Posted on Apr 9, 2017
Should an officer be allowed to continue to serve on Active Duty after being relieved from command?
108K
1.39K
385
139
139
0
Some officers are meant to command and lead, and others probably should never be allowed the opportunity. I'm a witness to the case of an ousted ex-commander now working as a staff-O "leading" a highly technical department - his lack of technical competence and inability to mentor and lead others is obvious. Should such an officer be "encouraged" to separate or retire early to make room?
Posted 8 y ago
Responses: 267
If unfit for any job suitable for the rank held a oerson should be reduced or removed. Regardless of rank.
(0)
(0)
I had a BN commander who though he was another GP by wearing those riding baggie pants with the tall riding boots. if we all have to follow a dress code ! so should our officers.
(0)
(0)
During the war in Vietnam and today, getting officers into command positions was a critical goal. As a result, many LTC' s were commanding infantry battalions and they had not been in any infantry positions in years. Many 11B' paid a huge penalty for that policy. After the battle at LZ X Ray, the 1st Cav left the battle site under a different commander and was almost destroyed due to lack of infantry leadership skills.
(0)
(0)
The military has one thing in common with its civilian counterparts. It promotes to incompetents. Meaning every leader at every level will continue to be promoted until they reach a level in which they are no longer able to perform the job as needed, instead of leaving them at the position in which they were optimal. The up or out mentally has cost the U.S. military of all branches some of the best most competent leaders and technical experts it has ever had and filled the ranks with people promoted too fast only barely able to keep up with their duties before being forced to promote again for more duties or leave. Its a disgrace we treat our people this way. Keeping them always balancing on the edge of disaster just a few steps from collapsing. This compounded by the fact that in today's service one misstep, one bad decision can cost one their career as well as the career of everyone around them.
Take the Navy for example; an error in judgment of the Officer in Charge of a ship at night impacts another vassal. That Officer is done, so is the enlisted helmsman that followed the order, as is the XO and Captain of the ship who were asleep at the time. Everyone's career ends because someone was promoted before they could handle the extra duties, and I don't think this problem is limited only to the Navy.
Take the Navy for example; an error in judgment of the Officer in Charge of a ship at night impacts another vassal. That Officer is done, so is the enlisted helmsman that followed the order, as is the XO and Captain of the ship who were asleep at the time. Everyone's career ends because someone was promoted before they could handle the extra duties, and I don't think this problem is limited only to the Navy.
(0)
(0)
It depends on the situation. I was given the option to stay in the service at my old rank of Staff Sergeant after being RIF'd 2 years after OCS. Jimmy Carters budget cuts did a lot of guys in. My SFC had been a LTC and they let him complete his 20 after the RIF.
(0)
(0)
Setting someone In a position where they are over their head could be a sure recipe for disaster. .
I served as a SSGT (AF) and had just returned to duty from a Temporary disability Retirement List after 2-1/2 year on the list. Quite a bit had changed while I was gone.. There were just certain things a supervisor couldn’t do in regards to what he could tell Airmen to do. I was going by what these Airmen were expected to do by their skill level description.. On one of the shifts I had a
SrAmn being shift Ldr. For that while his regular Ldr. was on his off-day. His 1st cook(the position he usually done was an A1C(E-3)... fortunate for us they were both very competent and comfortable in their position.. the lunch went well w/o
any probs.. aside from getting replacement pans in the slot fat enough.
I’d rather they be more careful than fast and avoid spillage of sauces or product..
then time has to be taken for clean-up..
We changed a lot of pans because I didn’t allow pans to be overloaded with product..
or using deeper pans just to save time.. we had good looking product ... We made a few changes so the product would look as good when we were almost to the end
As when the pan was first placed on the line.. I didn’t like hiding product like breaded meats under sauce.. a little is fine .but burying it will make a soggy product..
So sauce was added if the Airman* requested.. we could also put in a side dish.. I have put sauces on dish around the product, under it.. One Airman asked if he could sample the sauce.. I gave him a little in a side dish .. he was fine with it it and told us to proceed putting on the product.. Some people get inpatient having to wait.. for others.. sometimes
Things seem to get out of line.. a few Airmen later but down thd line, a Airman asked if he could sample the Pie.. Sure..
picked up the dish and put in his fork .. decided he didn’t like it and took a piece of cake instead.. we’ll I couldn’t serve that pie but seen he took the cake .. I want them be happy with their selection.. maybe the rest of his day will be productive.. hope so!.. don’t need grumpy Airmen because their lunch was so-so.. rather complaint come from something other than about the food we serve .. Anyway the day went great.. when the Facility NCOIC came in later after we were finished and had gotten all our cook log done.. and requisition in for next day’s dinner.. The NCOIC asked why didn’t I call the SSGT from the evening shift to come in.. I replied ; “Why, there was myself I had a competent SrAmn and A1C and 3 other AMN on shift”... I worked with them as close as I needed to and could assist as needed.. I did at times..
