Posted on Nov 11, 2015
MSgt Curtis Ellis
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On the eve of Veterans Day, the Senate passed legislation Tuesday that would for the first time allow Veterans Health Administration doctors to authorize medical marijuana use for patients (NON-ACTIVE DUTY).

The Veterans Health Administration currently does not allow its physicians to discuss marijuana as a treatment option with patients in the nearly two dozen states with medical pot laws, forcing veterans to turn elsewhere for guidance and the paperwork necessary to acquire the drug.

State medical marijuana laws vary greatly. Some allow only a small number of conditions to be treated with the drug, while others like California have famously lax guidelines. The Obama administration largely tolerates state medical (and recreational) marijuana programs, despite marijuana possession for any reason outside limited research remaining a federal crime.

The Senate legislation won’t change the federal illegality of using marijuana as medicine or open the door to greater legal research through changing its classification as a Schedule I drug under the Controlled Substances Act – which deems it without medical value – but it’s nonetheless a big win for reform advocates.

"We see this victory as a step toward a peace treaty with the government we volunteered to defend with our lives and as a step toward restoring our First Amendment rights and dignity as citizens," said T.J. Thompson, a disabled Navy veteran, in a statement circulated by the Drug Policy Alliance.

The news came as activist Garyn Angel arrived in soggy McPherson Square in downtown Washington, D.C., to prepare for a pro-medical marijuana demonstration. Angel, the founder and CEO of Magical Butter, plans to lead a group of veterans to the White House on Wednesday toting a giant pill bottle and touting marijuana as an alternate treatment for PTSD and other conditions.

"It’s an exciting time for veterans," Angel says. "Veterans should have access to cannabis regardless of their ZIP code," he adds, something that would require farther-reaching legislation.

The Senate measure was adopted by the Senate Appropriations Committee in May by a vote of 18-12, with four Republicans joining Democrats in favor. The larger spending bill to which it was attached – funding veterans and military construction projects – passed the Senate without opposition Tuesday.

The medical marijuana language still must survive a negotiated spending deal between leaders of the Senate and the House of Representatives. The lower chamber narrowly rejected the proposal in April when it passed its own version of the bill.

But there may be cause for optimism. After House lawmakers rejected the companion amendment in a 213-210 vote (with 35 Republicans voting in favor), Rep. John Garamendi, D-Calif., told U.S. News he mistakenly voted “no” and that he “misread the amendment.” Another “no” vote, whose support could have assured victory, Rep. Morgan Griffith, R-Va., told U.S. News the amendment didn’t go far enough.

The fact that the House version of the measure would have passed if Griffith and Garamendi voted in favor "should mean something," says Michael Collins, the Drug Policy Alliance's deputy director of national affairs, who believes significant bipartisan backing in both chambers boosts the chances of incorporation, even in the face of opposition from most Republicans.

A decision not to include the amendment would merely delay the inevitable, he says.

Last year, in what reformers hope will be a parallel, a spending amendment that passed the House but not the Senate, banning federal prosecutors and anti-drug agents from interfering with state medical marijuana laws, was included in a large spending deal that became law.
Edited 10 y ago
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MSgt Operations Intelligence
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What people have to keep in mind is that medicine effects people differently. This would give the doctors another treatment option based on the patient. However, with all the negativity of the VA in the news, is it really a good idea to allow them the ability or trustworthiness to prescribe this type of treatment?
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MSgt Curtis Ellis
MSgt Curtis Ellis
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MSgt (Join to see) You bring up a good point, and one, I find hard to believe, that I overlooked... I may have to give this a bit more thought...

Oh, the pic rocked!!! LOL!
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SFC Mark Merino
SFC Mark Merino
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MSgt (Join to see) 'Papyrus......I need rolling papyrus.'
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SGT(P) Team Member
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10 y
This picture is so funny..
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COL Vincent Stoneking
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Key word being "veteran" as in discharged. And keep in mind that it is STILL illegal on federal property - such as if you then go to the PX....

Personally, I don't buy that there is anything that "Medical" Marijuana can do that can't be done by other treatments, but I don't care enough to fight about it. It appears to be the fad until people lose interest.
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LTC Immigration Judge
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I'm kind of split on the issue.  As a progressive and a defense attorney, I think that if alcohol is legal, then pot should be as well.  Likewise I understand very well that it is on the federal schedule, and believe that until it is off the federal schedule that illegal means illegal.

