Posted on Jul 17, 2014
SSG V. Michelle Woods
34.8K
550
276
24
24
0
Soldiers just completed a 32-hour mission on the road. They get to a tiny FOB in Iraq and have 12 minutes left to grab food before the chow hall closes. The Soldiers are not freshly shaved and cannot easily access their personal hygiene items therefore technically out of regulation. Would you enforce the standard and make the Soldiers immediately go shave or would you not enforce the standard and let the Soldiers go eat?

With so many responses on RP about how we don’t have the right to pick and choose which standards we enforce, what would you do?
Avatar feed
Responses: 116
MSgt Steven Holt, NRP, CCEMT-P
2
2
0
Ever hear the phrase, "The person with the loaded weapon ALWAYS wins the argument!"?

Any asshat who is more worried about unshaven soldiers than they are combat operations is the textbook definition of why our military is in the sorry shape it's become.

Of course, it would be prudent to make sure the DFAC staff was aware the team had just rolled back inside the wire. Sometimes a little explanation can eliminate all sorts of complications.
(2)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
CPT Battalion Communications Officer (S6)
2
2
0
Edited >1 y ago
This isn't a black and white - there are several ways good leaders could figure out this problem - for me, it's simple priorities of work. Limited amount of time to grab chow - grab chow first.

Another leader might have them grab to go boxes (or send one Soldier to grab to go boxes for the entire team). Another leader might have them eat MRE's - not the best for morale, but if they're setting their work schedule around chow time (we've all done it) - the times they're on the road would get predictable - making them easier targets.

One things for sure - the Soldiers should definitely eat (doesn't matter what it is) and the Soldiers should shave. The two actions aren't mutually exclusive (both can be done).
(2)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SSG Signals Acquisition/Exploitation Analyst
2
2
0
Anyone who stresses over appearance in a combat zone isn't working hard enough. I remember the chow hall on FOB Marez kicking out terps and civilians because they weren't wearing soft caps (when most of them weren't given them in the first place). A lot of unit commanders tended to treat Iraq as an NTC rotation.
(2)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SGT Team Leader
2
2
0
They would eat. And I take responsibility for my command that they do so.
(2)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
CPL BamBam Mott
2
2
0
I have seen situations where soldiers who got held up because of some hitch in the mission held them up. Their higher chain of command was at some other OP,and because the base they ended up at had so many high ranking officers they got turned away from chow when they had very little time to restock their combat loads, use a decent bathroom, get that chow and be back out. The squads sergeants eventually got physical with the one sgt stopping their troops from getting some hot food. Those soldiers of my squad at the time we didn't get hot food often. We lived in the mountains in Afgahn. They wouldn't fly us food, there was no roads to my FB. Yet we walked everywhere and lived off of very little. An if my SGT hadn't done that we would not have eaten. We would have carried on, tried to procure some MRE's, but then your looking at humane versus foolish. Heck we were gone long before anyone could stop us and we heard nothing else from it. As infantry and where we were at we didn't carry hygiene kits with us. You were lucky to still have a decent razor.
(2)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
CW3 Network Architect
2
2
0
What would I do? I'd let the Soldiers go eat. If some CSM (or heaven forbid, the actual current SMA) got in my way of letting them do that, I'd collect their ID cards, run into the chow hall myself, get them food, and bring it out to them. If the Sergeant Major balked at THAT, I'd tell him "oh well, I don't take orders from NCOs, go whine to my commander."
(2)
Comment
(0)
SPC Dennis Mullins
SPC Dennis Mullins
>1 y
Be my first problem I ever had, usually our commanders Common Sense kicks in!
(0)
Reply
(0)
Avatar small
Capt Radar Navigator
2
2
0
For me, it's not a question of enforcing regs. It's a matter of right and wrong. These soldiers have obviously been working hard and are probably pretty hungry. Even if they're out of regs, it'd be wrong to deny them food.
(2)
Comment
(0)
SPC Dennis Mullins
SPC Dennis Mullins
>1 y
You think Common Sense would kick in I hoped!
(1)
Reply
(0)
Avatar small
SSG Section Chief
2
2
0
The Army presents many situations where leaders have to make a decision as to whether or not they are going to enforce a reg. Let's say I have a soldier who goes to sick call for severe back pain, the medics don't issue profiles; instead they schedule an appointment with the PA about a week out. Now am I going to make this injured Soldier do PRT when they don't have a profile for a back injury? For the first time in my army career I have a 1SG who does what I have wanted my leadership to do. Give that Soldier leeway until they have a profile in hand. We are not doctors. Do you want to to be responsible for causing that Soldier more injury simply because you want to discourage malingering? Let the doctors determine that. Now feed those troops. Facial hair isn't going to cause them to fall out.
(2)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SFC Operations Sergeant
2
2
0
A standard is only so if everyone follows it. The requirement to shave isn't a standard but is a regulation, and violation in and of itself is not punitive. Also, a commander has the authority to adjust personal appearance requirements based on mission demand and hygiene resources. An example of this would be relaxed grooming standards due to a lack of sanitized water with which to conduct personal hygiene. Resources and field manuals such as field sanitation help guide commander's decisions when it comes to these matters. NCOs derive their authority from commanders and leaders subordinate to the commander carry out their duties within that commander's intent and to meet the appropriate end state. So to answer your question, shaving would not be my first priority, and I would not require personal hygiene prior to chow and mission requirements. Shaving can wait until the mission and such are over. However it is my responsibility to ensure that decision would reflect my commander's policy and sentiment.
(2)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small
SSG Trevor S.
2
2
0
What will probably happen is someone will bicker with the squad leader forcing him/her to miss dinner while the other soldiers slip in and grab to-go plate. Hopefully the squad leader team built their unit enough that they think about him/her and grab the squad leader a plate while they are at it.
(2)
Comment
(0)
Avatar small

Join nearly 2 million former and current members of the US military, just like you.

close