Posted on Jun 17, 2014
If you were the President of the United States how would you deal with ISIS?
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http://www.cnn.com/2015/03/08/opinions/bergen-isis-boko-haram/index.html
ISIS has taken over media in a way unprecedented by terrorist groups. Now other terrorist groups are claiming support for ISIS. Should Congress declare war on ISIS? Can you even declare a state of war against an ideology? If you were President how would you stop the spread of ISIS?
ISIS has taken over media in a way unprecedented by terrorist groups. Now other terrorist groups are claiming support for ISIS. Should Congress declare war on ISIS? Can you even declare a state of war against an ideology? If you were President how would you stop the spread of ISIS?
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 70
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ISIS is not a country; they are a Terrorist organization. War can only be declared on a country...
The genie has to be put back in the bottle. To do this we have to step back away from the rhetoric and propaganda, forget politics and ideology, and get honest.
First, we have to name the enemy. Nothing will be accomplished by averting our eyes and being "diplomatic". ISIS is a terrorist organization. They are Islamic. Take their word for it. And they are very extreme in their attitudes. They do not fear death. Rattling sabers in their direction without any intent of using them is a futile exercise. They welcome death. Thus, they must be destroyed. Totally annihilated.
Second, who must do the deed? If not men of good will, then who? Sadly, most of the world has functionally disarmed preferring to save their treasure while America spends its to protect them. Many would be hard put to muster enough troops to put on a decent parade. I believe it was two years ago that Britain sent its whole Army on Christmas leave to save a few Pounds. Their navy, once the rulers of the seas, now possesses just 19 surface warships and 10 submarines. Is that enough to protect the English Channel? Maybe, but hardly enough to project power anywhere else in the world. How about the UN? Yeah, right. That's why, I suppose, the world is waiting with bated breath to see what we will do.
Third, how should we accomplish it if we accept the mission, not just to subjugate ISIS, but rather to destroy it completely. (Leave but one iota of this cancer and it will grow back.) Airstrikes? Drone strikes? Are there any who yet defend strategic air power as the complete answer? If we don't have the will to commit totally, then we should do nothing. There is no sense in wasting lives and treasure on another half-hearted mission. We've already have had enough of those to understand that we only leave a festering sore that infects the world with even worse terror.
Four, who is with us? I'm sure there will be some. Jordan sounds ready. However, most will abstain. I don't think there's much we can do about that. However, any nation that interferes must be considered an ally of ISIS and treated as a hostile. Otherwise, they will provide a safe haven where the remnants of ISIS may once again rise.
Five, do we have the leadership for this mission? Obviously the answer is no. That is why I do not expect any good result.
First, we have to name the enemy. Nothing will be accomplished by averting our eyes and being "diplomatic". ISIS is a terrorist organization. They are Islamic. Take their word for it. And they are very extreme in their attitudes. They do not fear death. Rattling sabers in their direction without any intent of using them is a futile exercise. They welcome death. Thus, they must be destroyed. Totally annihilated.
Second, who must do the deed? If not men of good will, then who? Sadly, most of the world has functionally disarmed preferring to save their treasure while America spends its to protect them. Many would be hard put to muster enough troops to put on a decent parade. I believe it was two years ago that Britain sent its whole Army on Christmas leave to save a few Pounds. Their navy, once the rulers of the seas, now possesses just 19 surface warships and 10 submarines. Is that enough to protect the English Channel? Maybe, but hardly enough to project power anywhere else in the world. How about the UN? Yeah, right. That's why, I suppose, the world is waiting with bated breath to see what we will do.
Third, how should we accomplish it if we accept the mission, not just to subjugate ISIS, but rather to destroy it completely. (Leave but one iota of this cancer and it will grow back.) Airstrikes? Drone strikes? Are there any who yet defend strategic air power as the complete answer? If we don't have the will to commit totally, then we should do nothing. There is no sense in wasting lives and treasure on another half-hearted mission. We've already have had enough of those to understand that we only leave a festering sore that infects the world with even worse terror.
Four, who is with us? I'm sure there will be some. Jordan sounds ready. However, most will abstain. I don't think there's much we can do about that. However, any nation that interferes must be considered an ally of ISIS and treated as a hostile. Otherwise, they will provide a safe haven where the remnants of ISIS may once again rise.
Five, do we have the leadership for this mission? Obviously the answer is no. That is why I do not expect any good result.
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War should always be the very last option. We've seen the aftermath of OEF and OIF. Well, all wars in general- casualties, mental health issues, expense, civilians being displaced from their own homes, etc.
Since ISIS has no official nation, I think it's best to take them out from their roots. It has been said that ISIS is the most richest terriost network, therefore, crippling their finance would help slow them down (lots of Intel). Also, getting rid of ISIS top leadership would help in spreading their ideas. US involvement and as well as other nations is crucial in making this happen. A "mini war" where other nations are involved because their helping pull some of the weight
would help minimize a "major war" footprint. I'll quote President Obama- this isn't just US problem but the world's problem.
