Posted on Jun 12, 2017
SGT Joseph Gunderson
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I believe that most, if not all of us, are familiar with the old army enlisted rank structure where one could go their entire career without ever becoming an NCO, but still make it up through the paygrades. We all have known people who were great at their jobs but not fit to lead. Is there any benefit to bringing back such an enlisted rank structure?
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Responses: 246
SGM Frank Marsh
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and on the other hand, we all know NCOs who weren't fit to lead. you can't teach leadership, only improve on it. the specialist rank, IMHO, didn't work the way it was planned. even as a SP-6 promotable, I got little respect except in my career field. I have also listened to folks say "I don't care what your score is, it's Gene's turn to move up". well, Gene (false name) came out of the guard and somehow made it to SSG, not a leader, will never be a leader, but IS one of the 'good old boys'. gene goes before the board, fails miserably, they look bad for sending him, I have to wait until next board...nope, I'm out of here.
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MSG John Wawroski
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In most units I was in, there were always a few to sometimes many Sergeants but not enough NCOs! I believe it is still this way whenever I speak to uniformed personnel. Some don't want responsibility!
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SP5 Robert Ruck
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I enjoyed being a Spec. 5. I don't feel it was a statement on my ability to lead. It reflected only on the highly technical nature of my job.
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SGT Joseph Gunderson
SGT Joseph Gunderson
>1 y
Well, see, that's another thing too. Is there really a need for a bunch of NCOs in a commo section (S6) in a cav squadron? Probably not. Maybe one NCO in the whole shop would suffice to be in charge. Same goes for a lot of technical MOSs.
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SP5 Robert Ruck
SP5 Robert Ruck
>1 y
I agree 100%.
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CPT Jim Schwebach
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Edited >1 y ago
My brother was an SP6 operating room cardio-pulmonary specialist at Walter Reed during the 70's. He had no interest in leadership positions but loved the service and the job he had. Unfortunately there was no career path for him to advance beyond his current grade. He was drawing pro pay, housing and some sort of living in the DC area supplement that probably doesn't exist now. He went to Hospital Administration to discuss promotion. They allowed as how the slot was only authorized an E6 pay grade and if he wanted better pay he could request an early out and come back to his job either as a civil servant or a contractor. He added up the bucks he was receiving, factored in his implied income such as medical benefits and compared these to the civil servant pay scales for the job and the payments contracted nurses were receiving for his job. Long story but the upshot of it was he could double his effective income by changing clothes and coming back to work in the same job as a contracted nurse. So he did. And that's why the Specialist system did not work in the advanced grades.

I'd bet the same situations apply theses days in various highly technical fields. The military trains SM to perform highly complex tasks , cyber, legal and medical for example, but cannot pay for these tasks at the going commercial rate. So the SM leave and are replaced with either contractors(Former SM trained by the military) or newly trained specialists(Future contractors trained by the military). Because govt accounting systems work the way they do, the unit may not have more than a certain number of SM in each pay grade, but does have a discretionary budget for contracted services. So they can have functional equivalency for increased costs and still be within budget. Ain't life grand?
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PFC Jonathan Albano
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I could see it as an effective way to clarify unit rank structure (leadership positions vs. non- leadership), however, I am a firm believer in the "be prepared to lead at a moments notice" philosophy that the current rank structure promotes.
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CPT Tom Monahan
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I’m for bringing back the Specialist Corps with a twist. If you are in an enlisted non-leadership slot you get the old T under your chevrons. Spec 4 looks like Corporal stripes with a T underneath. Spec 7 looks like SFC stripes with a T in the middle. Many Medical, Maintenance, Staff, MI, and even non-leader Grunts / spec Ops folks would warrant these ranks. Also in cases where a unit is over strength NCOs you can easily see who the leaders are. Before anyone bitches, those who want to lead will do their damnedest to no have the T designator on their sleeves.
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SPC Infantryman
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I agree but I don’t see or understand a reason to go beyond SP6.
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SPC Infantryman
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I agree but I see the reason to go past SP6.
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SPC Infantryman
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5 y
Don’t*
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SGT Joel Bourbeau
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By nature some cannot ever lead. If a soldier has a non-combat, or limited combat role, why not keep them as a support role in the specialties they are trained in. I was in supply and would have been fine remaining in the special tracking system, but they removed it before I got promoted. I didn’t have a problem leading, it just makes more sense to have the leaders be the ones inconstant combat trained roles.
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SSG Darrell Peters
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The one thing that really frosted me was LPN's in the Army Medical Corps. For years they were Specialists then the transition to the NCO Corp occurred. What really bothered me was no path existed for them to become Warrant Officers. I can understand an LPN serving a set amount of time as enlisted but there should be a window of opportunity to become a Warrant Officer. There are no Warrant Officer Positions in the Army Medical Corp as all the Physicians Assistants were made commissioned officers.
In certain select MOS's I can see using the Specialist Ranks. It's not that they can't lead it is just to retain good people in their field. I can see using the Specialist Rank Structure.
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