Posted on Oct 26, 2017
In relation to the Military Times poll on white nationalism, what does this mean?
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https://www.militarytimes.com/news/pentagon-congress/2017/10/23/military-times-poll-one-in-four-troops-sees-white-nationalism-in-the-ranks/?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=EBB%2010.25.2017&utm_term=Editorial%20-%20Military%20-%20Early%20Bird%20Brief
Please read the story first. If this conversation turns into a shouting match - I'm out. I'm asking respectfully because I respect your opinions on this forum if you've served.
1. I understand what Nationalism is and I understand that its opposite is the Globalist.
2. A Nationalist does not necessarily have a political or racial agenda other than their nation first. A Nationalist is not necessarily a demagogue.
3. We have all seen racist events and met racist people in the military; true statement.
4. I believe that news media carries a Globalist agenda or propaganda so I'm not inclined to believe much what I read from a global news agency.
With those statements in mind, why the focus on "white nationalism" since I don't believe it to necessarily be racism. It certainly can be, since race minded people are everywhere but this seems an attempt to connect white racist with a Nationalistic movement. Is this IOT support a globalist movement?
Am I wrong?
Please read the story first. If this conversation turns into a shouting match - I'm out. I'm asking respectfully because I respect your opinions on this forum if you've served.
1. I understand what Nationalism is and I understand that its opposite is the Globalist.
2. A Nationalist does not necessarily have a political or racial agenda other than their nation first. A Nationalist is not necessarily a demagogue.
3. We have all seen racist events and met racist people in the military; true statement.
4. I believe that news media carries a Globalist agenda or propaganda so I'm not inclined to believe much what I read from a global news agency.
With those statements in mind, why the focus on "white nationalism" since I don't believe it to necessarily be racism. It certainly can be, since race minded people are everywhere but this seems an attempt to connect white racist with a Nationalistic movement. Is this IOT support a globalist movement?
Am I wrong?
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Racism
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Posted 7 y ago
Responses: 15
I think the question on white nationalism stemmed from the proximity to the event in Charlottesville. Look at the demographics of the survey also. Mostly service members under 30. Probably a minority of the people who took the survey were senior leaders and policy makers. IMO overall the poll means very little. It might mean Mil Times was trying to grab a headline for itself.
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Col Joseph Lenertz
Yes, and I think a component of the (higher-than-I-would-have-expected) results is the story never tells us if they DEFINED white nationalism before they asked the questions about it. If they didn't define it, the poll means very little indeed.
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Col Joseph Lenertz - part of my point and reason for asking. I'm not sure if anyone knows what words mean anymore...
COL Vincent Stoneking
MAJ Charles Blake - Words mean things?
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COL Vincent Stoneking - sir, ordinarily I'd say that words have meaning only on a good day. However, these days I think the most correct answer is that words only have meaning depending on who is using them, what they stand for and what their point is...
MAJ Charles Blake- I think there is one item that your are omitting. Why now? Why is (white) nationalism in the news, now. I know I am a nationalist every 2 years while watching the Olympics. I was rooting for a pregnant Mom last winter Olympics that was curling and I think it was the US vs Canada. I don't think that makes me an extremist though. This is all about power and control. The gig is up for the elite. We, the peasant class are pissed and that is why Trump was elected. Now, anything and everything about loving your country will be cast in a negative light. Take the poll in the article as an example. Minority members in the military think there is a problem with white nationalism. So what did they do? They volunteered to be in a profession with predominate white members with guns?? Does that make any sense? No it does not. And then the article mentions all the hot vacation destinations as safer alternatives to being with white nationalists such as Syria and Pakistan. Give me a break. I bet you a spicy pork bulgogi lunch plate that throughout all of MEDCOM your G-1 could not find one leave request for a minority Soldier that had vacationed in Syria, Pakistan or Iran. The intent of casting nationalism in a negative light is about control period.
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MSgt Steve Sweeney - I've long noticed that the military can make great points for either a progressive or conservative POV. That is one big reason that I value anyone who has served and believe their POV is worth hearing - especially if I disagree with it.
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MSgt Steve Sweeney - Conservatives are not against taxes. They are against only a small percentage of the population paying federal income taxes and others whom pay no taxes at all receiving magic money which was stolen from the government na given to them in the form of child credits or un-earned income tax credits.
