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I have been in for 11 years and my biggest problem has been maintaining my PFA standards, Much of it is my fault I accept that.
I also believe that it is also the way program is written. I have heard that more regulations may take affect I.E random BCA's and mandatory FEP for waistlines 40" and over. I feel this is the navy's secret ERB process in slimming down the force (no pun intended)
Just curious on how anyone else feels.
I also believe that it is also the way program is written. I have heard that more regulations may take affect I.E random BCA's and mandatory FEP for waistlines 40" and over. I feel this is the navy's secret ERB process in slimming down the force (no pun intended)
Just curious on how anyone else feels.
Posted in these groups: 
ERB
PRT (Army)
ERB PRT (Army)
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 15
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Random BCA heaven forbid you maintain a standard at all times and not just after you get your notice that the PFA is coming
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LT (Join to see)
That's a pretty easy statement for a guy with a pelican neck to make. By the Navy's imprecise methods, I could have a 42 inch waist if I had your 20 inch neck. That's not fitness, it's proportional geometry, nothing more.
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SSgt Gregory Guina
LT (Join to see) While I do agree that the taping method sucks, is inaccurate, and needs to be changed it is stil the standard that we must uphold.
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PO1 (Join to see) I think we were doing good with where the PFA program was. Some of it is out of control, there are times that is needs to be objective. Why are we kicking out Sailors that look fine in uniform, have 2% body fat, are very much obviously in shape, but due to muscle mass and body composition they are overweight and also fail "rope and choke". I do not see the need for "rope and choke" on every Sailor.
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PO2 Michelle Bova
I was discharged bouncing back from PRT past failures. I was at the limit but ended up with Walking Pneumonia right before the PFA. I was in Safety Standown and had a asthma attack. I had to be taken to the hospital via ambulance. They took my mock PFA as my final score and gave me a failure when I should have been waived from the PFA that season. I was only 2% over on body fat but weighed in just one lb under. I failed the swim because that was when I started coming down with Pneumonia. I was discharged 3 months later. However, that wasn't the most upsetting thing to me. I had never in my 11 years been written up on misconduct. Yet they allowed 2 individuals in my command who both had DUI's stay in the Navy. It made me wonder why...shameful!
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PO3 Angel Flores
i fall into the same category, late 95 i was discharged for failing the "rope and choke". although i passed the PRT with flying colors, was a 4.0 sailor, looked great in uniform, never ever failed an actual PRT, just passed the PO2 exam tier 2, they still let me go. i tried getting my local congressman involved and the navy's response was that only PO2 and above would get any help. now how many people want to join the navy and be a submariner, not many, but they let this on go.
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PO1 Dameon Barber
All I am going to say about that is I was grandfathered in on PRT and when it came time for me to retire the tried to kick me out but as you know I am retired now Thank God cause if I left it up to the Navy I would have gave them 20 yrs for nothing all because of these PRT standards this needs to stop we are losing so many good sailors.
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PO1 (Join to see)
I agree I don't understand why you need to be able to X amount of push ups and X amount of sit ups and run a 1.5 miles to be considered in standards......I mean what does that prove any way, when push comes to shove if they are needed to fight a war everyone can shoot a gun and take a bullet or whatever the case maybe.
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I'm all for tighter restraints on physical fitness. I do agree that it should be an actual rate not collateral and they should utilize a more accurate way to conduct BCA's. (I am a CFL) The bodpod is a great way, our command has one and it def keeps people in check. But, coming from the medical (IDC) aspect and having to deal with problems that are generally 90% from being over weight, I have no sympathy and I am 100% honest with my Marines and Sailors. If you are fat I will flat out tell you are, but I will also offer sound advise and help you build a plan to get back into a healthy lifestyle.
Military medicine is the largest budget and costing the tax payers so much money on people who need all types of medication, labs, imaging, and rehab all from being over weight. Why should I have to pay for somebody else who is just to lazy to work out and put down the candy bars, soda, fast food, ect ect. Its called discipline and self control, sh*t how about pride in yourself. How are we suppose to represent the most elite Naval fighting force if we can't fit through a damn hatch in a war ship.
It's always the ones who struggle with the standards who whine and complain, looking for loop holes in the system, always at my door for a LD Chit to get out of PT. I dont care how good you are at your job. If you are not in the standards I can find somebody who is and I am pretty sure the Navy can train them to do that job.
Honor, Courage, and Commitment! We all stood on those footprints and said the Sailor's Creed, how can you serve your country's Navy combat team if your on a Limited Duty board broken, over weight, on 15 different medications? All your doing is costing the Navy money and wasting the Tax Payers dollars, they should be charged with destruction of government property and fraud waste and abuse of the tax payers $.
That is all!