Needless to say, I recognize this as a difficult issue and just don't have the answer.
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MSgt Curtis Ellis
MSgt Curtis Ellis
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COL Vincent Stoneking - Well, Sir, seeing that the legislation won’t change the federal illegality of marijuana anywhere, any Vet who "forgets" (kinda like a few of them that do now), deserves to get caught, and if they do, then "I forgot" isn't the reason... It was the first excuse they could come up with...
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SMSgt Clyde Hunter
SMSgt Clyde Hunter
10 y
Bad idea, not because I don't think medicinal marijuana is a bad idea...A federally funded institution should not be able to authorize use of a federally identified illegal substance... There will be lawsuits as a result when a Vet gets busted and loses his security clearance and/or his job. But maybe that is how some bright guy in the administration is gonna push federal legislation on an issue that is long overdue...marijuana legalization or at least removal as federal Class I illegal substance.
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MSgt Curtis Ellis
MSgt Curtis Ellis
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SMSgt Clyde Hunter - Again, the legislation won’t change the federal illegality of marijuana anywhere. All this does is allow VA doctors to authorize medical marijuana use for patients as a viable option by a licensed physician who believes, in their professional medical opinion, this would be beneficial for. That being said, if you have a job that requires a security clearance and you get busted for pissing hot, you deserve to lose that job, as it is still illegal for you if you wish to continue working for the federal government. If you don't, then light em up and enjoy...
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CMSgt James Nolan
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I voted yes. I have a friend, who I deployed with years ago, who later was in a vehicle hit by an RPG. He suffers badly from PTSD. He is an advocate for this, and claims it helps him. I am no Doc, and am not personally a fan of any drug use, but...if it helps, it helps.
I don't see him, and would not hang around someone who is using, because of my status, but if it is controlled and it helps those who need it, then who am I to say no?
Do I see potential problems? Yes.
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MSgt Curtis Ellis
MSgt Curtis Ellis
10 y
CMSgt James Nolan Thanks for your comment, Chief.
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CMSgt James Nolan
CMSgt James Nolan
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MSgt Curtis Ellis - Makes you wish for a magic 8 ball doesn't it? Would never want to see them hurting more.
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Senate OKs VA Docs To Authorize Medicinal Marijuana for Veterans In States That Allow It. Good Idea? Bad Idea? Indifferent?
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SFC Mark Merino
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I have to say that my opinion has changed now that I am no longer serving. If it is acceptable for me to take a handful of legal narcotics that tear up my liver, I would be willing to try it if it worked as well/better. I don't operate heavy machinery, work with humans, etc. since I'm unemployed. I'd rub a chicken foot if I thought it would help. The chance of people abusing the system is probably the same as prescriptions but it may be even higher. I'm just guesstimating. In AZ, they have signs everywhere to not even bother asking for it. I have teenagers and worry about the message it would send to them if I fire up. I guess too many years in the military has hard wired my brain to feel like I would be doing something wrong. If it was in a pill form I would be happier. At my age, I need to do what is best/easiest for my liver and onions. When you are in so much pain that you fear having to sneeze, you become much more accepting on pain relief.
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MSgt Curtis Ellis
MSgt Curtis Ellis
10 y
SFC Mark Merino Actually, a lot of this is in pill, candy, brownie, oil (e-cig), and many other formats for ingestion. Smoking gets it into the system quicker and is cheaper to purchase, but it doesn't have to be "smoked".
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CPT Jack Durish
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Why doesn't Congress first deal with the legality of dispensing marijuana? The Senate voting to authorize VA docs to prescribe it for their patients is like a boxing coach teaching a fighter to lean into a left hook when it's thrown at him
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MSgt Curtis Ellis
MSgt Curtis Ellis
10 y
Again, the legislation won’t change the federal illegality of marijuana anywhere. All this does is allow VA doctors to authorize medical marijuana use for patients as a viable option by a licensed physician who believes, in their professional medical opinion, this would be beneficial for. This does not includes dispensing as that would be illegal for the VA to do.
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Maj Jeff Dodd