The root cause is really ISIS's idea- how do you get to the root cause?
Since ISIS has no official nation, I think it's best to take them out from their roots. It has been said that ISIS is the most richest terriost network, therefore, crippling their finance would help slow them down (lots of Intel). Also, getting rid of ISIS top leadership would help in spreading their ideas. US involvement and as well as other nations is crucial in making this happen. A "mini war" where other nations are involved because their helping pull some of the weight
would help minimize a "major war" footprint. I'll quote President Obama- this isn't just US problem but the world's problem.
The root cause is really ISIS's idea- how do you get to the root cause?
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The U.S. Has not declared war in half a century. I personally don't think we should be involved with the ME at all at this point.
You can't win a war against an ideology when you're actions would inadvertently support their cause.
That said I would go again of caked on.
You can't win a war against an ideology when you're actions would inadvertently support their cause.
That said I would go again of caked on.
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If I were Commander in Chief, based on what I know about the threat and my limited understanding of all the moving parts pertaining to that region, I would roll up my sleeves and inform the world that the full might and power of the U.S. would be unleashed upon our enemies who torture and kill our people (and allies, and innocents, and civilians, etc.).
I would fully enable our special forces to gather intel, target, and annihilate the enemy. Period. No rules of engagement. No nice-nice. No kiddie gloves.
I would also work hand in hand with other allied nations to support THEIR efforts to battle this threat. Joint operations. Sharing intel.
This enemy does not respond to words.
They respond to power. Might. Fear.
And I'd give it to them.
I would fully enable our special forces to gather intel, target, and annihilate the enemy. Period. No rules of engagement. No nice-nice. No kiddie gloves.
I would also work hand in hand with other allied nations to support THEIR efforts to battle this threat. Joint operations. Sharing intel.
This enemy does not respond to words.
They respond to power. Might. Fear.
And I'd give it to them.
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SGT (Join to see)
Pretty straight forward. I do agree that words do not intimidate them and it's time to take action. Unfortunately the no rules of engagement will never fly.
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Cpl Anthony Pearson
I'd certainly say there are 'rules', and indeed, there would be. But those rules would be LOOSE where terrorists/extremists were involved.
Our men and women would know that they were given damn-near free reign to get the job done, and there would be NO witch hunt when they got home.
Our men and women would know that they were given damn-near free reign to get the job done, and there would be NO witch hunt when they got home.
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Is it actually (legally) possible to declare war on an NGO (non-government organization)?
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CPT Zachary Brooks
I think we could consider them more so a Non-State Actor than an NGO.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Violent_non-state_actor
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Violent_non-state_actor
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This gets really tricky.
Lt Col Fred Marheine, PMP brings up some great points.
I'm going to approach it from a different angle.
Only Congress can Declare War. However, once war is declared, there is no formal mechanism in the Constitution to "Un-declare war." The best we have is Surrender Treaties.
The act of Declaring War, grants the President huge amounts of additional powers in his capacity as Commander in Chief.
The AUMF model adds a Check & Balance for "expeditionary operations" which I think are needed. If this were a National Defense issue, I'd be 100% for declaring outright war. If this were an actual State/Nation invading other states, I'd probably be at the 85% mark. But being a "stateless organization" and not directly related to our own National Defense, I thin the AUMF makes the most sense.
Lt Col Fred Marheine, PMP brings up some great points.
I'm going to approach it from a different angle.
Only Congress can Declare War. However, once war is declared, there is no formal mechanism in the Constitution to "Un-declare war." The best we have is Surrender Treaties.
The act of Declaring War, grants the President huge amounts of additional powers in his capacity as Commander in Chief.
The AUMF model adds a Check & Balance for "expeditionary operations" which I think are needed. If this were a National Defense issue, I'd be 100% for declaring outright war. If this were an actual State/Nation invading other states, I'd probably be at the 85% mark. But being a "stateless organization" and not directly related to our own National Defense, I thin the AUMF makes the most sense.
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First, great question / topic PFC Eric Minchey. I'm really torn on this.
Constitutionally, I believe the answer is yes - a declaration of war from the Congress is necessary / appropriate, both to gain the endorsement of the "people's representatives" and to put the rest of the world on notice: those nation-states who give material support to this enemy will be considered their allies and be subject to our retribution. I think it might also help communicate to the public the gravity of this situation in a way I don't think the majority understand. It may also result in a decision to NOT declare war - which I think would be enormously important in bringing to a head the ongoing abuses of Constitutional authorities and violations of the checks and balances between the branches of government.
Operationally, I agree with others that declaring a state of war against a bunch of barbarians without borders espousing their version of "ideas" has no immediate effect. I also am extremely troubled at investing the Executive branch - and especially this administration - with war powers / decision-making. I simply don't trust them to not use theses authorities against their political opponents under the cloak of "fighting ISIS, wherever they exist."
