Posted on Sep 24, 2020
My chain of command just announced that they're going to inspect on and off-post housing. What are they allow to inspect?
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So my question is can they order me open up my kid's room if my son and daughter are in their rooms, or if my dogs are in one of the rooms behind a closed door because of not being friendly to strangers can they order me to open. I apologize for such a naive question, I just have never experienced this before. Is there anything I can reference about off post house inspection by the chain of command.
Posted 5 y ago
Responses: 197
My First Question is does the Government own or lease these off post housing ?
if the answer is yes, then the answer to your Question is yes, your command can enter and inspect your house, with a proper notice.
if the Answer is no,
then the Command has no Authority to enter you home, without your Permission.
so I would do Few things,
first for your Dog Safety, make sure you have the proper size Dog Crate, for your Dog.
Especially if your Dog is not Currently People Friendly.
Secondly I would get The Dog Trained, I would make sure My dog Listen to my commands , for His or Her Safety .
If you cannot teach the Dog to become People Friendly, I Recommend you Hire a Dog Trainer to teach your dog to become people Friendly, this will save your Dog life.
If you do not do these things, and your Dog does not become people friendly, it only a matter of time before the Dog will hurt someone or worse a Child, then you will be court ordered by a judge to have the family dog killed or the court order kind words, (put down for public safety.)
Your House Should Always be Clean , Clutter is ok, you have a family living there, but it should be clean, if the Command is just ensuring that the person you are renting from is not a slum lord.
Your Command is not doing a housing inspection on you per say, they are making sure your landlord is not a SLUM LORD, that your Land Lord Is nit just taking your money, and Forcing you to live in Sub standard Housing, taking your hard earn cash and not making any repairs to the home, ie: not fixing the roof, or hot water heater, central AIR & Heat, and so on.
your command is not doing a Housing inspection on you , so you should have nothing to fear, unless you are the ones destroying the home, allowing your Dog to piss and shit all over the House and not clean it up, living in complete filth . then they will say something to you and your wife.
if the answer is yes, then the answer to your Question is yes, your command can enter and inspect your house, with a proper notice.
if the Answer is no,
then the Command has no Authority to enter you home, without your Permission.
so I would do Few things,
first for your Dog Safety, make sure you have the proper size Dog Crate, for your Dog.
Especially if your Dog is not Currently People Friendly.
Secondly I would get The Dog Trained, I would make sure My dog Listen to my commands , for His or Her Safety .
If you cannot teach the Dog to become People Friendly, I Recommend you Hire a Dog Trainer to teach your dog to become people Friendly, this will save your Dog life.
If you do not do these things, and your Dog does not become people friendly, it only a matter of time before the Dog will hurt someone or worse a Child, then you will be court ordered by a judge to have the family dog killed or the court order kind words, (put down for public safety.)
Your House Should Always be Clean , Clutter is ok, you have a family living there, but it should be clean, if the Command is just ensuring that the person you are renting from is not a slum lord.
Your Command is not doing a housing inspection on you per say, they are making sure your landlord is not a SLUM LORD, that your Land Lord Is nit just taking your money, and Forcing you to live in Sub standard Housing, taking your hard earn cash and not making any repairs to the home, ie: not fixing the roof, or hot water heater, central AIR & Heat, and so on.
your command is not doing a Housing inspection on you , so you should have nothing to fear, unless you are the ones destroying the home, allowing your Dog to piss and shit all over the House and not clean it up, living in complete filth . then they will say something to you and your wife.
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We had to do this many years ago at Fort Lewis. Mostly it was for off-post housing to check the maintenance and living conditions of younger soldiers. As has been pointed out, it was announced and the chain of command explained why this was being done and told soldiers they did have the right to refuse entrance to their housing. Most let the NCOs in. Mine didn't have an issue with it, as I already stopped by to talk to my soldiers, drop them off after work, pick them up for weekend details, etc. I have always known where my soldiers lived, on-post, off-post, and in the barracks. Call me old school, but that was part of the leader relationship I formed with my soldiers and their families.
