Posted on Jan 22, 2016
I'm facing separation due to failing my 2nd record APFT within a year. Can I take terminal leave or DO I have to sell them?
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Posted in these groups: 
Leave9A300: Awaiting Discharge/Separation/Retirement for Reasons Beyond Their Control
Discharge
APFT
Transition
Leave9A300: Awaiting Discharge/Separation/Retirement for Reasons Beyond Their Control Discharge APFT Transition
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 11
Leave is always a request, and while it is normally approved.. nobody here can say for sure,, that is a question for your chain of command>
From the other side of the street..... you are still on the books for the unit even on terminal leave.. yes different category but still there.. Known loss, and all that... For reasons only you and the command know, you are being involuntarily separated … While you have stated the separation being used,,,, I would have to assume there is more to it… and that more will likely impact the approval of your leave request. If there is no “other side” of the story, I’d think your leave request will be approved.. but again, only your commander knows
Good luck, now go ask.
From the other side of the street..... you are still on the books for the unit even on terminal leave.. yes different category but still there.. Known loss, and all that... For reasons only you and the command know, you are being involuntarily separated … While you have stated the separation being used,,,, I would have to assume there is more to it… and that more will likely impact the approval of your leave request. If there is no “other side” of the story, I’d think your leave request will be approved.. but again, only your commander knows
Good luck, now go ask.
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The best place to get an answer to that question is your local I.G. He/She will have ready access to all applicable regulations and can properly advise you on applicability and how to apply. They will also be subject matter experts on military separation, regardless of reason, if you wish to appeal an involuntary discharge. The final authority for any decision concerning that action rests at the Two-star level of your command. You have the right to appeal such separation action if you have not already done so. Not every "body" fits the nice, neat, parameters of the military's physical fitness program. There are exceptions to every rule. That Two-star has the authority to overrule separation "IF" the service member displays an acceptable military appearance, demonstrates satisfactory job performance, and desires to continue their service. I do not have the facts of your particular issue before me, so can't comment further, but if any doubt exists in your mind and you wish to stay in the military, then I strongly recommend you seek assistance from your local I.G. If you still face separation, at least your mind will be settled that you have utilized all applicable avenues available to you for resolution.
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It is financial beneficial to use your terminal leave as you receive BAH, COLA (if applicable), medical benefits and so on versus cashing in and paying taxes. In the end it is your decision. As many have mentioned, it has to go through the approval process. Be the subject matter expert of your own transition so no one give you BS. Good Luck.
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LT (Join to see)
Raul, isn't it still the case that medical benefits extend 6 months past separation? Also, the SM gets the BAH etc. if authorized only until the separation date. Therefore, selling back leave is "extra" money, if the member stays at the unit until separation. In that manner, they leave with a nest egg, rather than empty pockets. BTW, how is Alaska treating you?
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MAJ Raúl Rovira
John, blast from the past. Good to see you old friend. We will have to catch up on Skype. Alaska is so awesome I retired here.
Yes, I've seen what you have mentioned where soldiers receive extension on medical benefits only. There is no BAH, no PX or MWR facilities.
You have a good point of view about having an extra month or two of base pay. It comes down to what is move value, paid time off or money.
I recently retired, 2 days left of terminal leave. I am so glad I took my terminal leave to go networking, interviews, attend conferences, professional lunches with the peace of mind that living expenses are covered for that period. I've seen soldiers in Alaska take professional/vocational training during terminal leave to help secure a job.
Yes, I've seen what you have mentioned where soldiers receive extension on medical benefits only. There is no BAH, no PX or MWR facilities.
You have a good point of view about having an extra month or two of base pay. It comes down to what is move value, paid time off or money.
I recently retired, 2 days left of terminal leave. I am so glad I took my terminal leave to go networking, interviews, attend conferences, professional lunches with the peace of mind that living expenses are covered for that period. I've seen soldiers in Alaska take professional/vocational training during terminal leave to help secure a job.
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You should be allowed terminal leave, which is by far the batter choice in nearly every circumstance.
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SSG(P) Claudett P Hillotero
Roger, 1SG Jerry Healy. My reason is that I've escorted troopers in similar situations, and it was a requirement for them to be allowed their terminal leave. Depends on the situation if it's just more then Failing the APFT.
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1SG (Join to see)
SSG(P) Claudett P Hillotero - I read you, Sergeant. Really the obstacle here is the commander. He does have authority to deny the request for transition leave. I'm with you that the only reason to do so (other than he's a complete ass hat) is if there is more to the story. But the answer SPC (Join to see) got from his 1SG was not accurate, at least with what we know.
