Posted on Oct 16, 2019
How does a military veteran lead civilians?
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I am a veteran with over 15 years of combined service. I am currently going to school and studying journalism.
I am taking a class which entails working on the school newspaper. I am the Editor in Chief for this semester and have been told by the other staff members my style comes across as controlling, demanding and unappreciative.
They have also told me they see us as equals rather my subordinates and even got offended when I referred to them as such. The faculty advisor came to me nearly in tears and told me how offensive that remark was.
I attempted to set up a meeting with them to try to resolve this and I even got pushback on that, being told I was acting unprofessionally and that it was unrealistic of me to expect them to try to meet at a time I was available.
In hindsight I think I should have asked for a meeting at the beginning of the semester to clearly define our roles and responsibilities, but I'm concerned this situation is past the point of any peaceful solution.
Does anyone have guidance on how I should proceed in this?
Thank you.
I am taking a class which entails working on the school newspaper. I am the Editor in Chief for this semester and have been told by the other staff members my style comes across as controlling, demanding and unappreciative.
They have also told me they see us as equals rather my subordinates and even got offended when I referred to them as such. The faculty advisor came to me nearly in tears and told me how offensive that remark was.
I attempted to set up a meeting with them to try to resolve this and I even got pushback on that, being told I was acting unprofessionally and that it was unrealistic of me to expect them to try to meet at a time I was available.
In hindsight I think I should have asked for a meeting at the beginning of the semester to clearly define our roles and responsibilities, but I'm concerned this situation is past the point of any peaceful solution.
Does anyone have guidance on how I should proceed in this?
Thank you.
Chain of Command
Civilians
Leadership
Posted 6 y ago
Responses: 29
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First thing is to understand your role. Your personnel do not work for you, you work for them meaning you are there to support them. When it comes to meetings you let them suggest the time and adjust to them. Ensure they understand you are there to support and help them and need their expertise to complete the task. Without them you are a leader of nothing. You need to demonstrate your skills and expertise by listening and joining them in resolving tasks or issues. Then you need to lead them by proposing or implementing the vision you all as a team created.
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Yes. As we were taught in the military , being an effective leader you must be able to influence others to accomplish a task. Okay, so, having said that . In a combat situation it is acceptable to be aggressive . I mean hey success means life or death. But this is far from the situation in the civilian world. To be effective you must be empathetic to subordinates. You will find that they will perform more willingly if take this approach.
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What has worked for me was:
- Define roles and expectations early (what I think you do, what you think you do, what you're going to do). Like within the first week early.
- Define decision making boundaries and right and left limits. (everything between these posts are yours, if you need to push past give me a heads up and get a check or hold before proceeding, usually geared towards cost, codes or external perceptions).
- Checking on things doesn't equal distrust it equals interest in the process.
- And finally what can I do to clear the way and streamline policies , procedures or processes to help you succeed.
Kind of like PCC's and PCI's tailored to a civilian audience.
You're probably going to get 100 different styles and approaches that are successful and match different folks personalities and work habits. You have to tailor the approach to the maturity, experience and proficiency level of your crew.
My opinion:
Sounds like your advisor needs to get a grip on reality. They should be preparing folks for the workforce and getting them accustomed to production time lines, deadlines and interpersonal relationships in the workforce. Life is not the forest of feelings and they will have to meet time hacks, and datelines and work with and for demanding folks. They also in my opinion should have provided you with guidance, performance measures, expectations and a syllabus of how to be a successful Editor in Chief. Try a reset and see if you can salvage the situation.
- Define roles and expectations early (what I think you do, what you think you do, what you're going to do). Like within the first week early.
- Define decision making boundaries and right and left limits. (everything between these posts are yours, if you need to push past give me a heads up and get a check or hold before proceeding, usually geared towards cost, codes or external perceptions).
- Checking on things doesn't equal distrust it equals interest in the process.
- And finally what can I do to clear the way and streamline policies , procedures or processes to help you succeed.
Kind of like PCC's and PCI's tailored to a civilian audience.
You're probably going to get 100 different styles and approaches that are successful and match different folks personalities and work habits. You have to tailor the approach to the maturity, experience and proficiency level of your crew.
My opinion:
Sounds like your advisor needs to get a grip on reality. They should be preparing folks for the workforce and getting them accustomed to production time lines, deadlines and interpersonal relationships in the workforce. Life is not the forest of feelings and they will have to meet time hacks, and datelines and work with and for demanding folks. They also in my opinion should have provided you with guidance, performance measures, expectations and a syllabus of how to be a successful Editor in Chief. Try a reset and see if you can salvage the situation.
