Posted on Jan 14, 2015
On the spot corrections in public; when is it appropriate?
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This weekend me and my GF decided to get out and go to the movies not near any military base once so ever (maybe a Reserve or NG training facility could be near by). So I'm glancing around notice a uniform on a young lady and her hair down with a PT cap on inside of the mall. I didn't loose my mind at first because it could be anyone just wearing the uniform these days. As I get closer to her I notice she has on SPC rank. I told my GF that I have to say something to her and of course she didn't understand. When I approached the SPC and her civilian male acquaintance, I asked her was she in the Army and she quickly replied "yes". So I asked her did she know she was in complete violation of Army Regs she says "yes". The female rolled her eyes at me and I could tell she was going to have
a attitude with me so I quickly removed myself from the situation. So at what point do we as leaders make a on the spot correction in public or remove ourselves from the situation? I felt at the time as a NCO I should have done more to make her fix herself, but on the other hand I didn't want to make a scene at the mall and in public. SPC Ware I definitely will remember you forever.
a attitude with me so I quickly removed myself from the situation. So at what point do we as leaders make a on the spot correction in public or remove ourselves from the situation? I felt at the time as a NCO I should have done more to make her fix herself, but on the other hand I didn't want to make a scene at the mall and in public. SPC Ware I definitely will remember you forever.
Regulation
Mentorship
Leadership
Professionalism
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 713
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I have had something similar happen. Two PV2s in Rue 21 store, both in uniform, wearing their PC inside, both walking around the store with earbuds in listening to their music. I approached them both, asked if they were stationed here (Rucker), they both said "Yes". I showed them my ID. As soon as they saw the rank, and the look on my face, they fixed themselves with no further issue.
You can't just walk away from the situation. Letting substandard behavior go by, unchecked, means you just lowered the standard. You can't be afraid of what "could happen". Be concerned with what "is" happening. And fix it!
You can't just walk away from the situation. Letting substandard behavior go by, unchecked, means you just lowered the standard. You can't be afraid of what "could happen". Be concerned with what "is" happening. And fix it!
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SFC Mark Gagnon
next time, play it off like you think you know her, tell her your unit and ask her what hers is. After you get that information, take pics, and call the unit, and ask the 1SG for his cell # so you can send him a photo he might be interested in. Send him the photo, and a paragraph about the incident, and let him handle it. There is more than one way to skin the cat.
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SSG (Join to see)
Sounds like AIT in Enterprise....i've ran into many issues with soldiers during my time there. Sad part is while at the NCOA, you are powerless and not allowed to speak to the IET soldiers. No one wanted to risk that 1059.
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SPC (Join to see)
Absolutely, the moment that a standard was "let go" out of fear of catching a charge from a shitbag, is the moment that all discipline go out the window.
I hate being an asshole, but standards must be maintained. So sometimes I have to be an asshole. Screw what PVTs whine about, they aren't paid to be little bitchy asshats. They are paid to do as they are told, when they are told. And the be at the right place at the right time.
This SPC is clearly the PVT that slipped through the cracks of the bag of shits.
When in doubt, sir it out. Right? For all she could have known, you could have been A LTC or a WO. But no, she just rates to roll her eyes at whomever she chooses. All the while wearing her uniform however she pleases, wherever she pleases. And the PVTs I am around wonder why I hate them..... They are the real asshole.
I hate being an asshole, but standards must be maintained. So sometimes I have to be an asshole. Screw what PVTs whine about, they aren't paid to be little bitchy asshats. They are paid to do as they are told, when they are told. And the be at the right place at the right time.
This SPC is clearly the PVT that slipped through the cracks of the bag of shits.
When in doubt, sir it out. Right? For all she could have known, you could have been A LTC or a WO. But no, she just rates to roll her eyes at whomever she chooses. All the while wearing her uniform however she pleases, wherever she pleases. And the PVTs I am around wonder why I hate them..... They are the real asshole.