Ultimately, I come down on the side of following the Constitution: if we intend to prosecute an extended, overt military campaign, Congress should declare a state of war. I would want Congress to demand regular oversight / updates and to hold the executive accountable for successfully prosecuting the campaign - pipe-dreams, I fear. Nevertheless, I think it is the correct approach. For the record, I believe Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, and Afghanistan (to name the most obvious) all fall into this bucket as well.
Constitutionally, I believe the answer is yes - a declaration of war from the Congress is necessary / appropriate, both to gain the endorsement of the "people's representatives" and to put the rest of the world on notice: those nation-states who give material support to this enemy will be considered their allies and be subject to our retribution. I think it might also help communicate to the public the gravity of this situation in a way I don't think the majority understand. It may also result in a decision to NOT declare war - which I think would be enormously important in bringing to a head the ongoing abuses of Constitutional authorities and violations of the checks and balances between the branches of government.
Operationally, I agree with others that declaring a state of war against a bunch of barbarians without borders espousing their version of "ideas" has no immediate effect. I also am extremely troubled at investing the Executive branch - and especially this administration - with war powers / decision-making. I simply don't trust them to not use theses authorities against their political opponents under the cloak of "fighting ISIS, wherever they exist."
Ultimately, I come down on the side of following the Constitution: if we intend to prosecute an extended, overt military campaign, Congress should declare a state of war. I would want Congress to demand regular oversight / updates and to hold the executive accountable for successfully prosecuting the campaign - pipe-dreams, I fear. Nevertheless, I think it is the correct approach. For the record, I believe Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, and Afghanistan (to name the most obvious) all fall into this bucket as well.
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PFC Eric Minchey
Although some refuse to admit or believe that ISIS is an entity, they think they are (and so do I) and, as such, I think Congress should declare war on them and bring everything we have to bear to destroy them. It is obvious that the President will continue to play lip-service to the ISIS threat and that Congress will need to stand up and take the action necessary to end this reign of terror. The longer we wait, the stronger and more emboldened they get.
Although some refuse to admit or believe that ISIS is an entity, they think they are (and so do I) and, as such, I think Congress should declare war on them and bring everything we have to bear to destroy them. It is obvious that the President will continue to play lip-service to the ISIS threat and that Congress will need to stand up and take the action necessary to end this reign of terror. The longer we wait, the stronger and more emboldened they get.
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SFC Steven Harvey
COL.,
May I ask what the final outcome would be in such an action? We have seen what Iraq and the Stan look like after a decade of occupation.
It could be debated that our actions post 9/11 gave rise to ISIS so forgive me if I am not eager to go right back over there when victory is nothing short of a vague theory on what success is.
May I ask what the final outcome would be in such an action? We have seen what Iraq and the Stan look like after a decade of occupation.
It could be debated that our actions post 9/11 gave rise to ISIS so forgive me if I am not eager to go right back over there when victory is nothing short of a vague theory on what success is.
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COL Jean (John) F. B.
SFC Steven Harvey
Not the best answer, I know, but all I can say is that the final outcome should be the total annihilation of ISIS. Tough to measure, but success would be defined as an end to their reign of terror. Will that stop terrorism? Absolutely not, no more than decimating the drug cartels will stop drug dealers. However, it would result in taking away the command and control and organized groups of terrorists that are getting stronger and more violent every day.
ISIS is not just a criminal element/terrorist organization. It is an Army, with leadership, money, goals and objectives. We have to treat them as such and defeat them with an Army (and other services) that can give back everything and more that they can throw at us.
No easy answers to this, however, one thing is clear... We can't defeat them by doing what we are doing now.
As far as your going back there, if we continue to do nothing, they will save you the trip and be on your own turf. Of that, I am positive.
Not the best answer, I know, but all I can say is that the final outcome should be the total annihilation of ISIS. Tough to measure, but success would be defined as an end to their reign of terror. Will that stop terrorism? Absolutely not, no more than decimating the drug cartels will stop drug dealers. However, it would result in taking away the command and control and organized groups of terrorists that are getting stronger and more violent every day.
ISIS is not just a criminal element/terrorist organization. It is an Army, with leadership, money, goals and objectives. We have to treat them as such and defeat them with an Army (and other services) that can give back everything and more that they can throw at us.
No easy answers to this, however, one thing is clear... We can't defeat them by doing what we are doing now.
As far as your going back there, if we continue to do nothing, they will save you the trip and be on your own turf. Of that, I am positive.
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SFC Steven Harvey
The acts they do are absolutely inhuman and despicable there is no question.
However as someone who fully supports the 9/11 Commision Report findings regarding blowback I simply can't help but be concerned about the consequences of our actions.
Not that what I say matters but if it were my call I wouldn't do anything unless I had the support of every other country on the planet (military & financial support), a full declaration of war from Congress and a clear and well understood definition of what our plan for victory is.
However as someone who fully supports the 9/11 Commision Report findings regarding blowback I simply can't help but be concerned about the consequences of our actions.
Not that what I say matters but if it were my call I wouldn't do anything unless I had the support of every other country on the planet (military & financial support), a full declaration of war from Congress and a clear and well understood definition of what our plan for victory is.
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