Posted on May 28, 2014
Should Army and Marines (or components of) consolidate?
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Think objectively. Traditions, camaraderie aside. Both are somewhat similarly more combat-oriented than USN or USAF. Answer practically without putting down either one of them.
PS: Yes, some are taunting about USN and USAF consolidation or Air Force return to Army Air Corps. My take on that if it's practical, lessen bureaucracy, and make for a smoother communications pipeline amongst the DoD components, why not? Again, camaraderie and traditions aside for a min.
PS: Yes, some are taunting about USN and USAF consolidation or Air Force return to Army Air Corps. My take on that if it's practical, lessen bureaucracy, and make for a smoother communications pipeline amongst the DoD components, why not? Again, camaraderie and traditions aside for a min.
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 1533
I have had the priviledge of experiences both services and there is a huge difference. The mission set for both while they may seem similar they are very different. The Marines primary mission set is designed more for initial and rapid conflict resolution. They have been serving in the current conflicts in a longer range operations which accredits them with the ability to modify their mission set. The Army has units that are designed with a mission set similar to the Marines however the primary mission set is designed for a longer range operations and a large force deployment. Now it says to put camaraderie aside however that is a vital aspect of operations. A larger force has a mor difficult time to maintain a greater level of comradarie which can adversely affect combat operations. I think it would be a huge mistake to join the forces. It would be like telling the Army Special Forces Group that they will be joined with the generak population of the Army. This would degrade the the morale and comradarie of the Special Forces which in turn dirrectly affects their operational proficiency.
Robert E Griffin
SSG(ret), USA
Served HM3 USN, 8404 before they established FMC.
Robert E Griffin
SSG(ret), USA
Served HM3 USN, 8404 before they established FMC.
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You would have to change the constitution to get rid of the Marines. Its the only branch mandated. We are the tip of the spear! The Marines and the Army are very different. The Marines are the only branch in which every member is combat trained and ready.
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While your question has a point in that both are land oriented combat forces look at it like this, that is like saying the air force and navy should join since they both have planes. Or that the navy and coast guard should consolidate on the basis that they are both water based branches. Every branch has their purpose and also the or own history and pride from their branch. I have a frIinds either in or with the exception of the Navy still in. In my graduating class we had myself, a National guard soldier, another national guard soldier, a army reserve soldier, one active airman, one reserve airman, and a reserve marine, all in a class of 48. I grew up with these people and yes we all give each other crap about who's better etc. But in the end we all know we have our own purpose in the military.
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The Marine Corps is not a force that should be used for long term land operations. We will if we have to. Our hope and will is to become our true selves again. That is a force prepared to lay the groundwork for whatever follows. It's a mindset, a culture, a core principle all Marines share. We accept and pride ourselves as the force that asks for little but delivers. We are not the Army, not should we be. I refuse your patches.
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Marines are needed as part of the Navy. The Army is much more a diverse organization with diverse capabilities. Marines by their connection to the Navy have a limited capability and mission.
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I would hope that you aren't insisting that it is any different of level pride to earn the title of a Soldier in the United States Army. I have lived with the USMC and served with them for many years. The only ones that separate the branches and say one is better than the other are usually the young immature people. I am very proud to be a Soldier and no one will ever take that away regardless of what you were taught in boot camp.
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LTC Paul Labrador
The problem SFC (Join to see) is that discussions like this tend to devolve into that.
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Of course they should. Or vice versa and merge the Army with the Marine Corps. There's nothing that one does that the other can't do or learn to do and the taxpayers shouldn't be billed for the redundancy.
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Sgt Alex Clarke
The Marine Corps does everything the Army does, except cheaper. A merger would reduce the savings that the taxpayers enjoy. A merger will never happen.
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Have this same statement made partially in the FB link it is attached to ( hate doing same things twice in repetition ) : I have a written change of military doctrine document that would confuse our enemies and consolidate our military into a more tight knit cohesive force . It is based on deployability status . It would possibly save money and mobilize our military faster . It would separate our military into command structure by means of type of warfare military personnel deploy in which is based on the kind of terrain they deploy to , through. Have no way of measuring the expenses it would entail.
