Posted on Oct 28, 2017
SPC Fire Support Specialist
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ROTC to 15A:

Right now I’m looking at getting out of the active army and going to school and getting my commission through ROTC. Being a forward observer and working first hand with a lot of aviatiors I have really fallen in love with the idea. Any recommendations, what exactly is the pipeline, will being prior service help me any? Everything helps!
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LTC Kevin B.
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You need to find a university with 1) an academic discipline that interests you and 2) an Army ROTC department (or has a formal relationship with another university that does have ROTC). Before getting out, you can start the process by reaching out to the ROTC departments to gauge their level of interest in you. As long as you have a clean service record and are healthy, most ROTC units will be interested. From there, you'll need to get accepted to the school and then ETS so that you can attend. You'll then eventually sign a contract through ROTC, and subsequently compete to come back onto AD as an officer. During your final year in ROTC, you'll compete for your branch and for active duty. To be competitive for Aviation, I'd recommend a quantitative academic discipline, and I'd recommend that you make really good grades. You'll need to have no vision problems.
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SPC Fire Support Specialist
SPC (Join to see)
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Appreciate the help sir! So essentially good grades and good marks in rotc? Also does it matter my major?
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LTC Kevin B.
LTC Kevin B.
8 y
SPC (Join to see) - Yes, your major will matter. Having a degree in underwater basket weaving won't help you get Aviation. Don't pick one that's too easy, or it will impact your competitiveness. Plus, having one in something math-heavy will make you more competitive. I'd recommend looking for any degrees with multiple courses in college-level algebra, trigonometry, calculus, statistics, etc. You can find many majors like that, such as Mathematics, Statistics, Computer Science, the various Engineering majors (Mechanical, Electrical, Chemical, Industrial, etc.), or a number of other majors that can also suffice. You'll eventually have to take an exam to see if you even qualify for Aviation branch, and it isn't easy.

I'd recommend posting something in the Aviation group, and seeing what type of degree those officers might recommend.