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SPC (Join to see)
Thank you 1SG Jerry Healy and SGT Claudett P Hillotero. I will talk to IG and the S1 and see what they say if my paperwork happens to be complete. I'm hoping I can take another APFT within these next 80 days to redeem myself but if not then I'm just trying to prepare myself to transition with no complications. I really do appreciate the inputs and information.
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SSG (Join to see)
Talk to the legal folks at TDS specifically (once tour chapter packet is complete that is your first stop before it goes for signature by the command). They will have the best information. Your commander can always let you take the leave before you get your orders. You will have 10 days to clear and leave from the day you get your orders. The real question I see is whether or not you can take terminal leave. The second place to ask is the transition office. Each type of chapter gives you different rights and benefits. They deal with it on a daily basis and will be able to answer all your questions.
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Are you in your first term, under 8 year MSO? If so, I believe you will have to sell your leave and that depends what your separation orders say. Check with transition if you do not have your orders yet as the reg may have changed.
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You should have a choice of either or, but push that question to your S1 through your Chain
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SPC (Join to see)
Sounds like you have 80 days to bust your ass and pass your APFT. Get with your first line, he/she should be all over your ass making sure you are training to pass...if not, go to your leadership above him/her and request assistance. You show some initiative about wanting to pass and wanting to stay in, that would go a long way in showing your Commander that you really want to stay in. The ball is in your court, bust your ass, pass your APFT and all of this goes away.
Sounds like you have 80 days to bust your ass and pass your APFT. Get with your first line, he/she should be all over your ass making sure you are training to pass...if not, go to your leadership above him/her and request assistance. You show some initiative about wanting to pass and wanting to stay in, that would go a long way in showing your Commander that you really want to stay in. The ball is in your court, bust your ass, pass your APFT and all of this goes away.
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I know this has absolutely nothing to do with your question regarding terminal leave but I have to ask:
What led up to this Chapter? It bothers me that you are being separated for something like this. SFC Peter Kain asked a similar question. Our job as NCO's is to mentor our Soldiers and make them successful. I am wondering where the break down occurred? Something in the system failed......
What led up to this Chapter? It bothers me that you are being separated for something like this. SFC Peter Kain asked a similar question. Our job as NCO's is to mentor our Soldiers and make them successful. I am wondering where the break down occurred? Something in the system failed......
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SPC (Join to see)
HI MSG Bakowski I'll be glad to answer. I failed my 2MR in October by 10 seconds on my semi-annual record; I took my 2nd record earlier this month and failed it by 2 minutes due to the cold weather. I know it may sound like an excuse but I honestly gave it my best effort I could since it was mandatory for me to take it. My 1SG told me that within the next 80 days if my chapter paperwork isn't done then I may have a chance to take it again and if I pass then it's a 50/50 chance the commander will decide whether or not if I stay in. But if the paperwork is done then I get the boot. I'm still fighting against it and have a diagnostic coming up next month so I'm going to pass that with flying colors to the best of my strength and just hope everything from the weather to my health is excellent.
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Some generalities.
What do your orders say? Usually the date of your discharge will be about 30 days from when the packet comes back. However, sometimes that can be shortened. You normally get 10 business days to clear and the rest can be ordinary leave. They will not extend you though for the sole purpose of using more leave and you'll have to sell it in that case.
What type of discharge did you get and are you a pain? It is possible to have you gone in ten days with no leave based on how motivated your command team is and how well connected they are to personnel division. Or if you are low risk they can just let it ride for 30 days. You can always apply for leave though and you will need a leave form to get your orders.
If your discharge is for APFT you'll probably get some ordinary leave. If your discharge is for misconduct you can be down to five days to clear and shown the door. The commander will make the decision though regarding your leave.
What do your orders say? Usually the date of your discharge will be about 30 days from when the packet comes back. However, sometimes that can be shortened. You normally get 10 business days to clear and the rest can be ordinary leave. They will not extend you though for the sole purpose of using more leave and you'll have to sell it in that case.
What type of discharge did you get and are you a pain? It is possible to have you gone in ten days with no leave based on how motivated your command team is and how well connected they are to personnel division. Or if you are low risk they can just let it ride for 30 days. You can always apply for leave though and you will need a leave form to get your orders.
If your discharge is for APFT you'll probably get some ordinary leave. If your discharge is for misconduct you can be down to five days to clear and shown the door. The commander will make the decision though regarding your leave.
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SPC Joshua Thurston, For future reference, If any one gives you any crazy answers that you don't understand. Please do me a favor and tell them roger. Then after go do your research. Please read up more on your rights and regulation's.
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