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WHAT!!! Another incompetent COMMANDER. It appears when Officers reach a certain rank, their BRAINS disappear. I believe this one has reached his "Peter Principle". The Peter Principle that members of a hierarchy are promoted until they reach the level at which they are no longer competent.
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When I was in the military (a few million years ago), some base housing is off-base (or off-post). That may be the housing that they are referring to. Since they have informed you, that qualifies as the "landlord" giving you notice to inspect, which is the law in most states.
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Suspended Profile
Easy answer. Nothing unless you let them. Otherwise they need a search warrant. Open and shut matter.
My last unit floated that idea numerous times. And I told them straight out without a warrant they are not going in my house.
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If you own that home off post they can't come past the front door without your permission.
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While I see this question is a bit old, it popped up in my notifications and after skimming a number of comments, I’d like to add another perspective that I’m disappointed to not be seeing.
First question on these things should be to ask what the intent/purpose is. It may very well have been misinterpreted or misconstrued somewhere along the chain.
Sometimes these very “inspections” are sincerely intended as leader engagement, to simply take a quick glance at the general conditions Soldiers (and Families) are living in but also to ensure leaders/units actually know WHERE a Soldier lives. Essentially a check and confirmation of the validity of alert rosters. Emergency situations aren’t the time to discover that a unit isn’t aware a Soldier moved addresses 8 months ago and no one knew or updated records. Likewise, homes don’t need to be “inspected” to set off red flags of potential concerns. A quick stop, knock on the door, introduction to a spouse, and so on can go a long way in providing a cursory glance of the conditions, confirming an individual’s address, and simply checking in to ensure the family has a touch point with the unit.
Don’t get me wrong. I’m not naive and well aware that too often these are in fact attempts by overzealous leaders to push boundaries. But not always.
First question on these things should be to ask what the intent/purpose is. It may very well have been misinterpreted or misconstrued somewhere along the chain.
Sometimes these very “inspections” are sincerely intended as leader engagement, to simply take a quick glance at the general conditions Soldiers (and Families) are living in but also to ensure leaders/units actually know WHERE a Soldier lives. Essentially a check and confirmation of the validity of alert rosters. Emergency situations aren’t the time to discover that a unit isn’t aware a Soldier moved addresses 8 months ago and no one knew or updated records. Likewise, homes don’t need to be “inspected” to set off red flags of potential concerns. A quick stop, knock on the door, introduction to a spouse, and so on can go a long way in providing a cursory glance of the conditions, confirming an individual’s address, and simply checking in to ensure the family has a touch point with the unit.
Don’t get me wrong. I’m not naive and well aware that too often these are in fact attempts by overzealous leaders to push boundaries. But not always.
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Please check out your 4th Amendment rights, unless you give consent, or signed a prior consent contract you are not obligated to a search/inspection by authorities. If you have shown reasonable suspicious activity, the story would be different.
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I'm curious to know if this is a new post-wide policy or just a unit policy. Generally, policy changes like this are rooted in an incident that results in a preventative policy. When I was a Company Commander I had a situation where a young private, who was livibg in the barracks, went home on leave and came back with a young bride. He coukdn't bring her to the barracks so they "crashed" at a buddy's trailor with two other soldiers living there. Not a good situation and it was brought to my attention thru his chain of command who checked-up on his living situation since he had not received permission to live off post. This was a potential disaster that was avoided but I wonder what prompted the new policy with your command?
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SSG Dennis Mendoza
Well ma'am it all started cause of the Vanessa Gillen situation, and now 3 Corps has initiated people first for leaders to do home visits of course is the individuals choice to invite the leadership into our homes. My leadership has done two visits so far the first one I was very comfortable with my PSG and PL but this last one they only met me in front of the house.
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MAJ Anne McGee
SSG Dennis Mendoza Thank you for the explanation. It sounds well intemtioned and as long as ut's a scheduled vist, not too invasive. Ensuring the health and welfare of soldiers and their families is a top priority for the Command and as long as it's done respectfully it will work as intended. Do you have an issue with the visits? How often do they visit?