Military medicine is the largest budget and costing the tax payers so much money on people who need all types of medication, labs, imaging, and rehab all from being over weight. Why should I have to pay for somebody else who is just to lazy to work out and put down the candy bars, soda, fast food, ect ect. Its called discipline and self control, sh*t how about pride in yourself. How are we suppose to represent the most elite Naval fighting force if we can't fit through a damn hatch in a war ship.
It's always the ones who struggle with the standards who whine and complain, looking for loop holes in the system, always at my door for a LD Chit to get out of PT. I dont care how good you are at your job. If you are not in the standards I can find somebody who is and I am pretty sure the Navy can train them to do that job.
Honor, Courage, and Commitment! We all stood on those footprints and said the Sailor's Creed, how can you serve your country's Navy combat team if your on a Limited Duty board broken, over weight, on 15 different medications? All your doing is costing the Navy money and wasting the Tax Payers dollars, they should be charged with destruction of government property and fraud waste and abuse of the tax payers $.
That is all!
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Suspended Profile
Agreed
PO2 (Join to see)
I dont know what all the fuss is about. Im 6'0" 262 lbs. Acording to the instruction im "supposed" to be 201. Now lets do a little math. Acording to rope and choke im at 20% but in the body pod mentioned above i was calculated at 16% so just for sake of argument lets say im 18%. So 18% of 260lbs is roundabout 45lbs so even if i went down and lost the 18% id be unhealthy and still "overweight". Now i agree that the rope and choke system could use a overhaul but if your doing what your supposed to or atleast doing your best then there are ways around the "problem" that is the PT. I agree witht the coment above god forbid you have to go run away from McDs every once in a while. You "sailors" are pathetic.
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Does the program need to be tweaked, yes, does it need a massive overhaul no. As a CFL and as a Sailor in general I cannot stand a fat body. There is nothing more embarrassing to me as a proud blue shirt than going out in town and seeing a shipmate with a Navy t-shirt on with man breasts, front AND back. Your physical fitness is a bullet right there on your eval, right in the military bearing bracket. To me it is a matter of Discipline above all else. There are occasions in which the tape is a little off but nothing compared to the amount of beer guts and muffins tops I see when I visit some of these shore duty major commands. As leaders we must set the example, IN EVERYTHING, not just the easy stuff. We must not only set the example, but exemplify the standard. I see the amount of big bodies we have in the Navy as a direct reflection of each of those Sailors individual leadership, it shows me their leadership does not care for them, and if that's the case, send them over to me and my guys, esprit de corps fills our camelbaks and canteens. 1 more mile!!
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PO2 Michelle Bova
I owned up to the fact that I was over weight at one point. I was suffering from major depression after the death of my daughter, then got pregnant again shortly after my child's death. I finally got my butt in gear lost 115 lbs. The reason I was discharged was because my PFA Officer used my mock PFA as my PFA and failed me based off my swim. I was 1 minute over. I didn't fail the weigh in or the pushups/situps. Here's the thing though. At the time I was suffering from pneumonia. I had a massive asthma attack during Safety Standown, in front of the entire command. I had to be sent via ambulance to the hospital. Less then a week later I was signing my page 13 and notice of discharge with the XO and the PFA officer. My CDCMC, 2 SCPO's, 1 CPO and my LPO were on the phone calling the Commodore fighting the decision to discharge me. I heard my SCPO tell the Commodore, that he didnt care if I weighed 400lbs I was the best female sailor in the command. That meant a lot. I swallowed my pride, took the discharge because the burdon fell on me. No one else. However, my beef with my discharge was not because of a PFA failure. It was because I was being discharged while 2 sailors in my command with DUI offenses were allowed to stay in. That is the problem..so my little hiccup on my "military bearing" of a PFA failure was more detrimental to the Navy then 2 sailors who could have killed someone driving drunk home from a bar.
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PO3 (Join to see)
I cannot even begin to express how this is the only part of the Navy that I cannot stand. I can do my PRT where I have always struggled with the BCA. It is because I how I built amd I cannot change that. This is one huge part the lacks the "integrity" that the Navy prides itself everywhere else. I have seen the tape drawn tighter for some and let loose for others. Physical standards are and should be critical but they need to be determined accurately. I have seen 4.0 Sailors get adsep ' d as a result of a couple inches, yet 2.0 Sailors that give the bare minimum and are slim amd skinny get retained. Sailors that go above and beyond get let go while Sailors that have been to MAST....busted down...XOI....DRB.....get retainen. If one can do the push-ups, sit-ups, amd the cardio....and you look clean cut and professional in uniform...that is all that should matter.
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SCPO (Join to see)
Again, every aspect, every standard. I don't understand why that is so difficult, work hard and with pride, study, stay fit and within BCA standards, and most of all, support your Shipmates. I am making no comparisons or differentials on who is retained and who is let go and for what, this is about personal responsibility. If you feel someone is being unfairly taped, make a complaint, request mast. I can go on for days about how some of my peers don't do what I do yet are on my same ladder rung, but for what? My job is to make sure I am squared away and to ensure I have a positive impact on my Sailors.