We had the sit-rep in hand.. I worked with these Amn when it was my shift..
before I became a Assistant Dining Facility
NCOIC.. I cross-trained them to be able to be 1st Cooks, shift-leaders, Fill the Cook log, make requisitions, returns.. disposition of left overs.. how not to overcook(cook too much). There are items like liver that are not that popular..
one we had liver and s’thing else not too popular either .. we were supposed to have liver and breaded hamburger patties (chicken fried steak) and thete was a tomato sauce for the liver. That wasn’t gonna fly.. I had them flour,eggwash and bread the liver.. We had both grills going..
I got out bacon and we did that and served with the liver. And tomato sauce
(Pico d’ Gallo) over the burgers.. both went well We served more liver than planned (3.5 cases). Spanish burgers went well.. I had mild and medium sauces.. As for the breading ; we ground wheat, white and rye bread and toasted in roasters with a light amount of oil. Everything was to perfection.. I thought of adding ground almonds but figured that was pushing it ; Liver Amondine.. seriously? Dinner went well that day..
“Watta ya mean ya used 3-1/2 cases of liver, we barely use 2! What the heck !
Why does he complain.. liver was .36 a serving (in the box frozen). Burger patties
.39 a quarter lb patty. (That was in ‘82,
‘83)... it might have been a tad more..
We cooked n served bake ham with cherry sauce.. I signed out a case of Pie cherries(we used 4, returned 2.. and out of the cherry sauce left we had about 1-1/2 cups.. why didn’t you use maraschino cherries? They were actually $1.80 a can more than. The pie cherries in natural juice (#10 can). Early The next day one of the civilians the Dining Facility NCOIC knew came and wanted the empty gallon jars (plastic) supposed to be left for him..
Sorry jack, no jars ! Did ya throw them out? No, they used pie cherries out of a
#10 can.. he left heavy-hearted ...
I can say after that dinner I had very happy Airmen.. many just took the cherries in a side dish and ate them that way. We did put a few. In the serving pan
Just for appearance sake.. I let the Airmen do how they were trained and guided as needed.. if they got ideas .. I want to hear them.. if good we’ll try them
after we cost out the product and see if we can do it. I train them to be able to do that.. go through the catalog and find the list prices , in what volume. (How many per case.. divide cost of case by how many in it..). What other items needed?
Breading, eggs, milk.. spices..? Is their a sauce, gravy ? ; made with a roux (roo)
Cornstarch n warred added to juice of meat.. best sauce with cornstarch is a
Cornstarch-flour and make up a juice with
Beef or chicken base, will not need much.. add corn-starch flour mix so it’s a smooth slurry.. then when juice is bubbling have s’body add slurry easy and another stir it in.. it has to cook enough so starch-flour taste is gone.. add slurry as needed, not too much at once.. you may not need all of it.. having chicken and beef on same line and not enough room for two gravies?
When making roux.. add in chicken and beef base And mix in stock .. gravy will work good for both.. ..
Top guy ask me why I teach the Airmen to fill out Sr. Cook requisition form and cook sheet/log when they’re only Airmen?
Because it sharpens their skill.. what if they get thrown into. Sitrep and there’s only them, some other Airmen ? Why have them running all over like headless
Chickens looking for help.. teach them self reliance in what they may have to do in an emergency some day. When I was first in the Reserves as an A1C I learned every form I could relates to being a cook, cook supervisor.. I learned the ration strength Report .. I learned the Commissary requisition form ..
learned the cash in/out form
All what was related to setting up the mess check.. (per diem charges and who pays them.. ). If a mess check asks, I can tell them... who’s authorized to do a Dining critique paper(all Airmen on Meal card and separate rations, drawing per diem.. officers required to use din’g Hall, Alert facility as an evaluating officer will fill
A critique. Mandatory. We had a locked box the sheets went into.. voided sheets (mistakes)had to be saved to account for them.. then they could be destroyed....
it didn’t hurt for the average Airman to be on top of what paperwork his career field does.. I had a MSGT wanted creams for coffee, sugars, stirrers and packs of cookies.. I made a triple of a AF 139-Tally in/out sheet and was going to have the MSGT sign for the stuff.. he said he forgot the authorization # for his duty section.