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MSgt Steve Sweeney - I do not speak for conservatives. I was referring to the ideology of Conservatism. Taxes are necessary and are in the Constitution. Conservatives have an issue with all the unnecessary taxes or pork that politicians use to take from one Class of People and give to another. That is state sponsored theft. And regarding taxes it is interesting that the Liberal fairness argument is not used. Is it fair to tax someone because they are successful? If we are all equal, 14th Amendment, Equal Protection Clause should have it where all Americans are taxed equally and not on a graduated scale. Several politicians have proper a flat tax or a consumption tax.
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MSgt Steve Sweeney - Liberals love to use that as a blanket clause. I bet they would loose their minds if Mr. Trump started a program to allow allow citizens to purchase guns at a subsidized price. Its for the General Welfare, right.
Good Lord...
Some times I believe people like to make up words and phrases which have no bearing on reality or what they're trying to say. I also think that there's a herd mentality going around where people go out of their way to fit into, align, or otherwise ascribe affiliations with whatever the latest and greatest "thing" is.
One major problem I have with polls such as this is that they don't DEFINE the terms they use. They're wishy-washy and ambiguous as a result, therefore the "results" of their polls are somewhat less than useful.
So, what is a "white nationalist"? If you asked a bunch of people at random, you'd PROBABLY get responses along the line of "buncha racist bigots". Well, OK...why not just call them racists? Racist bigots? White supremacists? All these terms are much less ambiguous.
What does "white" plus "nationalist" MEAN? Probably the clearest and best definition is in the Wikipedia entry on this: "a type of nationalism or pan-nationalism which holds the belief that white people are a race and seeks to develop and maintain a white national identity." In other words, it's a belief by white racists that their country should be a "white country" in all aspects.
Well, now, if you break this down, "white nationalism" is nothing "new under the sun". A racist, who holds the belief that one race is superior to others by definition, would NATURALLY ascribe that belief to ALL ASPECTS OF HIS WORLDVIEW.
In other words, a racist believes that one race is religiously superior to others. That one race is genetically superior to others. That one race is more beautiful than others. That his nation should be dominated and run by one race which is superior to others. That one race should be entitled to rights and privileges that the inferior races are denied.
In other words, "white nationalism" is a SUBSET of white racist beliefs.
Are these people who claim to have experience "white nationalism" in the military REALLY experiencing white nationalism, or just racist encounters, period?
What "white nationalism" is, then, is mud clouding the water. It's not the PROBLEM...it's a SYMPTOM of the problem. That problem being, of course, racism itself.
Some times I believe people like to make up words and phrases which have no bearing on reality or what they're trying to say. I also think that there's a herd mentality going around where people go out of their way to fit into, align, or otherwise ascribe affiliations with whatever the latest and greatest "thing" is.
One major problem I have with polls such as this is that they don't DEFINE the terms they use. They're wishy-washy and ambiguous as a result, therefore the "results" of their polls are somewhat less than useful.
So, what is a "white nationalist"? If you asked a bunch of people at random, you'd PROBABLY get responses along the line of "buncha racist bigots". Well, OK...why not just call them racists? Racist bigots? White supremacists? All these terms are much less ambiguous.
What does "white" plus "nationalist" MEAN? Probably the clearest and best definition is in the Wikipedia entry on this: "a type of nationalism or pan-nationalism which holds the belief that white people are a race and seeks to develop and maintain a white national identity." In other words, it's a belief by white racists that their country should be a "white country" in all aspects.
Well, now, if you break this down, "white nationalism" is nothing "new under the sun". A racist, who holds the belief that one race is superior to others by definition, would NATURALLY ascribe that belief to ALL ASPECTS OF HIS WORLDVIEW.
In other words, a racist believes that one race is religiously superior to others. That one race is genetically superior to others. That one race is more beautiful than others. That his nation should be dominated and run by one race which is superior to others. That one race should be entitled to rights and privileges that the inferior races are denied.
In other words, "white nationalism" is a SUBSET of white racist beliefs.
Are these people who claim to have experience "white nationalism" in the military REALLY experiencing white nationalism, or just racist encounters, period?
What "white nationalism" is, then, is mud clouding the water. It's not the PROBLEM...it's a SYMPTOM of the problem. That problem being, of course, racism itself.
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CPO Glenn Moss I'll have to re-read this a few time, but I think you may have just won Rally Point for the day. Thanks for a good post. Let's call racism, racism. leave out all the other fluff which may distract from an otherwise legitimate group or POV and stick with the basic facts.
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