you don't take.
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LTC (Join to see)
On the other hand, if he applies and is rejected and then enlists and applies again later, he'll have that prior rejection as a black mark on his record. Straight up, no bullshit, his chances of getting accepted with a 2.879 GPA and no recommendations from military officers are zero. It would be different if the military was currently short of LTs, but it's not and the OCS selection process is much more competitive. Much better shot at eventually becoming an officer if he enlists and serves 3-4 years and then applies as a high speed NCO.
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I’ve never heard of anyone making it into OCS with a GPA below a 3.0. You’re recruiter wasn’t lying to you about that. You are competing against everyone in the world who meets the same requirements: American citizen, 110 GT score, bachelor degree, no criminal record and good physical health. It’s much more competitive than it was a decade ago because we’re no longer in a huge war like Iraq where we took anyone with a pulse. 10-15 years ago you could be a felon and join, you could go to OCS with an associate degree.
You could certainly have a better chance of being selected for OCS after distinguishing yourself above your peers while you’re enlisted. The GPA is important, but excelling at your work performance is just as important. There are things like Soldier of the Year competition and exclusive clubs like the Sergeant Audie Murphy Club you can try out for that will set you way ahead of your peers and earn the letters of recommendation higher ranking officers that will carry more weight to the OCS board. Most OCS applicants are currently serving enlisted Soldiers, so you lose nothing by doing that
You could certainly have a better chance of being selected for OCS after distinguishing yourself above your peers while you’re enlisted. The GPA is important, but excelling at your work performance is just as important. There are things like Soldier of the Year competition and exclusive clubs like the Sergeant Audie Murphy Club you can try out for that will set you way ahead of your peers and earn the letters of recommendation higher ranking officers that will carry more weight to the OCS board. Most OCS applicants are currently serving enlisted Soldiers, so you lose nothing by doing that
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CPT (Join to see)
Well, one can always try a USAR approach. I was writing ASVAB score waiver memos as a 1LT company commander willing to take OCS candidates on for those with a GT score between 105-109.
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Consider the process aspect of it. As a civilian you are in a position unique to the enlisted soldier. You have the recruiter backing you. As a soldier on the inside the entire process will have to go through your chain of command. That could be as lucky as a Company Commander taking you under his wing to being controlled by your squad leader holding up the entire process that has to go through your chain of command one by one for every single action.
That's not to say you can't go your full enlistment, get out, and then have the experience as a soldier and once out then try OCS again from the outside.
Recommendation............... Try the civilian to OCS route. If you fail then enlist, do your contract, and then try again. Rank up as fast as you can, make SGT, and pick an MOS that has a low promotion point threshold. You should be able to make E5 inside of 3 years (I did it in two) if you start as SPC. Then you are applying as a prior service NCO.
Be prepared for things to suck if you try to submit an OCS packet WHILE you are in.
That's not to say you can't go your full enlistment, get out, and then have the experience as a soldier and once out then try OCS again from the outside.
Recommendation............... Try the civilian to OCS route. If you fail then enlist, do your contract, and then try again. Rank up as fast as you can, make SGT, and pick an MOS that has a low promotion point threshold. You should be able to make E5 inside of 3 years (I did it in two) if you start as SPC. Then you are applying as a prior service NCO.
Be prepared for things to suck if you try to submit an OCS packet WHILE you are in.
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The other option you can do is join an ROTC unit to complete your graduate degree. And that way you can compete for active duty. That's probably the quickest way you're going to be able to be a commissioned officer. Your packet is not competitive at all, as you already know. But ROTC will have you be in the program and you'll have that extra education as a graduate. The only thing you'd be really competing for is active duty. I am an OCS guy, and from what I've seen in the past nine to 10 years is if you enlist, you can apply for the green to gold which is awarded very rarely... you really got to be the golden child in a unit to get selected for that. This includes displaying your potential as an officer, which means you're a rockstar. I think you got a good baseline as far as what you want to try to do. If you want to go officer go officer if you want to enlist and list. I would highly recommend the ROTC route for a graduate degree. You'll have to do a little ketchup work just as far as the basic military studies classes, I think this is probably the best route. But again, it's all about what you want to do.
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CPT (Join to see)
The challenge is one usually needs a 3.0 undergrad to get into a grad program. Not impossible, just another waiver to purse depending on grad school choice.
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I'll spin the Reserve in its best light. I see you are "unemployed". I wasn't unemployed when I joined, but I basically turned my back to my financial career and joined the USAR. I've really never looked back because I kept getting long term orders and then a deployment right out of the gate. In the last 9 years I've found myself not having to work full time as of yet.
