Posted on Aug 14, 2015
TSgt Joshua Copeland
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Thinking about all of our SAPR/SHARP briefing we all have attended they usually focus on getting the woman's consent, if she is drinking she can't consent, etc, etc. as illustrated by this poster.

What are your thoughts on the commentary?
Posted in these groups: E1688309 SHARPImgres LawEquality logo EqualityImages9sh3pvxo Sexual Assault
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Responses: 18
MSgt Electrical Power Production
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Very interesting concept to consider. I would think to actually know for sure would be a blood test. Then maybe you could use it as defense. But I believe in most cases the perpetrators are purposely getting the victim intoxicated to take advantage of.
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TSgt Joshua Copeland
TSgt Joshua Copeland
>1 y
I know I had a DA in Ohio tell me under their state laws, one sip is enough to remove consent. If it goes to court it is a matter of proving who was more drunk.
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Capt Seid Waddell
Capt Seid Waddell
>1 y
MSgt (Join to see), assigning motives to others is a dangerous thing. Drinking too much is a personal choice regardless of gender.
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SGM Erik Marquez
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It looks to me like it's the same thing as any crime reported.. The 1st one to call 911 is the victim, the second the accused.
In this Meme "situation" If Jake called first, Josie is charged.
Right? Well of course not, Im just calling it like I have seen it go down countless times in Domestic violence or assault or road rage even motor vehicle accidents.
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MSgt Curtis Ellis
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Edited >1 y ago
Sad, but true, though it is getting better. The last SHARP class I attended did focus a bit more on male rape and assault by female(s) (for a change), how it could happen and some of the psychological effects. Every time I see something along these lines, it reminds me of the two girls that stripped a little boy of his clothes in public... His cries were worse than one from a spanking...
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SFC Mark Merino
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Edited >1 y ago
The term barracks whore is well known throughout the services for a reason. These creatures are ground zero for many of our poor 1SG's dramas within their respective units. Everyone has a story of disgusting ill repute from their time in uniform. These sleezestaks are excellent at playing the system. They are the first ones to raise the flag if they ever come under scrutiny and are excellent at portraying the vestal virgin during investigations. Many a time I have seen them skate free because they know that previous sexaul history can't be brought into testimony at a court-martial. These vile DNA receptacles not only bring shame upon themselves, but they make it hell for legitimate victims. The first thing someone under investigation says is that "there was consent last night and she she has slept with the entire unit.' Well, thanks for making life hell for everyone trying to get justice from predators. And to these trolls' parents I say 'way to raise a woman with absolutely NO self-esteem'.
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SSG Robert Webster
SSG Robert Webster
>1 y
SFC Mark Merino Last I viewed this thread, I saw the remarks by SSG Colette S., and there were links with the name, what happened to those remarks? And if they were removed, who removed them and why?
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TSgt Joshua Copeland
TSgt Joshua Copeland
>1 y
SSG Robert Webster, it appears she closed her account.
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SSG Robert Webster
SSG Robert Webster
>1 y
TSgt Joshua Copeland - Thank you. But shouldn't the comments made be retained, unless deleted by the individual or by RP management/staff?
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TSgt Joshua Copeland
TSgt Joshua Copeland
>1 y
appearently the way the system works is when the member account is close all their comments, any threads they start and any replies by other user to their comments are all deleted. There were a few of us having rather good discussing under a reply she started and it is now all gone.
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1LT Infantry Officer
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This is why we can't have nice things... This idea that women can't give consent with any alcohol totally absolves them of adult responsibility. If you go out and make choices, you should be held accountable to your choices. This new mindset essentially adds "unless you're a woman" as a caveat to every action and makes it sexist to say otherwise.
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Maj Operations Officer
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all depends who is forcing him or herself into someone else, at that point consent is not in the picture.... just imagine, you go to the bar with your friends and all got drunk, you decide to stop drinking, but your buddies who are also drunk force feed you the alcohol, did you need the consent from your buddies for them to force feed you the liquor? or at that point the only consent that mattered was yours? think about it...
