Posted on Jan 15, 2014
SFC Ricardo Ruiz
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<h1 style="margin-bottom: 15px; margin-left: 10px; font-size: 32px; color: rgb(51, 51, 51); line-height: 1.2; font-family: Georgia, Times, serif; position: relative;">'Lone Survivor' is realistic about this: We owe these heroes a debt</h1>
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GySgt (Other / Not listed)
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I would say it's pretty accurate.  As a communicator, I really focused on the terminology and how they were passing traffic.  The comm problems is a reality.  One thing that bugged me was the continuous calling of the Marine Staff Sergeant, a Sergeant, that is not militarily incorrect.  For the most part, I think they did a damn good job representing the men of Operation Red Wings.
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SFC Special Forces Assistant Operations & Intelligence Sergeant
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It's a very easy situation, and although very unfortunate, it was handled incorrectly.
There was no need to kill the people who stumbled upon the team, compromising the mission. You simply zip tie them and attempt to make Comms. If you are unable to make comms, you continue moving to higher ground maintaining full control of the detainees.
When Comms are established, you coordinate for an exfil location and maintain custody of the detainees. Once the exfil platform has arrived, and every team member is aboard and ready to exfil, you cut the detainees loose, and take off RTB.

If you are compromised the mission is over. Comms with higher is a must, and an extraction point must be designated. Maintain control of detainees until clean and clear.
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SGT James Elphick
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I know when we were in Afghanistan and conducting OP/Ambush missions the SOP for a soft compromise was to call for exfil and exit the area. I was on a mission in which we were "discovered by goat herder" but when we spoke to him he indicated he wanted to show us a weapons cache. We called higher up, assessed the situation, and took the risk. It turned out that it paid off because he led us to the rocket-launch site we had been trying to find for several weeks. So based on the book/movie "Lone Survivor" and my personal experience I say if you are compromised you exfil and leave the area. Often times a secondary team is in the area or you can reinsert later.
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SFC William Swartz Jr
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Tough choice to have to make, however as an NCO in charge of a platoon during OIF, I would have erred on the side of my mission and the safety of my Soldiers and NOTHING would compromise either of those, sorry for the goat herder but at the least they would have been bound and gagged until the mission was completed. Mission and Safety to me trumps even the RoE in certain situations like that, but that is my opinion.
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SFC Michael Hasbun
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Edited 12 y ago
<p>Personally, I think they made the wrong call... How many more people died as a result of that decision that wouldn't have otherwise? </p><p>&nbsp;</p><p>I know it's a popular philosophical discussion, "if you could ensure happiness, safety, and prosperity&nbsp;for all of humanity at the expense of one life, is it justified?". Personally, my answer has always been "heck yeah" but I supose I'm a bit less "hippie-tastic" than most...</p>
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SPC Squad Member
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12 y
Hindsight is always 20/20 SSG. I'm not saying your wrong but I don't think that can be used as a valid arguing point because I don't think anyone could have known for certain that the QRF would have been killed as well.&nbsp;
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SFC Michael Hasbun
SFC Michael Hasbun
12 y
Understood. I'm just saying that if the possibility even exists that letting them go could cost even one life, than the smart money was on just killing them. The possibility was discussed during their debate. To me, the debate should have ended then...
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MSgt Electrical Power Production
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>1 y
But killing them would have condemned them back home once the bleeding heart do gooders caught wind of it. Then they would have been brought up on murder charges by the wacko left. And you know that's what would happen.
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Edited 12 y ago
Cadet CPT L.

Why not sedate with drugs that will render unconsciousness for a reliable period of time and disrupt consolidation of short term memory into long term memory so that there is nothing to report in the mind of the observer on his / her emergence from the anesthetic effects?

Perhaps a subcutaneous implant delivering a shaped dose of some commonly used  battlefield anesthetics like a high dose cocktail of Ketamine and Versed over a period of hours to days?

One might add additional clinically safe memory consolidation disruptors (Pharmacological Inhibitors of Protein Synthesis / HDAC / GABA / NMDA Systems) to enhance desired effect.

Such a medical device may also be potentially helpful in ameliorating PTSD effects by protecting our own troops from remembering and reexperiencing  the disruptive effects of witnessing some of the most severe battlefield or first responder psychological trauma.

This sounds like a project DARPA could contract out to rapidly develop and evaluate as a nonlethal weapon / medical device for field use. Rohypnol may be a usedul field expedient.

Warmest Regards, Sandy
 

Disclosure: I have not seen Lone Survivor, but I have heard positive reviews of the film.

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SGT Welsh. 

That's why you have DARPA ( Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency ) contract for design, testing, and field evaluation of a device to be injected under the skin using a big syringe.  The device is a silastic tube (plastic tube) sealed at each end, containing drugs, and releasing those drugs over the course of hours to days. The idea is a lot like the silastic tube that is routinely implanted for birth control and keeps working for many months to a year.


The battlefield amnesia drug implant keeps your patient reliably asleep as long as needed. More to the point, even if they awaken they have no memory of what they have seen or heard for an hour or far longer (depending on drug cocktail used) before they were put to sleep. 



DARPA could design a series of tubes for different durations of sleep and durations of amnesia prior to sleep. Or they could make one for use all of the time.



Warmest Regards, Sandy


p.s. You can also tie them to a tree as in your other reply; but, even if discovered by enemy they have seen, heard, and know nothing (even more so than the immorable SGT Schultz in Hogans Heros).
SPC Tom DeSmet
SPC Tom DeSmet
>1 y
I am by no means anything close to informed enough to have an opinion. With your education and background, say the kid has asthma or compromised liver? Would it be safe for all occasions, or as for the kid considered a much better option than a bullet? I would be more angry than a hornet if someone did this to my kid.
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SSG General Services Technician And State Vehicle Inspector
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I read the book, which was fantastic, and saw the movie last weekend. While the movie isn't as great as the book, it stands by itself as an honor to the Service-members who lost their lives that day. I have to agree with the knife scene but the best scenes were when they went down the mountain. Won't say anything else for those who haven't seen it. I saw part of a "shooting-of" clip on HBO the other day on how they did the filming to include the mountain scenes.
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SFC Ricardo Ruiz
SFC Ricardo Ruiz
12 y
Thanks colleagues for the responses. The one fact that hot me hard was the living qtrs EPIC. IT WAS A TENT with rooms just like at the sand box. And the check points called after beer. In 2006 we use to name them after the characters of LOST the series.
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Cpl Ray Fernandez
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You have to go back to the source of the movie and verify that for accuracy. I have yet to see the movie, but the book itself has received some criticism for it's accuracy compared to what actually happened during Operation Red Wings. There are many other books that don't take the same personal account of the events that give a truer view of what actually happened like Victory Point by Ed Darack, and Operation Red Wings by Peter Nealen. So in any good story there is a bit of playing with the truth not that it takes away any from the actual sacrifice and valor of the men involved, but many times the truth is more impressive than any changes made to "improve" the story for film. I plan on watching the film, but I also am going in knowing that a lot of the events were changed from the book, created for the movie, or differ from the official accounts of the events.
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SFC Executive Commo Team
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12 y

Yeah you have to take into consideration the "Hollywood" factor

You'll enjoy the movie.

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Cpl Ray Fernandez
Cpl Ray Fernandez
12 y
I understand SFC, I just know to not take any movie's account of events at face value.

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MAJ Norm Michaels
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It was a good idea at the time. That used to be my favorite phrase. Ten minutes later, my good idea might change, but at the time that I had to make a decision, it was a good idea.
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SPC Frank Novosel
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So instead of letting them go or shooting them just take them with you. The phone on them was enough reason to detain them
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