Posted on May 12, 2015
How many of us have seen closed-doors racism in the military?
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I don't have any links or surveys, just personal experiences.
From my observations, racism is alive in the military, particularly among officers. I don't know why it seems that way, but my guess would be that there are more minorities in the enlisted ranks?
My own observations mostly involved Marines; the interesting part was that they would - only behind closed doors - say some pretty awful things about nearly any minority you could imagine, including other Marines, but not a single one of them ever said any of those things about their own subordinates or teammates.
I've witnessed it a lot with the Army as well, a little bit with the Navy, and almost not at all with the Air Force. Is it perhaps just a grunt-centric attitude that they want to shock people with what they say, maybe? They say rough things for shock value, and don't act on those words? I'm not entirely convinced.
I've had plenty of friends - particularly while I was in college - who would say any awful thing necessary to get a good laugh from a group. Is that what this is? Or is there something else behind it?
Now's your chance to either sound off about how you feel, or set the story straight.
From my observations, racism is alive in the military, particularly among officers. I don't know why it seems that way, but my guess would be that there are more minorities in the enlisted ranks?
My own observations mostly involved Marines; the interesting part was that they would - only behind closed doors - say some pretty awful things about nearly any minority you could imagine, including other Marines, but not a single one of them ever said any of those things about their own subordinates or teammates.
I've witnessed it a lot with the Army as well, a little bit with the Navy, and almost not at all with the Air Force. Is it perhaps just a grunt-centric attitude that they want to shock people with what they say, maybe? They say rough things for shock value, and don't act on those words? I'm not entirely convinced.
I've had plenty of friends - particularly while I was in college - who would say any awful thing necessary to get a good laugh from a group. Is that what this is? Or is there something else behind it?
Now's your chance to either sound off about how you feel, or set the story straight.
Leadership
Racism
Officers
NCOs
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 27
There always be couple of Enlisted and officer out there, I don't to disrespect any member, but i just want to point out something. We all join for a reason, to serve and protect for everyone to live freely, We fought side by side so why coudn't we just get along? If racism get the best of you then you fail the mission.
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You're absolutely right. And, deep down, I think people know that. The people I've witnessed say the worst things are still able to buckle down and work as a team with everybody to get the job done. That's what makes it an odd and polarizing subject.
I Know I Used to Say some God Awful things. Not thinking, Not Realizing just how Hurtful they could be. I was raised in Unique Community in Cincinnati, OH German/Irish/Black and there definitely were some terms that Have no Place in Polite Society, Hell existing at all. If You're from Cincinnati a Very Common Slam is "Communist Faggot" I used that Way to Often and I was quite Old before I figured Out Just How Offensive that was. While I served on the Arkansas I had a Black Co-Worker born in the British East Indies, A very talented Cryptologic Technician Maintenance, Nothing He Couldn't fix but Often I made a Crack that He had a Magic Chicken Foot that Fixed Everything, I'm Really Sure, He didn't Like that. Wisdom Come with Age I Hope.
Statistically, the number of people who are racial minorities who are part of the officer corps is higher than the percentage of the general population comprised of those minorities. Are there individuals in the military who are racist? Of course there are. But I believe there are pretty strong protections built into the system against institutionalized rqcism.
Let's see a celebrity used the "N" ten years ago. And is forced off the air and banished from the air waves. Heck if you say marriage is between a man and a woman your career is going no ware. And Racism is used to describe everything now.
I heard an occasional off color joke, but racism? I never ever witnessed an officer act in a racist manner. Never saw them hurt someone's chances in a fitrep or take any other adverse action just because of race or religion. It was all about integrity and work ethic at all of my commands for 13 years.
The kind of racism I saw was where people were given preferential treatment and/or treated differently based on their race. People are afraid to call out substandard performance for fear of upsetting the PC police. It's not just race that's the problem, it's also gender, sexual orientation, and intelligence.
General Mundy got raked over the coals for stating a fact. Black LT's were having a more difficult time with land navigation than the other LT's. He correctly identified a problem and he was trying to figure out a solution... but you'll never find a solution if you don't state the problem! Catch-22.