https://www.rallypoint.com/specialties/15a-aviation-officer
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SPC Fire Support Specialist
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8 y
Thank you again sir!
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LTC Kevin B.
LTC Kevin B.
8 y
SPC (Join to see) - No problem at all. Best of luck to you.
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COL Strategic Plans Chief
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SPC (Join to see), LTC Kevin B. has the best advice on here so far. He's pretty much spot on. I'd tell you that it doesn't matter where you go to school, but you'll want to be at a major university with the ROTC program on site. The universities that "have a relationship" with an ROTC program just isn't the same. I know plenty of people that went to those and they are great, but it's just not the same. Aeronautical Engineering (AE) will help. Other brainy degrees will help you stand out, but other than AE, nothing really compares. The biggest thing about focusing on a single branch is you might not get it. You will be evaluated on your overall grades, your place on the OML (Order of Merit List, which is created by the LTC/COL in charge of the program), and physical/tactical skill (which has its own systems). If you are not in the top 10% of your class, it is likely you will not get your first choice of branch...especially if you are chasing Aviation. If you are near the bottom of your class, you may not even be selected for active duty and could end up in the reserves. It's merit based. Do well and you will get what you want. Don't do well, and you are left with the dregs of the selection process.
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Capt Daniel Goodman
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Capt Sabrena Goldman
Capt Sabrena Goldman
8 y
Has anyone studied Psychology here and went in to the UPHS??
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Capt Daniel Goodman
Capt Daniel Goodman
8 y
That's quite interesting thatnyoud asked that, I've long kicked myself for not having gone USPHS to start with, in truth, I genuinely didn't know it existed, even though my entrance exam for Army ROTF was done, I'd read much later, at one of their facilities, before idmgone USAF. I know they have Ph.D. level clinical psychology, I gather, I'm fairly certain I'd read that. If I couldve, I'd have gone civil service to do a pH.D. there, as civil servants are, in fact, allowed to apply, though getting in is obv quite rough, as its fully funded, with an obligation to do civil service afterward, I believe. Some time ago, there'd been a program there to let clinical psychologists, whether Ph.D. or Psy.D., I think, go for postdoc fellowship training to let those in the program ultimately be allowed to prescribe. Obviously, I'd read the psychiatry association had, I'd gathered, apparently been unthrilled at the thought, it was one of those scope of practice things, I'd read, I'd delved into a lot of scope of practice stuff before I became ill, I'd wanted to go for more training, possibly to have bridged to medicine, though, because of my disability, my wife and I needed to have me shut my podiatry license sevl yrs ago I'd considered doing a Ph.D. in,. E.g., pathology, as I'd always found that scientifically more to my tastes. I'd wanted also bioengineering, methematical biology, or mathematical biophysics, unfortunately, my disability has totally bollixed up every effort I've made to try. I'd also looked at a Ph.D. in data science, having originally been engineering, physics, and math, as well. I've been trying, if the rules of my disability, which are actually quite draconian, to be allowed to either tutor STEM material for students, have volunteered to tutor STEm at the church my wife and I go to, and/or also to try to volunteer using what we're hoping are approved programs I'd read of, to be allowed to assist with clinical research. I've asked for help to be allowed, we're trying, however, its clearly quite brought going, as to ask for that is obv atypical given a disability, we:re afraid. Were you inclined toward clinical psych? I'm not entirely sure if USUHS has Ph.D. or Psy.D., as i think about the whole thing, you might want to call their grad school, I seem to recall they have a toll free phone to that segment of the school. I'd known they'd added nursing, I'd been most eager to go yrs ago, when I'd been in Army ROTC, and also USAF, I just never figured on how hard getting it could actually be. If I'd known, I'd have submitted for dentistry, I didn't even know about osteopathic till I was nearly off active, and everything got totally bollixed up. If you'd care to chat further, I'd of course be most willing, if you'd wish to elaborate on your background, interests and.or ambitions at all. If you'd care to hear about any of my clinical research interests, esp. In mathematical immunology, and computational genomic signal processing, as well as the quantum neuroscience aspects of anesthetics, among other areas, I'd of course be most eager for such serious scientific discussion, many thanks, hope was of at least some interest.
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Capt Daniel Goodman
Capt Daniel Goodman
8 y
I'd also looked at USPHS for engineering, as well, I hadn't realized they had that till too late, I'm afraid, many thanks.
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How exactly does the ROTC pipeline work? Will being prior service help me any?
Capt Daniel Goodman
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Capt Daniel Goodman
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_maritime_colleges

I very seriously kick myself I never submitted for Tue one in NY when I could have, I assure you....
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SPC Fire Support Specialist
SPC (Join to see)
8 y
I appreciate all the help but I just realized I posted this while being tired on staff duty. I’m looking for the pipeline of being an army aviator through the ROTC program I’m going to repost fixing my mistake. Thank you regardless!
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Capt Daniel Goodman
Capt Daniel Goodman
8 y
I follow, sorry for deluging you, ifmtoumfind Amy of it of interest, I'd be eager to know, regardless, please do try to let me know your thoughts, in any event. What I'd also seriously try to do, as a further thought, would be to see if there's a military aero!club near you, and go for private pilot, imstrument rating, multi engine, commercial, helicopter, glider, as much as you can. Look also to see if there's a Civil Air Patrol (CAP) unit by where you are, or a USCG Auxiliary aviation flotilla, maybe, as well, just further thoughts, do look!at the !maritime schools, you could have a really goodmchamce there sa!e with Citadel or CMI, trust me, I'd be eager to hear more, if you'd care to elaborate onmGPA, schools so far, associates thus far, etc. Also, look at Community College of the Air Force (CCAF), and/or the equivalent Navy programs, you might well be able to!German associates through either of them, I'd heard of such things for enlisted from other services, honest, hope to hear more, hope was of some use.
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Capt Daniel Goodman
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Military_Academy_Preparatory_School

Imdidmt knowmtour age or level of interest, just didn't know if you knew of this....
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Capt Daniel Goodman
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http://www.vmi.edu/