He left and didn’t come back, so I set it aside to wait for his return ... I passed on to the Amn relieving me about the AF 129
and he asked since when? I said in the AF Food Service guide.. page—- chapter—.
What kind of poppycock is that? Ok, look it up ! It’s there ! One day I turned in 8 -12 copies of AF 129s costed out for
Cups, creamers, stirrers.. napkins..
the Lt about s**t herself.. I added a note showing authorization to ask for reparations from sections for requisitions
In AF FSM —- and added i’m Sure s’where there’s a Base Reg saying the same(reference AF FSM—). Well the Lt. Had the CMSGT who had the clerk go find it in the back room of the office.. they did and dusted it off and found the related
Regulation.. she sent a friendly note thst
Our section would require reparations from sections coming to us for coffee supplies.. if they didn’t want to they could. Requisition from supply.. and it would of course take longer.. And we also had limited so they may not get all they ask for.. I had more sections leaving Us alone and going to supply.. They set up times and days for sections to get their stuff !
I served as a SSGT (AF) and had just returned to duty from a Temporary disability Retirement List after 2-1/2 year on the list. Quite a bit had changed while I was gone.. There were just certain things a supervisor couldn’t do in regards to what he could tell Airmen to do. I was going by what these Airmen were expected to do by their skill level description.. On one of the shifts I had a
SrAmn being shift Ldr. For that while his regular Ldr. was on his off-day. His 1st cook(the position he usually done was an A1C(E-3)... fortunate for us they were both very competent and comfortable in their position.. the lunch went well w/o
any probs.. aside from getting replacement pans in the slot fat enough.
I’d rather they be more careful than fast and avoid spillage of sauces or product..
then time has to be taken for clean-up..
We changed a lot of pans because I didn’t allow pans to be overloaded with product..
or using deeper pans just to save time.. we had good looking product ... We made a few changes so the product would look as good when we were almost to the end
As when the pan was first placed on the line.. I didn’t like hiding product like breaded meats under sauce.. a little is fine .but burying it will make a soggy product..
So sauce was added if the Airman* requested.. we could also put in a side dish.. I have put sauces on dish around the product, under it.. One Airman asked if he could sample the sauce.. I gave him a little in a side dish .. he was fine with it it and told us to proceed putting on the product.. Some people get inpatient having to wait.. for others.. sometimes
Things seem to get out of line.. a few Airmen later but down thd line, a Airman asked if he could sample the Pie.. Sure..
picked up the dish and put in his fork .. decided he didn’t like it and took a piece of cake instead.. we’ll I couldn’t serve that pie but seen he took the cake .. I want them be happy with their selection.. maybe the rest of his day will be productive.. hope so!.. don’t need grumpy Airmen because their lunch was so-so.. rather complaint come from something other than about the food we serve .. Anyway the day went great.. when the Facility NCOIC came in later after we were finished and had gotten all our cook log done.. and requisition in for next day’s dinner.. The NCOIC asked why didn’t I call the SSGT from the evening shift to come in.. I replied ; “Why, there was myself I had a competent SrAmn and A1C and 3 other AMN on shift”... I worked with them as close as I needed to and could assist as needed.. I did at times..
We had the sit-rep in hand.. I worked with these Amn when it was my shift..
before I became a Assistant Dining Facility
NCOIC.. I cross-trained them to be able to be 1st Cooks, shift-leaders, Fill the Cook log, make requisitions, returns.. disposition of left overs.. how not to overcook(cook too much). There are items like liver that are not that popular..
one we had liver and s’thing else not too popular either .. we were supposed to have liver and breaded hamburger patties (chicken fried steak) and thete was a tomato sauce for the liver. That wasn’t gonna fly.. I had them flour,eggwash and bread the liver.. We had both grills going..
I got out bacon and we did that and served with the liver. And tomato sauce
(Pico d’ Gallo) over the burgers.. both went well We served more liver than planned (3.5 cases). Spanish burgers went well.. I had mild and medium sauces.. As for the breading ; we ground wheat, white and rye bread and toasted in roasters with a light amount of oil. Everything was to perfection.. I thought of adding ground almonds but figured that was pushing it ; Liver Amondine.. seriously? Dinner went well that day..