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SGT Christopher Churilla: I am a Facebook coach. I attempt to save lives; on Facebook. I attempt to: motivate; inspire; and Love the Active Duty troops; and, the Veterans; in my groups.
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The Emerald Forest (1985) Trailer
http://thedukemitchell.uk/ for more weird videos plus strange film nights in London. VHS trailer for the 1985 adventure drama The Emerald Forest, directed by...
Not necessarily the answer but there was a great scene/dialogue in the movie Emerald Forest. Script except below (and trailer link).
“You are the chief. Tell him to come and visit.”
“He can choose. If I tell a man to do what he does not want to do I am no longer chief“
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kWSRFAqNjyA
“You are the chief. Tell him to come and visit.”
“He can choose. If I tell a man to do what he does not want to do I am no longer chief“
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kWSRFAqNjyA
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SGT Christopher Churilla sounds like you're in a truly liberal arts school. Where everything is offensive, and anyone in any position of leadership is expected to spoon feed the workers everything they need.
There really isn't any leading here. It sounds like the school has maintained that position title, but it is just a title, and not an actual thing. When even the faculty advisor comes crying that your use of the phrase subordinate is offensive, you just might be in the wrong place. Might be best to just "Be Like Water" until you accomplish what you're there for.
There may be underlying disrespect/disdain for you because you a military. I live in Columbia, MO, where the J-School is next to God. Many of the J-students outwardly have shown disdain towards military folk. I don't know if it is being taught to them by faculty (yeah...I know, but I try giving the benefit of the doubt). Hell, they were pretty negative towards any law enforcement when I worked as a police officer on campus!
It does not sound like it is in your blood to coddle them, as they (and, apparently, the faculty) expect you to. Do not change your ways. You are just trying to give them a dose of the real world before they actually get out in to it.
There really isn't any leading here. It sounds like the school has maintained that position title, but it is just a title, and not an actual thing. When even the faculty advisor comes crying that your use of the phrase subordinate is offensive, you just might be in the wrong place. Might be best to just "Be Like Water" until you accomplish what you're there for.
There may be underlying disrespect/disdain for you because you a military. I live in Columbia, MO, where the J-School is next to God. Many of the J-students outwardly have shown disdain towards military folk. I don't know if it is being taught to them by faculty (yeah...I know, but I try giving the benefit of the doubt). Hell, they were pretty negative towards any law enforcement when I worked as a police officer on campus!
It does not sound like it is in your blood to coddle them, as they (and, apparently, the faculty) expect you to. Do not change your ways. You are just trying to give them a dose of the real world before they actually get out in to it.
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SSgt (Join to see)
But, sometimes a little assholery on the civilian side has to be called on when it becomes apparent that the message isn't getting through. It hits w/ a greater shock when it's not your typical manner, too ;)
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SSgt (Join to see) there is a time and a place to be the bad boss...not really sure this is it though. And it almost sounds like he walked in the door as the bad boss, which...where do you go from there when it doesn’t work? Start calm, stay calm, until you have no other option but to escalate..
SSgt (Join to see)
SFC Thomas Foreman - agreed. Was always my tactic as a police officer. That way when escalation occurred, they were taken aback momentarily, giving me a moment of advantage.
Not exactly the same, but you can see the parallel.
Not exactly the same, but you can see the parallel.
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SSgt (Join to see) I think a workplace like a newspaper is especially unsuited for NCO style leadership. It’s a creative business, and the best journalists become that way when they’re given room to grow. I can say humbly that when I was a freelancer I had a few smaller papers try to lure me away from my position but I stayed because it was just a side job that I didn’t rely on for much income and because my editor...let me do pretty much whatever I wanted. In three years of weekly columns he deleted one sentence one time. That freedom allowed me to become popular and put my true thoughts on the page. Was nominated for some AP awards and state level awards, was a really good experience...but ultimately I stayed with them for that long because of how they treated me.
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Unfortunately no. Your interpretation of the issue is on point. Your request for a meeting was correct. Unfortunately, the group feels they are correct, and it’s up to you to convert to their way of thinking. So yes, your correct in you synopsis of the situation.
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Aerosmith - Walk This Way (from You Gotta Move)
Aerosmith's official live video for 'Walk This Way'. Click to listen to Aerosmith on Spotify: http://smarturl.it/AerosmithSpot?IQid=AeroWTW As featured on Th...
With kid gloves, or not. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pL4uESRCnv8
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