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Maj Operations Officer
Maj (Join to see)
>1 y
MSgt Copeland, the question is about consent, whether woman or man the true remains that if both are drunk consent is out of the picture for the one forcing into the other. and the fact that both are drunk does not exonerates the perpetrator. I recommend you go back and read many of the comments being made. Just picture this, imagine you going out with your "Buddy," who you "trust," you both got drunk, and the next morning you wake up to find that your "buddy" had his way with you and you were to drunk to resist or even remember what happened. Will the fact that you were drunk, relief your "buddy" from the fact that he raped you?
Place your self on the shoes of that woman, she may had been flirting, and somehow miss leaded the perpetrator, perhaps change her mind at the last minute, many made it sound as if she was drunk and misleading she also has responsibility. we all need to know when to walk away and know how to control our instincts, even if we are drunk... Just think about it!
thanks
Alex
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SSG Robert Webster
SSG Robert Webster
>1 y
Maj (Join to see) - With your statements you are turning this around to where the male (man) is at fault no matter the circumstance, what about turning it around where the female (woman) is the aggressor? This is one of the questions that has been raised by a number of the previous comments. I do not know what they teach in SAPR training, but if the training always implies that it is the males fault, then there is something wrong with the training. EO and equal rights should mean equal responsibility for actions no matter who the victim is be it male, female, or other (homosexuality the other beast in the closet). We always seem to hear about the male on female rape, or the male on male rape; but rarely if ever, hear about the inverse - female on male rape or female on female rape.
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TSgt Joshua Copeland
TSgt Joshua Copeland
>1 y
If I am to drunk to remember, how do I know that *I* wasn't the aggressor and that *I* didnt have my way with my "buddy"? Especially if THEY don't remember what happen? Maj (Join to see)
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Maj Operations Officer
Maj (Join to see)
>1 y
SSG Webster, MSgt Copeland,
Forget gender, that is what I am trying to point out, is not about being male of female, is about who forces one self into other human being, even if both are drunk... there have many ways to prove rape, whether, either remember or not, if the next morning you wake up and you were rape, you will know it. immediately get a rape kit performed in the nearest clinic. if the sex was consensual, or you both were drunk, well... there will not be evidence of rape and perhaps neither will remember what happened. the true is that there is no black and white, and every case is different as it needs to be investigated accordingly. My point is that if anyone forces one self on another person, it is wrong, even if both were drunk, adding more things to the mixture may make the situation blurry; but one thing remains clear, and that is the act of one human forcing him/her self into another, which is what is wrong.
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MCPO Roger Collins
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I would like to hear from the female members of RP. We all have our perspectives based on our experiences, male and female (and all in-between). Consent is pretty well given from the male perspective and its proper for the lady of interest to make at least a token effort to say, "No thanks". Perhaps the new military members do things differently from years past. There was little doubt in my mind, if there was consent or not. Anyone with a functioning brain should be able to determine the difference. However, when things become strained later after the adventure, who is to say if consent was given either way?
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TSgt Joshua Copeland
TSgt Joshua Copeland
>1 y
MCPO Roger Collins, unless they are stone cold sober and actually say YES I want to have sex, you are making an assumption of consent. Is it "sexy"? Is it "cool"? Not a chance. But anything less could land you in jail. "She didn't say no" doesn't stand up in court as consent.
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MCPO Roger Collins
MCPO Roger Collins
>1 y
So, when the girl makes an approach on me and I acquiesce, without actually saying yes, can she be brought up on charges? That has been a real issue for me over the past decades. :)
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TSgt Joshua Copeland
TSgt Joshua Copeland
>1 y
If you want to press charges, yep.
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SrA Edward Vong
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I think it goes to case by case. Consent may not be given on either side. Was it forced? Was there violence and bodily injuries involved? There are too many factors other than who reported the situation first.
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SrA Edward Vong
SrA Edward Vong
>1 y
One can also say, double consent is a mood kill. (At the time of.)
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