I was a LT at The Basic School and at least in my company it was true. Our black LT's DID have a rougher time getting through Land Nav. For some, there was no difference and they did just fine, but a higher percentage of blacks did in fact have problems running around the woods with a map and compass, finding boxes hidden in the brush. Personally, I don't think it had anything to do with limitation of their cranial ability to abstract and visualize terrain features based on countour lines, but rather, it had to do with how they were brought up. Unless they grew up in the country, they probably didn't run into situations where they had to abstract and visualize terrain in their heads. They may not have ever been out camping in the woods, or played with a compass as youngsters. Maybe their interest in school was in other subjects besides math. For reasons unknown to Gen Mundy, they were having problems and he wanted to find solutions.
The fact that Gen Mundy identified a problem with Black LT's doing poorly at something was not racist, but it didn't stop the race baiters from whining and playing the race card. Gen Mundy was only guilty of being honest. Telling the truth and trying to address a known problem landed him in hot water. His punishment for telling the truth? If memory serves correct, he retired a couple months sooner than planned.
General Mundy got raked over the coals for stating a fact. Black LT's were having a more difficult time with land navigation than the other LT's. He correctly identified a problem and he was trying to figure out a solution... but you'll never find a solution if you don't state the problem! Catch-22.
I was a LT at The Basic School and at least in my company it was true. Our black LT's DID have a rougher time getting through Land Nav. For some, there was no difference and they did just fine, but a higher percentage of blacks did in fact have problems running around the woods with a map and compass, finding boxes hidden in the brush. Personally, I don't think it had anything to do with limitation of their cranial ability to abstract and visualize terrain features based on countour lines, but rather, it had to do with how they were brought up. Unless they grew up in the country, they probably didn't run into situations where they had to abstract and visualize terrain in their heads. They may not have ever been out camping in the woods, or played with a compass as youngsters. Maybe their interest in school was in other subjects besides math. For reasons unknown to Gen Mundy, they were having problems and he wanted to find solutions.
The fact that Gen Mundy identified a problem with Black LT's doing poorly at something was not racist, but it didn't stop the race baiters from whining and playing the race card. Gen Mundy was only guilty of being honest. Telling the truth and trying to address a known problem landed him in hot water. His punishment for telling the truth? If memory serves correct, he retired a couple months sooner than planned.
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That's unfortunate. I know nothing about that situation, so I'm currently unable to comment intelligently beyond saying that I agree with your sentiment in that results don't lie, and people shouldn't be making something more of an issue than it is.
Capt Jeff S.
If you want to find out WHO Gen Mundy was, click on the link "Remembering General Mundy" next to his picture.
He was known for being controversial because he didn't let PC stop him from telling the truth. Am pretty sure that CBS did their best in their interview to portray him in the worst possible manner because of his "old school" tell-it-like-it-is mentality.
The following link has to do with the CBS Interview: http://www.cbsnews.com/news/a-few-good-white-men/
He was known for being controversial because he didn't let PC stop him from telling the truth. Am pretty sure that CBS did their best in their interview to portray him in the worst possible manner because of his "old school" tell-it-like-it-is mentality.
The following link has to do with the CBS Interview: http://www.cbsnews.com/news/a-few-good-white-men/
The former commandant of the Marine Corps embodied courage — intellectual and physical.
We had a 1stSgt who was black. He would do anything to protect his fellow black Marines. One in particular was always late and mouthed off to NCO's. The 1st Sgt refused to NJP him when he was UA for an entire day. Any other Marines would get NJP for less offense.
While at our work sections one day a Marine from another unit approached me saying that a white Marine just called a black Marine a Ni@@@@. I was obligated to report it even though these Marines lived together and were best friends. Our 1stSgt , not the same one, was going to NJP this Marine. I went back to the work section to get this Marine. Then I heard a Black Marine jokingly yell at a white Marine calling him a honkey. I went to the 1stSgt and told him what was said. His reply was "honkey isn't that bad" I called BS!!. I said all the Marines heard it. If you NJP the white Marine for racial slurs, you must do the same to the black Marine. Im glad the 1stSgt had a change of heart. Instead he spoke to the entire battery about racism and perception.
While at our work sections one day a Marine from another unit approached me saying that a white Marine just called a black Marine a Ni@@@@. I was obligated to report it even though these Marines lived together and were best friends. Our 1stSgt , not the same one, was going to NJP this Marine. I went back to the work section to get this Marine. Then I heard a Black Marine jokingly yell at a white Marine calling him a honkey. I went to the 1stSgt and told him what was said. His reply was "honkey isn't that bad" I called BS!!. I said all the Marines heard it. If you NJP the white Marine for racial slurs, you must do the same to the black Marine. Im glad the 1stSgt had a change of heart. Instead he spoke to the entire battery about racism and perception.
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