Should cell phones be allowed in the field?

Yeah...that could have been his cheeseburger he dropped though. Cell phone was just a different thing. I'm more concerned with the tactical requirements and security than generally paying attention while driving.

I believe you've presented a better argument for integrating Bluetooth technology than for banning cell phones.

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We can go back to the flags, too...

Concur, but they'd have to be in airplane mode to disable tracking. We already know by now that big-brother can track where we are at all hours of the day with the multitude of apps which ask for our location...and we allow for the wonderful services they provide us...used in a field environment, this probably needs to be disabled or taken out of the equation.

I need an anti-NSA app on my Blackberry to hide from government agencies.

Not sure what the regs say about it since I'm retired, but I don't believe they belong in the field, by Enlisted or Officers. The transmissions can be picked up on and much of them have a GPS feature that, even though the person thinks they turned it off, can still be tracked. Don't think for a minute our enemies don't know this and will use it against us

SFC Harry (Billy) Tison During my civilian deployments OIF we were initially allowed cell phones / sat phones but that was rescinded later on. The draconian method was simple - as you showed up at every location in Iraq you were greeted by security and were searched, to included yourself and your baggage. Phones, unless you had prior military approval, were confiscated and not returned. We later learned that someone (read: bad guys) were attempting to duplicate what we (read: good guys) were doing by tracking cell conversations and gps fixes. Then it finally happened - someone was hit and killed, on a base, by a weapon that apparently used gps tracking in their phone. Lot's of contractors sent their sat phones / cell phones home via mail (with batteries removed) that next day.

That's a great example of what I'm talking about PO1 George Medley.

Or they just could have been lucky and the rumor mill started spinning. They could have pulled up Google Earth and finally made the right adjustments instead of eye-balling it. Either way, cell phones are probably (99.999%) a bad call when fighting a war.

While I see your intent I cannot agree with your reasoning. First of all, when deployed you should never be using your phone. There's a time and place for all things - on a deployment is NOT where and when phones should be used. People are fooling themselves if they believe their phones are: (1) not hackable (2) not trackable (3) not giving the enemy information (4) not being used to track troop movements. There are about 70 to 90 known common apps that literally track every movement by phones even with the phones are off - unless you remove the batteries. Most of these apps are either already on most phones and require deep scrubbing to remove - but there are several that are NOT scrubbable/removeable and the companies that own them are NOT hack proof.

Phones, like tracers rounds, work in both directions - however, phones go one step further - they tell the enemy everything they need to know about what you tell the world about your troop movements, even when you say nothing at all.

Yep any who hasn't read through the End User agreement that must agree to for any of these apps or to use any of these Devices, it all written in Black and White in the details. Facebook, Google, Twitter, Amazon,and Blackberry to name a few examples that are capable to track you down far enough, where one doesn't need to lob a Nuke at you to kill you. Many of these Companies use this information and sell it too.

Even with Military issue, the issue is when you on deployment, with the battery in, depending on how it is set up, and what apps are on the phone, you are still broadcasting when the phone is turned off.

PV2 Abbott Shaull I expect a cell phone issued by the military would be configured in such a way as to avoid operational security issues, as well as include integrated asymmetric crypto application for SBU conversations. Since the phones would actually be owned by the military, the military could develop different security configurations for different situations and then manage those configurations from a central location. While this would be a costly and difficult undertaking, I believe it beats the alternative of trying to fight against technology instead of with it.

It's a great tool in garrison, ill give you that. I'm a huge advocate for using them in classroom training and hip pocket, but not during training nor deployment. My SINGARS, ASIPS and FBCB2 or BFT work just fine.

I'll just wait for the SINGARS Smartwatch Tactical Frontloading Geo-positional system slab 7, that weighs 50 lbs. and has a battery life of 10 seconds and even though its so smart still needs and ANCD to load and losses its fill 60% of the time all the time, before I say that we need cellphones on the battlefield.

Not saying that you dont make a great point, just saying that trusting android or apple to give us a secure system to communicate tactical information is not a good idea.

The main problem with cell phone technology is it, as well many apps, keeps broadcasting signals to make sure you have a signal. If you eliminate that, and turn it into a receiver, and only transmit when you push a button, then you make it more like radio. On the other hand, it uses this broadcast signal for many apps to work properly receive data in return.