“Watta ya mean ya used 3-1/2 cases of liver, we barely use 2! What the heck !
Why does he complain.. liver was .36 a serving (in the box frozen). Burger patties
.39 a quarter lb patty. (That was in ‘82,
‘83)... it might have been a tad more..
We cooked n served bake ham with cherry sauce.. I signed out a case of Pie cherries(we used 4, returned 2.. and out of the cherry sauce left we had about 1-1/2 cups.. why didn’t you use maraschino cherries? They were actually $1.80 a can more than. The pie cherries in natural juice (#10 can). Early The next day one of the civilians the Dining Facility NCOIC knew came and wanted the empty gallon jars (plastic) supposed to be left for him..
Sorry jack, no jars ! Did ya throw them out? No, they used pie cherries out of a
#10 can.. he left heavy-hearted ...
I can say after that dinner I had very happy Airmen.. many just took the cherries in a side dish and ate them that way. We did put a few. In the serving pan
Just for appearance sake.. I let the Airmen do how they were trained and guided as needed.. if they got ideas .. I want to hear them.. if good we’ll try them
after we cost out the product and see if we can do it. I train them to be able to do that.. go through the catalog and find the list prices , in what volume. (How many per case.. divide cost of case by how many in it..). What other items needed?
Breading, eggs, milk.. spices..? Is their a sauce, gravy ? ; made with a roux (roo)
Cornstarch n warred added to juice of meat.. best sauce with cornstarch is a
Cornstarch-flour and make up a juice with
Beef or chicken base, will not need much.. add corn-starch flour mix so it’s a smooth slurry.. then when juice is bubbling have s’body add slurry easy and another stir it in.. it has to cook enough so starch-flour taste is gone.. add slurry as needed, not too much at once.. you may not need all of it.. having chicken and beef on same line and not enough room for two gravies?
When making roux.. add in chicken and beef base And mix in stock .. gravy will work good for both.. ..
Top guy ask me why I teach the Airmen to fill out Sr. Cook requisition form and cook sheet/log when they’re only Airmen?
Because it sharpens their skill.. what if they get thrown into. Sitrep and there’s only them, some other Airmen ? Why have them running all over like headless
Chickens looking for help.. teach them self reliance in what they may have to do in an emergency some day. When I was first in the Reserves as an A1C I learned every form I could relates to being a cook, cook supervisor.. I learned the ration strength Report .. I learned the Commissary requisition form ..
learned the cash in/out form
All what was related to setting up the mess check.. (per diem charges and who pays them.. ). If a mess check asks, I can tell them... who’s authorized to do a Dining critique paper(all Airmen on Meal card and separate rations, drawing per diem.. officers required to use din’g Hall, Alert facility as an evaluating officer will fill
A critique. Mandatory. We had a locked box the sheets went into.. voided sheets (mistakes)had to be saved to account for them.. then they could be destroyed....
it didn’t hurt for the average Airman to be on top of what paperwork his career field does.. I had a MSGT wanted creams for coffee, sugars, stirrers and packs of cookies.. I made a triple of a AF 139-Tally in/out sheet and was going to have the MSGT sign for the stuff.. he said he forgot the authorization # for his duty section.
He left and didn’t come back, so I set it aside to wait for his return ... I passed on to the Amn relieving me about the AF 129
and he asked since when? I said in the AF Food Service guide.. page—- chapter—.
What kind of poppycock is that? Ok, look it up ! It’s there ! One day I turned in 8 -12 copies of AF 129s costed out for
Cups, creamers, stirrers.. napkins..
the Lt about s**t herself.. I added a note showing authorization to ask for reparations from sections for requisitions
In AF FSM —- and added i’m Sure s’where there’s a Base Reg saying the same(reference AF FSM—). Well the Lt. Had the CMSGT who had the clerk go find it in the back room of the office.. they did and dusted it off and found the related
Regulation.. she sent a friendly note thst
Our section would require reparations from sections coming to us for coffee supplies.. if they didn’t want to they could. Requisition from supply.. and it would of course take longer.. And we also had limited so they may not get all they ask for.. I had more sections leaving Us alone and going to supply.. They set up times and days for sections to get their stuff !
(0)
(0)
Not all officers are commanders and all NCO’s shouldn’t be PSG’s, 1Sg’s, or CSM’s. Keep the best of both and reward them.
(0)
(0)
Read This Next