Presently a lot of coordination gets slowed down by requests for transport by both the US Air Force and Navy. My system would consolidate 83 ranks insignia down to about 25 . There would be one dress uniform ( Marine dress uniform makes women swoon. ) Camouflage is dependent on terrain. So the combat uniform would depend on location and deployable status. There would be a change in the physical fitness uniform of all commands . All MOS specific uniforms would be the same with only a nameplate change. Unit designators may not need to be changed. Just their mission deployability status would need to be changed. Techniques of combat could be collaborated more readily by all ground forces...both Marines and Army The US Army would be changed to Homeland defense status for training and security and Marines would be anyone deployed overseas .
I could not get it out of my mind once I retired. It always bothered me to see the UNITED STATES Marines , Army , Navy, Air Force being separated and also some of the belligerence between branches . It bothered me until I wrote it down. How can we be united if we are separately distinguished apart as separate branches which depend on each other to operate?
Did I care who was guarding me as I built a fire base in a foreign nation as an engineer? No, as long as they were from the USA. Did I care who I was firing artillery support missile fire missions to protect ? No , it could have been Marines gaining enemy ground, as long as Americans were safe. Did I care who I was supporting as a Chaplain Assistant ? We all have personal needs , cares, concerns, problems in life. If you are US active military and would like a copy I can send an internet copy for free . If you require a physical copy it will have to be 'covered' for shipping and handling sake as I am a civilian now. America bless God, SSG, USARNG retired .
Presently a lot of coordination gets slowed down by requests for transport by both the US Air Force and Navy. My system would consolidate 83 ranks insignia down to about 25 . There would be one dress uniform ( Marine dress uniform makes women swoon. ) Camouflage is dependent on terrain. So the combat uniform would depend on location and deployable status. There would be a change in the physical fitness uniform of all commands . All MOS specific uniforms would be the same with only a nameplate change. Unit designators may not need to be changed. Just their mission deployability status would need to be changed. Techniques of combat could be collaborated more readily by all ground forces...both Marines and Army The US Army would be changed to Homeland defense status for training and security and Marines would be anyone deployed overseas .
I could not get it out of my mind once I retired. It always bothered me to see the UNITED STATES Marines , Army , Navy, Air Force being separated and also some of the belligerence between branches . It bothered me until I wrote it down. How can we be united if we are separately distinguished apart as separate branches which depend on each other to operate?
Did I care who was guarding me as I built a fire base in a foreign nation as an engineer? No, as long as they were from the USA. Did I care who I was firing artillery support missile fire missions to protect ? No , it could have been Marines gaining enemy ground, as long as Americans were safe. Did I care who I was supporting as a Chaplain Assistant ? We all have personal needs , cares, concerns, problems in life. If you are US active military and would like a copy I can send an internet copy for free . If you require a physical copy it will have to be 'covered' for shipping and handling sake as I am a civilian now. America bless God, SSG, USARNG retired .
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I'd say this could only fly if every servicemember involved does a combined initial entry training that meets the rigors of both USMC Boot Camp (including the Crucible) as well as the specifications of US Army Infantry OSUT. This training scenario would also have to utilize USMC DIs and US Army Infantry DSs on a level playing field and as co-trainers.
But rolling both branches together en masse as they stand? Not on your life. The differences in specific mission, rank structure, and unit-level operations are just too different to make a USMC/Army FrankenBranch.
But rolling both branches together en masse as they stand? Not on your life. The differences in specific mission, rank structure, and unit-level operations are just too different to make a USMC/Army FrankenBranch.
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1LT Nick Kidwell
LTC Paul Labrador But if I'm not mistaken, USMC Boot Camp is pretty comparable to US Army Infantry OSUT, no?
From what I understand, there is far more emphasis on PT, weapons, marksmanship, and unarmed combat than a non-infantry Army BCT.
From what I understand, there is far more emphasis on PT, weapons, marksmanship, and unarmed combat than a non-infantry Army BCT.
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LTC Paul Labrador
1LT Nick Kidwell, the intensity of Marine Boot is pretty comparable to infantry OSUT....BUT does that level of intensity remain for their support folks once they move into their MOS training? I seriously doubt it considering that the support MOS schools the Marines go to are run by the Army. Marines have their "tail" too. Boot Camp does not make infantrymen. The Infantry School makes infantrymen...
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1LT Nick Kidwell
LTC Paul Labrador Still, I would imagine the existence of a more combat-oriented foundation among USMC support personnel as compared to US Army support personnel.
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LTC Paul Labrador
Like I said, I could buy that your average support Marine is "harder" than your average CS Soldier. But I don't buy that the difference is as vast as the difference between a CS Soldier and an Infantryman....
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