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I say do away with the BCA's. The shape of one's body doesn't indicate fitness. However, the state of fitness in the Navy is pathetic. So the flip side of this is I say have stricter PFT standards. That's just my two cents.
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PO2 (Join to see)
I agree! I am a sailor who struggles every cycle to make weight and tape but can get an outstanding on every PRT.
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If all these rumors coming out of the CFL conference are true, it's about to get really nasty here in Uncle Sam's sea service. When I heard about it, I also thought that its just another way to manage the numbers. They did away with PTS, gotta have something to take up its place.
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CPO (Join to see)
So true, but they didn't do away completely with PTS they just renamed it to Cway, another way to manage numbers
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Also, maybe if PT in the Navy was taken more seriously at commands and the mess decks served actual healthy food and not deep friend everything people would be more inclined to maintain their health. But when you put vending machines all over the ship along with serving nothing but deep fried food in the galley, and making command PT turn into 1 hour of arm circles, it doesn't really galvanize the crew into doing anything.
I can't count how many times that I felt like I'd wasted time at command PT or departmental PT and just went to the gym to workout because we literally spent an hour navel-gazing. But I see when the chief's mess and the first classes do CPO 360 they actually WORK OUT.
Notice most people lose the most weight on deployment, though. It's when we come back to shore that we gain weight.
I can't count how many times that I felt like I'd wasted time at command PT or departmental PT and just went to the gym to workout because we literally spent an hour navel-gazing. But I see when the chief's mess and the first classes do CPO 360 they actually WORK OUT.
Notice most people lose the most weight on deployment, though. It's when we come back to shore that we gain weight.
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I recently got discharged for a BCA failure but I passed every mock PRT I ever took with an outstanding. One's body weight and shape does not determine one's level of physical fitness. The PFA as it stands is CAKE, but the BCA is what gets most people, and I'm saying this because while I was discharged for being literally 1% over, I've seen people TWICE my size getting waivers under the table despite not only failing the BCA but the mock PRTs during FEP. I was getting roped and choked all throughout my career and always borderline (sorry can't help that I'm built this way), but my PRT scores were always solid outstanding. The Navy has even admitted that the BCA measuring is inherently flawed. CFLs are picked based on their PRT scores and nothing more; none of them are actually really qualified to give nutrition advice (because I can't count how many times I was sent to a nutritionist despite my diet already being stringent).
CFL should be an actual RATE and not a collateral duty because it's more than just being able to get an outstanding PFA score. It should also incorporate training as a nutritionist and dietician because fitness is 80% diet and 20% exercise.
It's a flawed system, and trotting out the "well that's just how it is and you need to uphold that" excuse and "it's your own fault" blame game doesn't effect any type of upward mobility or change in the service. It just maintains the current status quo. Defending the current system just because it affects you positively doesn't negate the fact that droves of good Sailors with so much potential to excel and lead the Navy in the future are having their careers cut short because of something as flawed and trivial as a BCA.
CFL should be an actual RATE and not a collateral duty because it's more than just being able to get an outstanding PFA score. It should also incorporate training as a nutritionist and dietician because fitness is 80% diet and 20% exercise.
It's a flawed system, and trotting out the "well that's just how it is and you need to uphold that" excuse and "it's your own fault" blame game doesn't effect any type of upward mobility or change in the service. It just maintains the current status quo. Defending the current system just because it affects you positively doesn't negate the fact that droves of good Sailors with so much potential to excel and lead the Navy in the future are having their careers cut short because of something as flawed and trivial as a BCA.
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IMHO, I would say that the PFA standards are either just right or even too lax. Being at least healthy is a fundamental part of being in the military. If you arent healthy, they you most likely will be sick more often or develop more debilitating diseases. Boot camp just said that recruits have to take a PRT and run it in 16 min or so. To me that is way to lax. Now as long as the Random BCAs and Mandatory FEP for 40"+ wastes doesnt automatically trigger a failure, then I am fine with those. I have always gotten roped and weighed between 190-210. This last PRT i scored and excellent low overall with a run time of 9:44. You can have a few extra pounds on you and still do well in the PRT portion. As for the PFA, those guidelines are there to make sure you check yourself but to also make sure you are maintaining a healthy lifestyle and do not bring visual discredit on the military (like it or not that is a reason that they do this). I remember watching the "Fat LTs" get phased out when they added for stringent standards. Bottom line, if you work hard and want it bad enough, you will succeed in the PFA.
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I agree physical fitness is a key role in maintaining efficiency, but I do not think a sailor should be punished and not allowed to run his/her physical portion because they're over by a certain percantage of bodyfat, also seen bigger waist and even bigger neck get away with alot. I'm not saying I'm the best but I have seen people who could not fit thru scuttles not even get taped. Also scales need to be actually calibrated before an actual weigh in so it doesn't show false numbers, scale was old and was close to 10 pounds off.
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