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Interesting that the Senate approved the dispensing of a Schedule 1 narcotic (i.e. Still illegal to possess or use on the federal level according to the DEA) via the VA medical system. If it is to be legalized properly, MJ needs to be taken off the Schedule 1 list of narcotics at the federal level. I don't see this happening in my lifetime due to many factors that are too complex to get into on RP. I'll say this about that: I believe that someone suffering from painful bone cancer or some other similar debilitating injury should not be denied any substance which will ease their suffering, but to dispense MJ to a whiny housewife or factory worker for insomnia is a joke. I voted against recreational use and medicinal MJ legalization in FL last time it came up on the ballot because their were too many loopholes for it to be abused by lazy dirtbags potheads.
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MSgt Curtis Ellis
MSgt Curtis Ellis
10 y
Maj Jeff Dodd Keep in mind, authorizing it's use vs dispensing it are two different issues and this legislation does not change the federal illegality of using marijuana as medicine or open the door to greater legal research through changing its classification as a Schedule I drug under the Controlled Substances Act. It just allows VA doc's to see it as a viable option option to those patients who could actually benefit from it.
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Maj Jeff Dodd
Maj Jeff Dodd
10 y
MSgt Curtis Ellis - Great points
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SMSgt Clyde Hunter
SMSgt Clyde Hunter
10 y
Maj Jeff Dodd I think you will see it federally legalized in your lifetime
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Maj Jeff Dodd
Maj Jeff Dodd
10 y
SMSgt Clyde Hunter - Maybe, but think off all the Federal, State, and Local law enforcement agencies that have task forces that depend on going after MJ specifically. The MJ enforement business is good business for those that are in it from a budget standpoint. There will always be another dangerous or illicit substance to go after I guess so they can adjust resources accordingly.
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PO1 John Miller
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MSgt Curtis Ellis
I'm sure you're familiar with my opinion on the legalization of medical and recreational use of marijuana, so I won't discuss that. But to answer your question, I absolutely think this is a good idea. Hell, I would try to get my medical MJ card, as it is "legal" here in AZ, if I didn't have a security clearance to maintain even though I don't smoke and have no desire to partake!
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PO1 John Miller
PO1 John Miller
10 y
MSgt Curtis Ellis
My question is, if the VA can now "recommend" its usage, does that mean if a veteran pisses hot for weed they won't get their other meds cancelled? Or would they even test for weed?
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MSgt Curtis Ellis
MSgt Curtis Ellis
10 y
PO1 John Miller The verbiage still has to be written, but it is my understanding that if it's medicinal usage is indicated and documented in your VA HEALTH RECORDS by the VA doc, then it shouldn't be an issue, otherwise, where ever it's considered illegal federally, it's still illegal federally...
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SMSgt Clyde Hunter
SMSgt Clyde Hunter
10 y
MSgt Curtis Ellis, P01 John Miller, it is illegal "federally" everywhere so how can a federal institution "authorize or recommend" it's use anywhere? They Va and/or the Dr would be liable for prosecution or at least a defense platform should a federally employed VA patient piss hot and then claim my federally employed VA doctor told me it was a viable option though he can't prescribe it. Now if the federal government writes medicinal usage legislature...But shouldn't the legislature be written BEFORE VA can authorize or recommend medicinal use? I don't see it as a probable campaign issue either, but it should be...
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SMSgt Clyde Hunter
SMSgt Clyde Hunter
10 y
BTW, MSgt Curtis Ellis, why would you try and get your medical marijuana use card IF you were not federally employed though you don't smoke NOR have a desire to smoke? Just a cool card to have in your wallet. LOL?
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SSG Keith Fosmire
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I believe the use of marijuana should not be or should ever have been controlled by the government. If they want a study done, use returning infantry and give them a choice between pot and alcohol. Only being allowed to use one or the other for 6 months. I am interested who gets in the most trouble. Even as a recreational use, it is far less damaging than the effects of alcohol. Alcohol has probably destroyed more families and careers than cannabis, you don't black out from smoking, no over dose, and no hang overs. It should never have been illegal in the first place.
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CPT Topher Murphy
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Marijuana Use is Associated with Worse Outcomes in Symptom Severity and Violent Behavior In patients with PTSD. - Journal of Clinical Psychiatry 2015; 76 (9); 1174-1180

summary is this: MJ use after treatment was associated with worse ptsd symptoms, more violent behavior and alcohol use. MJ may actually worsen ptsd symptom and/or nullify the benefits of specialized intensive treatment.
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PO1 Richard Knox
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Since our Government has been in the drug empire since the 40's why not. Compared to some of the drugs we're given for pain, marijuana may be one of the better choices. It's natural not man made and the side effects, excluding "munchies" are likely less destructive to the body (and brain) than chemical pharmaceuticals.
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MSgt Curtis Ellis
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