I'm probably in a better position than most, but what I'm getting at is in the early years as a new soldier the USAR was more than happy to abuse their soldiers and max out the amount of long term orders they could put you on. If you are unemployed and needing work you can find it in the USAR.
My military email is full of the USAR putting out vacancy postings for XO and Company Commander slots for Basic Training units. Those are for mature LT's and new CPT's but there's just as many vacancy postings being sent my way for Aid de Camp (personal administrative assistant) to 1 and 2 star generals. Those are all full time 1.5-2 year gigs for 2LT's and 1LT's 2+ years out from CPT (they don't want 1LT's that will promote to CPT while general aids).
If you are unemployed here's your time line as an unemployed reservist:
9 weeks Basic Training
12 weeks OCS
Return to your Reserve unit, and they will put you through a BOLC ASAP then:
16 or so weeks depending on your Branch.
Then as soon as you get out as a fully trained 2LT the USAR will be more than happy to bombard you with long term orders, or at the very least send you to endless schools for qualification in various additional duties.
When I was in Quartermaster training, the Active Duty Component came to my class and gave all USAR 2LT's the option to go Active for three years. Active Duty was straight up going to poach us from the Reserves.
If you have a degree, and can pass the fitness test a Reserve commission is very possible regardless of academic strengths.
I'm probably in a better position than most, but what I'm getting at is in the early years as a new soldier the USAR was more than happy to abuse their soldiers and max out the amount of long term orders they could put you on. If you are unemployed and needing work you can find it in the USAR.
My military email is full of the USAR putting out vacancy postings for XO and Company Commander slots for Basic Training units. Those are for mature LT's and new CPT's but there's just as many vacancy postings being sent my way for Aid de Camp (personal administrative assistant) to 1 and 2 star generals. Those are all full time 1.5-2 year gigs for 2LT's and 1LT's 2+ years out from CPT (they don't want 1LT's that will promote to CPT while general aids).
If you are unemployed here's your time line as an unemployed reservist:
9 weeks Basic Training
12 weeks OCS
Return to your Reserve unit, and they will put you through a BOLC ASAP then:
16 or so weeks depending on your Branch.
Then as soon as you get out as a fully trained 2LT the USAR will be more than happy to bombard you with long term orders, or at the very least send you to endless schools for qualification in various additional duties.
When I was in Quartermaster training, the Active Duty Component came to my class and gave all USAR 2LT's the option to go Active for three years. Active Duty was straight up going to poach us from the Reserves.
If you have a degree, and can pass the fitness test a Reserve commission is very possible regardless of academic strengths.
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1. Yes, very much so
2. For Active Duty, yes. National Guard may be different
3. I did it, but that was 17 years ago. I've known many people over the course of my career who were enlisted first and became officers. Plus, it has been my experience that prior enlisted, especially those who were NCOs, make much better officers than someone straight out of college.
4. Unfortunately, YES. Mediocre GPA and no references from military officers/NCOs or anyone of note (associate professors and pastors recommendation don't carry much weight) just isn't going to cut it. For comparison, friend of my son was rejected and he had a 3.1 GPA and a recommendation from at least one currently serving LTC, me.
2. For Active Duty, yes. National Guard may be different
3. I did it, but that was 17 years ago. I've known many people over the course of my career who were enlisted first and became officers. Plus, it has been my experience that prior enlisted, especially those who were NCOs, make much better officers than someone straight out of college.
4. Unfortunately, YES. Mediocre GPA and no references from military officers/NCOs or anyone of note (associate professors and pastors recommendation don't carry much weight) just isn't going to cut it. For comparison, friend of my son was rejected and he had a 3.1 GPA and a recommendation from at least one currently serving LTC, me.
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When I enlisted I had the same idea of going OCS after some time in. However due to age and other issues in life, I am not longer in the position to go OCS. I will however have a great career as an NCO and I am happy with that.
With this said, I would say drop the civilian OCS packet and see were it takes you. If the answer is no, go enlisted and then OCS down the line if possible. You don't know until you try and once you sign that contract you are bound to it until you ETS or your CoC is willing to work through the OCS packet process.
With this said, I would say drop the civilian OCS packet and see were it takes you. If the answer is no, go enlisted and then OCS down the line if possible. You don't know until you try and once you sign that contract you are bound to it until you ETS or your CoC is willing to work through the OCS packet process.
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CPT (Join to see)
Your Warrant path is still open with nearly the same pay with much less of the headaches.
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SSG (Join to see)
CPT (Join to see) that is true sir, I have already looked into that option as well and have a few more years to decide if I want to go that path.
