Posted on Feb 8, 2018
My Platoon Sgt has ordered us to get name, rank, and a reflective E for eco troop sewn on ruck and FLC at our own expense. Can he force this?
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I understand accountability of ocie gear is important. I have also heard the 'its covered by your clothing allowance argument'. Does the clothing allowance cover alterations to gear issued at CIF? My main question is can he, as a platoon level leader, discipline me if I don't spend my own money to alter my gear. Especially when the other platoons in my troop, or squadron, are being asked to do this.
Also, and references to regulations would be appreciated.
Also, and references to regulations would be appreciated.
Edited 8 y ago
Posted 8 y ago
Responses: 17
PFC (Join to see) , you are marching into a fight you will not win. The order given by your platoon sergeant is not illegal, immoral nor unethical. Therefore, yes he can discipline you for failing to follow the lawful orders of a Noncommissioned Officer. While my answer is short and sweet, SSG(P) Lauren Manuel answered your question best.
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If you itemize, you can write off 'uncompensated, job related expenses' on your taxes. This would count... as would any uniform purchases/ costs of alterations in excess of the clothing allowance, field gear paid for out of pocket-- knives, flashlights, etc.-- assuming the primary purpose of the purchase was for your job.
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1. It is a legal order. 2. It will run you around $10. 3. It is a sound order- have you ever been told to drop rucks, throw them on the truck, etc.., which leaves your ruck with your gear outside your management? Then just how the hell are you suppose to find YOUR equipment once you link back up with it out of the 40-120, etc other rucks?? Especially if they tell you 10 min to find it ruck and be ready to move again? Damn son, in the 82nd Rangers, Corps- all rucks were marked with our Names and some ort of reflective designation.
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As a PFC if my PSG told me to go do something, without question I would go do it. You don't need a regulation to tell you to do it. Your PSG telling you to do it, should be good enough. If its not, then take a good look in the mirror and start thinking about what you want to do when you ETS.
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First of all if your PLT SGT gave you an order follow it because he is trying to ensure your ruck is marked and accounted for. Second if your whole platoon has these marking on their item you will be the only without it and you don't want to lost more money by disobey an order from a Senior NCO. My suggestion if you can't afford let your first line know so they can help but if you have the money pay it because you will cause more problems for yourself in the long run.
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This is a subject that appears frequently here on RP. If an order isn't unethical, immoral or illegal then it's a valid order. This must be some new phenomenon where folks don't spend money on things related to their profession. As a squad leader when I wanted everyone to have their name embroidered on their helmet band because people s hand writing sucked, and the ink wore off, I bought helmet bands at the hock shop and paid for the guys first set. Same as 1SG only the Commander chipped in. Replacements were on them.
Personally, as a troop I had my name sewn on my rucksack, I used an old name tape from an unserviceable uniform so the cost was minimal. As an Engineer it was common for us to sew the reflective E on the backs of our helmet covers and field PCs depending on the unit FSOP. Again the cost was minimal. It also paid for itself when my ruck fell off the truck and I got it back (not many St.Cyr's around) Easily cheaper than a couple beers or energy drinks.
There are many instances in life that are simply not covered by the "reg". Having your gear labelled is one of those things that not only makes sense but in the big scheme of things the cost of having ones shit clearly identified is nominal compared to the cost of having ones shit lost and not returned.
Personally, as a troop I had my name sewn on my rucksack, I used an old name tape from an unserviceable uniform so the cost was minimal. As an Engineer it was common for us to sew the reflective E on the backs of our helmet covers and field PCs depending on the unit FSOP. Again the cost was minimal. It also paid for itself when my ruck fell off the truck and I got it back (not many St.Cyr's around) Easily cheaper than a couple beers or energy drinks.
There are many instances in life that are simply not covered by the "reg". Having your gear labelled is one of those things that not only makes sense but in the big scheme of things the cost of having ones shit clearly identified is nominal compared to the cost of having ones shit lost and not returned.
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Let me ask you this: As a Soldier who was given an order that was not illegal, unethical, or immoral, why are you questioning it?
The Army provides clothing allowance for reasons such as this. Units do this all the time it is normal and as a Soldier who signed for the gear you should WANT to do it to maintain accountability. All too often I see Soldiers blowing their clothing allowance and then come back a month later upset because they have to buy gear.
The Army provides clothing allowance for reasons such as this. Units do this all the time it is normal and as a Soldier who signed for the gear you should WANT to do it to maintain accountability. All too often I see Soldiers blowing their clothing allowance and then come back a month later upset because they have to buy gear.
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First off, he can't force you to do anything. You choose to do it or not. However, you must live with the consequences of your choice. You can choose to do it and accept the consequences of losing the money. Or option B, you can choose to not do it and accept all of the consequences that come with it (UCMJ, perceived as dirt bag, not a team player, not worthy of a waiver for E-4 ETC).
Many years ago, I was told this very same thing. I thought then as I still do that it is total BS to make a Soldier pay out of pocket for something the unit requires. However, it is almost always a bad idea to rock the boat when you are sitting in it. The path of least resistance is to simply do it no matter how much BS it is. Just remember things like this when you are getting close to your reenlistment window. Think about things like this when you make your decision to reup or get out. Unofficial expenses tend to increase the higher up in rank you go. Good thing is if you itemize your taxes, you can claim it as a deduction. So there is that at least.
Many years ago, I was told this very same thing. I thought then as I still do that it is total BS to make a Soldier pay out of pocket for something the unit requires. However, it is almost always a bad idea to rock the boat when you are sitting in it. The path of least resistance is to simply do it no matter how much BS it is. Just remember things like this when you are getting close to your reenlistment window. Think about things like this when you make your decision to reup or get out. Unofficial expenses tend to increase the higher up in rank you go. Good thing is if you itemize your taxes, you can claim it as a deduction. So there is that at least.
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I would say as an officer a long time ago since the order came from psg to modify official uniform or equipment the order was out of line and not lawful. If the company commander or higher I would say do it to save yourself possible problems. I don’t think a PSG has authority to order a SM to arbitrarily modify uniform or equipment.
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