My best friend while in went here....
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CPT Lawrence Cable
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I will point out that as prior service, you can skip the first two years of ROTC and join in your Junior Year. I would also suggest that you look at Simultaneous Membership with a Guard or Reserve unit. It will get you some experience and the extra money for weekend drills never hurts.
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SGM Bill Frazer
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These are all spot on- Find a school that you want, that has both a strong ROTC and a good study field. Then talk to the ROTC recruiter at that school. Make good grades in a good field, being prior enlisted, most of the Mickey Mouse you have already seen. But a lot of ROTC is Military classes which you will need and can relate to. The better your grades and your standing ROTC will decide on being commissioned and in what Branch, also if is Active, Reserve or NG.
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MAJ Executive Officer
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I had a similar story. I was a prior service Combat Engineer that commissioned, and became an Aviation Officer. Your decision will boil down to if you want to fly continuously or be an officer. Realistically, it is difficult to do both. I've been blessed to never leave an Aviation Brigade since flight school (except CCC of course and now CGSC), but many of my peers have not had that luck, and have done other jobs such as recruiting command, ROTC, or higher level staff.

Another point is continuing to fly becomes increasingly difficult as your rank moves upwards. If you want to be an officer first, then I would look at the USMA Prep School (if you meet the qualifications of age and single, test scores) and ROTC. USMA Prep is an awesome opportunity, and they do not fill out the prior service slots annually. USMA also typically gets some additional slots for aviation, but like everyone else, it is OML / Merit based. ROTC, as I understand it, gets the top slice their branch of choice, then another slice further down the OML in order to spread the talent pool around. Then again, that could have changed in the last few years.

Aviation rarely gets slots for OCS, and I have only heard of two people now getting it. One of them, already had his CFII (Civilian Instructor Pilot), Masters Degree, and was a PT stud. And with those qualifications, I was still surprised that he was able to get AV.

If your first goal is to fly, then be an officer, then I would highly suggest WOCS to become a Warrant Officer. They have longevity at the company level, and continuously fly, as opposed to the commissioned officers that move around and do staff time. If your goal is to be an Officer, then USMA followed by ROTC would be my courses of action. If you have any other questions, feel free to contact me. I'm on the global, and pretty easy to find.
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CPT Company Commander
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You're degree discipline won't matter as much as getting good grades and doing well academically. I commissioned into AV with a degree in Architecture. My wife is also an AV officer and got her degree in Advertising/Journalism.

ROTC rates everyone regardless of prior service on what they did while they were in college/ROTC. Your grades, participation, awards, volunteer hours, extra-curriculars, sports, anything you did while in ROTC is quantified down into a score that ranks you on a nationwide order of merit list (OML) against every other ROTC cadet commissioning in that fiscal year. The number one cadet gets first pick and so on down the line, so if you're halfway down and they're out of AV slots, then you're out of luck.

Being prior service is definitely an advantage in that you will be given more opportunities to mentor and help the cadets who are straight from high school with no prior service/experience (like I was) but not in terms of actual raw score for the OML. If you want an active duty spot as an Aviation officer, do well in school, do well in ROTC, and get yourself as high on that OML as possible. Rule of thumb: If you finish top 10% you will most likely get your first choice of branch.

On the other hand, should you go National Guard/Reserve, you need to contact the individual states or Army Reserve around your junior/senior year and schedule a board with them where they look at your records, prior aviation experience, SIFT score, PT score, GPA, things of that nature to decide whether to accept you into aviation. OML has very little to do with it. But once you're in, it's the same career track as active duty. I myself went the National Guard route because 1. I wanted a civilian career and 2. I didn't want to chance myself with the OML. I graduated when the Army was downsizing, and AV slots were few and far between.

Hope this helps! Good luck!
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CPT Philip Bailey
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The most important thing to do is find schools with the area of study you are seeking. Then find the ones with an ROTC program. Generally, you can do this by region. You do have an advantage over average cadet militarily, but you may be disadvantaged because you are probably out the habit of studying every day.
Advice: Visit the school and the ROTC unit. Talk with the military instructors what do I have to do to become a pilot. Talk to several. Then develop a plan. Determine the standards you must meet to achieve your goal. Work hard to meet the standards.
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COL David Turk
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That's what I did, although that was not my initial plan.
Being a vet does help, since you'll have practical experience while most of your classmates will not. Helped me standout in summer camp.
I'm going to go against the grain here and say, pick the college that offers what you want in a degree. Then check on the ROTC programs.
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