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1LT (Join to see) Great advice has already been offered. I am happy to hear that you are doing your due diligence. Make sure that you look at opportunities in all the branches including the Coast Guard. Please keep us posted on you decision.
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Not sure about other branches, but as a Marine recruiter anyone we interviewed that had a Bachelor's or higher had to be screened by the Officer Selection Officer. Failure to comply would be met with disciplinary action. Maybe your recruiter already sent your info to the OSO and you were screened out. I would ask.
Now, if college was a challenge you may find that serving as an enlisted SM for a few years may be a good idea. An opportunity to improve yourself and see live the life. The best Officers I ever worked with or for were prior enlisted.
Now, if college was a challenge you may find that serving as an enlisted SM for a few years may be a good idea. An opportunity to improve yourself and see live the life. The best Officers I ever worked with or for were prior enlisted.
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1LT (Join to see)
This is the first I have heard of a mandatory screening process. I wonder if the Army has that. I will ask when I go back in tomorrow. I had only been there once and that was 31st of Aug. I wouldn't be surprised if I was already screened out if they had that requirement, but asking wouldn't hurt. How long ago were you a Marine Recruiter?
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1LT (Join to see)
GySgt Kenneth Pepper - The understanding was that the Army does not do that. Thanks for the option though.
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As a Mustang, some but not all answers.
Been out too long to have a feel about how competitive today's selection process. Anecdotally, it's competitive.
OCS selection is National. The only way it isn't National is to join the Guard and Commission that way.
No, being enlisted isn't a detriment. Probably half of my class was prior enlisted (MOS qualified and not just BCT). I was getting ready to promote to E-5 went I applied.
Probably not, more than one officer on this board did not have a much better GPA, including myself. My feeling is that for enlisted applicants, they check to make sure you have all the requirement boxes checked, and a degree is a big one, look at your ASVAB, then your military school reports and unit evaluations, and then your LOR's. If you have a good LOR from Battalion or Higher, you should be good to go.
Downside of OCS as enlisted. I went just at the point I was getting away form all the jobs that get shoved on the junior enlisted, then volunteered to go back to where they treat you worse than in Basic. Your TAC Officers are not like your Drill Sgts, I frankly despised mine. I just put my head down and did what I need to do.
Been out too long to have a feel about how competitive today's selection process. Anecdotally, it's competitive.
OCS selection is National. The only way it isn't National is to join the Guard and Commission that way.
No, being enlisted isn't a detriment. Probably half of my class was prior enlisted (MOS qualified and not just BCT). I was getting ready to promote to E-5 went I applied.
Probably not, more than one officer on this board did not have a much better GPA, including myself. My feeling is that for enlisted applicants, they check to make sure you have all the requirement boxes checked, and a degree is a big one, look at your ASVAB, then your military school reports and unit evaluations, and then your LOR's. If you have a good LOR from Battalion or Higher, you should be good to go.
Downside of OCS as enlisted. I went just at the point I was getting away form all the jobs that get shoved on the junior enlisted, then volunteered to go back to where they treat you worse than in Basic. Your TAC Officers are not like your Drill Sgts, I frankly despised mine. I just put my head down and did what I need to do.
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LTC (Join to see)
CPT Lawrence Cable - the problem with his GPA is it's much more competitive today than it was when most of the officers on this board with similar GPAs got accepted. Back when I got commissioned, 17 years ago, they were so short of LTs that they were taking virtually anyone who applied.
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CPT Lawrence Cable
LTC (Join to see) - Hey, I resemble that remark :^).I have to say the same thing and I went through it long before that. They had people from Brigade and Battalion come through and solicited anyone with a degree to apply. However, GPA doesn't seem to be as important to those that have some enlisted time and having a few awards seemed to help.
When I went through IOBC, at least a quarter of my class did not have Infantry as their first choice, now I am told that it's the most competitive branch to get into these days. A different day.
When I went through IOBC, at least a quarter of my class did not have Infantry as their first choice, now I am told that it's the most competitive branch to get into these days. A different day.
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LTC (Join to see)
CPT Lawrence Cable - that's how I got commissioned. BN HHC 1SG solicited me because I had a degree. I was a 39 y/o SFC at the time and they had just raised the cut off to 40 because they were so desperate for officers. I was a company CO as a 1LT and my PLs were two cadets and a SFC. That's how short of officers they were at the time.
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CPT (Join to see)
LTC (Join to see) - I should have just joined after 9/11 (which was just when I finished my MBA) and ate crow. I'd have commissioned anyway (in hindsight), and had 10 more years behind me.
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