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SFC (Join to see)
Anyone can make a correction, but it takes skill y to do it in such a manor as to get the proper end result. Corrections should be done out the ear shot of others. Soon as she rolled her eyes at me I would be asking what unit they were in. Obviously the least would be to get her name and rank. As someone said previously visiting her PLTSGT, and or 1SGT, Sure they will "FIRE FOR EFFECT"
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PO2 Wayne Neva
MAJ Susan Grimm - Yes, well stated. To reprimand in private (ie, whisper in the ear) saves dignity all around. I'm sure the military appreciates low key encounters.
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CW2 Jo Alistair
MAJ Susan Grimm - I am fine with that. The old hard nosed military was far more professional than this new kinder more gentle military.
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SSG (Join to see) I commend you for your restraint. Civilians don't need to see us as ferocious rabid animals attacking and ripping apart smaller game. A SPC rolling her eyes at a SSG after admitting that she KNEW that she was in the wrong. Unbelieveable. In this touchy feely world with cameras roling 24/7, we have to be careful of how we are perceived, but as NCO's we have a job to do. I would politely ask to talk with he out of ear shot and I would whisper that if she didn't get back on track and square herself away that I would make it my mission in life to get to know her CSM and CO and to throw her disrespectful, unprofessional tushy out of my beloved service. There are great troops being cut left and right to accomodate her insubordination? I think not.
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CPL Matthew Pruett
You know I thinkit is a shame last I looked we were training soldiers silly me instead they want college environments. Dont yell at me don't scream don't touch me. These are what my three year old twins say. Not men and women training for war to pretect are great country 15 years ago it didn't matter how you felt or where you were if you were a Jo and you were wrong it got fixed on the spot.
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1SG (Join to see)
All service members have the right to not be touched, unless they are a direct threat to themselves or others. If you think saying "don't touch me" is silly or an indication of weakness or insubordination, I suggest you sit in a few more SHARP classes.
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CPO (Join to see)
We have all seen things in our career that were "out to lunch" and felt the responsibility to "make it right" no matter what.
There is a thing called span of control. The truth is that before I take someone on in any situation, the first question is, and to what extent? To what extent am I willing to go, can I go and should I go in dealing with this overall situation?
Before I jump into a situation knowing the position of actual and legitimate authority I have in the given situation is a pretty wise footing to have.
The public display of immature raising of voices or other public spectacle with no real means of enforcement would be worse than to do nothing at all at times.
I do not look down at a person unless there is a genuine anticipation of helping them up when they have fallen.
To allow my emotions or over-reaction to bring discredit to myself or further shame to the uniform would be much worse than anything at all, be they senior, junior or even a member of my peer group.
I can not win the war if I get wiped out in a minor skirmish. Rest assured, the war would be won and the behavior would be corrected. Maybe not there and then, but it would be corrected.
Approach, assess, discuss and assess again, my response would be as fluid as needed for the given situation. In the end, the behavior would be corrected, the level of embarrassment onto them is their own choosing. Mine is that of my choosing also. Once that perception of self control is gone, it is gone.
There is a thing called span of control. The truth is that before I take someone on in any situation, the first question is, and to what extent? To what extent am I willing to go, can I go and should I go in dealing with this overall situation?
Before I jump into a situation knowing the position of actual and legitimate authority I have in the given situation is a pretty wise footing to have.
The public display of immature raising of voices or other public spectacle with no real means of enforcement would be worse than to do nothing at all at times.
I do not look down at a person unless there is a genuine anticipation of helping them up when they have fallen.
To allow my emotions or over-reaction to bring discredit to myself or further shame to the uniform would be much worse than anything at all, be they senior, junior or even a member of my peer group.
I can not win the war if I get wiped out in a minor skirmish. Rest assured, the war would be won and the behavior would be corrected. Maybe not there and then, but it would be corrected.
Approach, assess, discuss and assess again, my response would be as fluid as needed for the given situation. In the end, the behavior would be corrected, the level of embarrassment onto them is their own choosing. Mine is that of my choosing also. Once that perception of self control is gone, it is gone.
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SPC Roger F.
1SG (Join to see) - I went through basics in the late 80's and once heard a soldier yell "you're not allowed to touch me" to which the DI quickly replied "I'm not touching you. I am touching the uniform. You just happen to be in it."
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