Android is an OS, much like Windows Metro OS for Phones and Tablets. It is up to the manufactures of the various devices to make use of the various features of the OS to make them secure. Blackberry has the best track record in the past, but they have given up their secure E-mail accounts they had in the past, which to me is mistake. It is one of the reasons, why all the tablets in my household are WiFi only, none of them are use Cell Phone Data Plan. The Dell, HP, and Amazon, and Apple with their Tablets haven't taken the security measure that Blackberry in the past and present have taken. Blackberry has it own security risk in OS 10.

Sprint/Nextel had feature the Push to talk, that was great idea, if they could expand it into the phone, like I stated earlier, it would help make things more secure, but when you are using them, you will have to remember they are still broadcasting like any other communication device. So make it quick, and fast, and move.

A good point SGT Lee. I think they can be a great tool if they aren't a distraction from mission accomplishment and are used as an enhancement. In a tactical environment I argue that we need to rely on the integrated systems we have for communication and focus on becoming efficient and effective using those tools instead of relying on something that we have on us every day. While systems are becoming better at encryption, they still emit a signal that can be intercepted and triangulated. In an age where our competitors are trying to identify our weaknesses and exploit them, this could be an advantage to them.

While the Roman Army did have a supply train that followed them it was mostly filled with captured slaves and booty taken from raiding towns along with the supplies to keep the Roman Army moving. Most rank and file did not have their families traveling with them, the officers did on occasion. I found this information in a book titled Ceasar's Legion, based on the exploits of Legio X (The 10th Legion) Ceasar's favorite legion and personal guard.

And having worked with some Tier 1 units in Afghanistan they do have rather impressive telecommunications capabilities to call home when not on operations. The ODA team I worked with had Iridium and Thoriya (spelling) phones and I could call home like I was stateside.

Now I think cellphones/iPads/macbooks and the like should be allowed in the field when soldiers are on downtime. Now while they are doing training absolutely a NO GO! But when they are in their racks getting ready for lights out, no problem, let them listen to music, read, call home and whatever else they are going to do. It's the modern age now and technology is readily available and accessible. The premise that "they did find without then, and they'll do fine without now", doesn't hold a lot of water with me. If its there and you can use it, use the tools available.

SFC (Join to see) You raise some good points. Romans legionaries are also said to have introduced beer to Northern Europe. Revolutionary soldiers were issued a ration of 1 quart of beer per day. Even in the early 80’s we had beer tents in the field to raise the moral of troops during long field exercises. I believe the notion that most earlier armies embraced austere conditions for their troops is to misread history, successful armies have always struggled to ensure moral remained as high as possible.

I agree SSG Mark Colwell, I think earlier armies embraced what was available to them, just as modern armies should embrace what they have available. While for me a hot shower and chow might be the winning ticket, for a young PVT it maybe getting back to the rack and seeing a message or phone call home.

Shoot my last tour in Afghanistan I had my own personal cellphone and I could call my wife from Afghanistan to her phone in Iraq. Sometimes it was a good thing...lol

I think the use of a device to read or some other stress relief is fine as long as you have time for that. Most recently, GEN Milley addressed the AUSA meeting in DC and stated that we have to get used to fighting in a completely hostile environment and being miserable. He believes that in our next fight, we won't have that "down-time" you're talking about. There will be a fight followed by a defense followed by a fight...rinse and repeat. Mud, blood and terror. Not much room for a device that distracts and relieves stress.

A POTUS once said: "trust, but verify". Do you really believe that some NN is gonna use the phones properly and NOT give away vital information? If so, please join the rest of the idiots that believe that signals intelligence is no longer a valid function.

PO1 (Join to see) being a CMC on surface ships I have to agree with you that there is a lot of downtime while deployed and even "targets" do not have enough room for all the books i want/need to read. I was really disappointed in the limited scope of the Navy e-readers and would love to see an expansion of available books and other reading material (my personal kindle holds a heck of a lot more).

As far as the classified material on ships, there are many e-readers available that do not have cameras. They do have a much more extensive selection of material than Navy readers. Cell phones, simple - lock them up until the Sailor goes ashore, how hard is that? Think out of the frigging box. There are all kinds of outer game systems available too.