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SSG Dennis Mendoza
MAJ Anne McGee it's when ever they schedule a foundation day but it's been close to 6 months apart
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Invite the inspection if you can use it to your advantage to put pressure on landlord to make improvements. If you don't want an inspection (for whatever reason) ask for a copy of the rules, regulations, authority and standards to be met for inspections of non-military properties and facilities. Do they also want to inspect your POV?
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These inspections are for you but they aren't (and cannot be) mandatory if you are living off base. The reason they are conducting these inspections is because there has been a problem with members of our military being placed in substandard housing for unreasonable prices. Basically, the landlords and property owners know what BAH is and are charging up to full BAH even when that is not fair market value for property in question. This inspection is to assess the living spaces of services members to make sure they aren't being gouged, that maintenance is being conducted in accordance with leases, etc. If you don't want the inspection, just tell them that you are fine and don't want it.
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If you are living off-post, who you allow into your residence is entirely up to you and your significant other.
The Army tried pushing this back in the 90s and was met with same resistance. Why? If I buy a home off post it is personal property and as such, I the owner can allow who I want on to the property and prohibit who I wish not to be on my property.
If you are renting, make sure it meets or exceeds post housing office standards for dwelling.
With all that said, if your command presses you report them to the I.G. office and seek legal consel from JAG.
The Army tried pushing this back in the 90s and was met with same resistance. Why? If I buy a home off post it is personal property and as such, I the owner can allow who I want on to the property and prohibit who I wish not to be on my property.
If you are renting, make sure it meets or exceeds post housing office standards for dwelling.
With all that said, if your command presses you report them to the I.G. office and seek legal consel from JAG.
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I’ve been on commander directed health and welfare inspections with local CPS on base with SFOI and AFOSI, but never off base housing
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Be polite and respectful. When they ask or tell you when they are coming to your residence, just say, "No thank you. I will be happy to answer questions you may have about my home, landlord, etc. But you are not welcome at my residence." There may be some folks unhappy with your decision, and some may even lie to you and say you have to let them on your property and in your home. Stand firm, be respectful, and say NO. And be prepared to take it up the chain of command if someone decides to make life difficult for you for standing up for your rights. Some people can be really petty. If need be, take a trip over to JAG. Ask to see the rules that govern off-base quarters inspections. They should quickly confirm what you can do in this situation. If they had showed up at my house, they would have experienced my wife. And that would have been a bad thing for them. Good luck.
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Chains of Commands have no purview into base housing. If they have concerns with members in housing, they can notify the housing office &/or base security, but there has to be reason, not just "because we wanna inspect our troops' houses."
They can pack sand with that BS.
They can pack sand with that BS.
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Not gonna happen. 4th Amendment. There must be probable cause... Even then a verbal search and seizure warrant must be given reduced to writing within 48 hours. Health and welfare checks off post require law enforcement presence on post require the same if civilians are involved. Most housing is ran by civilian companies now so they must give consent on post, off post consent must be given same as with a warrant. A warrant is given to specify who or what is to be investigated.
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When I had on post housing just like in the barracks inspection of on post housing was allowed. Off post housing is only authorized with an actual ordered health and welfare check usually stemming from something such as a suicide attempt, drug use, domestic violence anything along those lines otherwise off post housing requires the same as non military citizen you must have a search and seizure warrant and local law enforcement must be present to issue this. A health and welfare check is exactly that to check the health and welfare of the soldier and their family. In both on and off post housing a law enforcement officer must be present and an order to search must be presented. Let me give you a specific on this every soldier has a right to privacy even for a Urinalysis, the commander acting in his or her capacity must make an official order to process this test. Same goes for a home check an order must be made and shown or read before entry otherwise it is unlawful search and seizure. CPS must follow this same procedure they must have an order for investigation and have a law enforcement official with them. They cannot just start taking pictures, barge into your home, and take off with your children. Same applies here. There are civilians involved and they must be given proper verification of a search and seizure warrant on or off post be it from a commanding officer or a judge.
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Opening your home is voluntary. They have full rights on base and on ships but your home is your private property. I would have nothing to hide but would refuse entry on constitutional principles.
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