Yes that is part of the point I was trying make else where, my wife has Kindle Fire, and there are other e-Reader out on the market that can be more readily used to hold manuals, they can play music on some. Depending on the e-Reader how much you are willing to spend, you can watch video, slide shows, work on documents, do e-mails, social media, and pretty much what tablet does. Some have cameras, but lets face it we are trying to look for something safe, and not multi-functional that safe in the work environment, so the more basic the e-Reader the better, with lots of memory to hold more. I have friend who now working D.C. who still in the Navy, as he told me, it kinda hard to find space where there aren't game systems or iPods. His words not mine, and yes, these regardless if one using Smart Phone, Tablet, or e-Reader to keep military publication at hand to use. It does make it hard a lot harder, for the Chain of Command to deny their use in daily activity, unless it for such thing as safety for while on deployment. Like I said before and many others, as technology advances, the Military is always slow to accept it, because of it size. Look how long it took, for the Military to go from pen and paper organization to Computerize things, lot longer than it should of due to the resistance from within.

Same thing with making reliable communication devices any smaller than are for the Military. I will point out the fact that the number of people who lose their Cell Phones on the regular basis, and before that, their PDA's and pager's. Now ask yourself, why the Military is still expecting you to carry piece of equipment that is basically a paperweight until it is set up correctly, while you carry in you pocket something that you can put you CO, Platoon Sergeant, Platoon Leader, and anyone else in your command you need to talk to on speed dial if you need to call. Or send a text to them to check in, get clarifications on orders, whatever. With the small radios they have brought down to the individual troops is great thing, for in 1989, only Team Leaders, Squad Leaders, Platoon Sergeants, and Platoon Leader..on up had them, along with regular RTOs carrying their man-pack radio in the Airborne Infantry Company. Much the same with Night Vision devices.

I do think in the future, you will see more of these hand held devices being issued in the Military with limited abilities. It is just right now the Military is trying to catch up what their needs are, and where technology is, and how do they bring this technology into the Military without compromising deployed units, which is the big deal breaker, which like I said if they could build in where the transmitters turn off, unless a button was pushed, and then it broadcast only while it was press. Making it into effect into basic radio set, and not a cell phone/gps, and have it safe guarded so this button couldn't be as they say butt dialed. You will always have the issue what should be allowed and not allowed. Training has lot to do with it too, and getting people to understand, especially those who don't want to accept e-Readers, that junior personnel are using them to keep publications on them so they look Regulation and Manual as needed. Some people who don't like to have bullshit called on them, well always hate them, because a good share of the time, they try to enforce what they believe the regulation states, and not what the regulation states. Much like many who quote what the Constitution states and how it suppose be applied in the real world. When you go back read it, and find what they are taking about, you see they have a major malfunction of what they understand.

Yes, Cell Phone for a large part, when in the field or deployment should be locked one locker until they get shore leave/out of the field/back from deployment. E-Readers or Tablet are better source, you not tempted to keep it your pocket in the field, you can still send text messages with most tablets, and still have your manuals where you can get to them. Not the best compromise, but feasible one for all purposes at this time.

PV2 Abbott Shaull I totally agree. On my last ship, literally, the CO, XO, all DH's and CMC (me) had portable laptops issued. they were great for what they were in 1992, but wow, were they heavy but today's standards. No real internet access, but intranet on the ship so we could swap information and get into ships information systems (even classified ones). everything was PW protected and we were responsible for any loss or leaks (never happened).

However these were not in the hands of the average Sailor and were way to expensive to be issued en masse. Todays tablets would do the same job at a fraction of the cost. My Kindle HDX 8.9 is great for so much more than just reading. MY Toshiba Click is a true Tablet, with computer attached also when needed at less than $500.00. Technology is advancing so rapidly and the military is very slow to keep up that it seems easier to ban than to invest. More out of the box thinking is sorely needed.

Yes, my wife has Tablet and Kindle Fire HDX due to the volume of books she reads, she speed reader. Like I said, too many people want to be way too 'connected'. I am sorry, spouses, and significant others need to be able to take care of things while the other is away. It one of those things that always has been an issue with many relationship with a person in the Military and them being in one of many problems that go along with it. Like the story goes, if they wanted you to have wife/husband/gf/bf, they would of issued you one.

Yes with the prices of things, yes in the near future hopefully, it may come reality, where such things may become standard issue as the Kindle HDX or similar device. Like I said it gives you enough power and enough feature to do what you want too, but limits you enough not to be too dangerous to yourself or your command without having to put some effort into it.

Yes, I bet those portable laptop...Built like Lead brick shithouse. With all kidding aside, they were built to be rugged, and take a beating. I bet the next generations that comes along will likely not be much lighter either, to ensure durability. Just saying.

Like I said, I was in before laptops were widely or that face desktop were widely issued, but into today Military everyone has their various devices. For better or worse, as we move forward.