Posted on Jul 15, 2017
Should direct commission officers (Med, JAG, etc) be required to learn skills such as marksmanship and land navigation when commissioning?
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Coming from the enlisted side, I personally feel that we are all Soldiers 1st (or Marines, Sailors, Airmen) and that we all need at least a basic level of proficiency and some form of "basic training" should be required for all new Officers. I had a conversation with some folks who don't believe that limited duty officers need this type or training unless they are perhaps assigned to a line unit.
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 16
Personally this is one area I feel Marines do better than any other branch. Regardless of their job, they have a better baseline of skills. The best medical officers I served with in the Army were the ones that had a desire to learn more and be better because they wore the uniform. I had a PA overseas that would hang out with us enlisted guys who wanted to learn map reading, how to use a DAGR, field strip his M4. His reasoning was very sound. He didn't understand why us enlisted practiced these skills so proficiently to become memory, that he as an officer over us wasn't required to learn.
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We had several officers that went through land nav. with us EM's.
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I'd say so. I'd imagine this falls under Basic warrior skills needed for every Soldier, regardless of job. There is likely to be an AR or similar publication that governs this. I know as an Army weather support Airman, we have yearly training requirements by the Army that ALL have to be trained to go to the field and deploy as a weapon system. Call us nerds all you want, but the Staff Weather Office that goes to the field or deploys with their Army counterpart, is a weapon system. Army leadership in that unit will understand that and agree. Anywho, back to the point, I'd say yes they should be. Heck, if the Air Force is required to do so when supporting the Army, why wouldn't their own service hold their own Soldiers to the same set of basic standards?
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For the most part, if you're going to be in the mix, you'll need those skills. However, they system works hard to keep these assets away from situations that would require them. It's a business (time, money, return) decision. In my case, I was a prior ENL Navy (not taught at Boot) but going into the Seabees, the secondary school pushed those basics on us. So when push comes to shove, you focus your limited warfighter training assets on the actual warfighters.
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I believe they should learn the basics. Being in the JAG Corps we have dual professions, the profession of being a Soldier and the profession of law. Being a Soldier comes first and foremost. I feel it should be this way with every MOS series though. We have different crafts but at the end of the day we are still Soldiers and must be able to do the basics.
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Yes, you never know the situation you'll be in. Especially with the kind of warfare we have now, what are you going to do if the convoy gets hit while you're en route to another location? You pick up your weapon and fight. We don't have front lines anymore, and I know some people will get butt hurt about well that's what we have Combat Arms for or the Combat Arms guys will get butt hurt about us training for combat situations. That's a plan to fail mentality, and that gets people killed.
We have our various jobs that we have to be proficient at, but we need to train for and remember the basics of combat for the what if scenarios. How to call in a 9 line, how to do land nav, how to do basic first aid if the Medic isn't there, how to do BRM. We go home, or they do needs to be in our minds.
We have our various jobs that we have to be proficient at, but we need to train for and remember the basics of combat for the what if scenarios. How to call in a 9 line, how to do land nav, how to do basic first aid if the Medic isn't there, how to do BRM. We go home, or they do needs to be in our minds.
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Our Chaplain when I was with the 2/502 Chaplain (CPT Hennesly I believe was his name) got selected to go to SF and be a GP Chaplain, he refused to wear the beret until he had finished Q course. He was graduating while I was at Jackson going through reclass, so I headed up for his graduation, (Made the Commandants list from what I remember) In his words, "I will not try to minister to men whom I have not training equivalent with" Last I saw him, he was bucking for Ranger School and Scuba schools, but had his tab / beret, Airborne and AASLT wings. One of the best Chaplains I have ever met in or out of the service.
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Only if they value their lives. If you don't know the rules you shouldn't be there.
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I am an AMEDD officer and shooting enthusiast I have thought for a longtime AMEDD either needs to shoot a lot more or not at all. Once a year for PROFIS & TO&E, none for TDA is a joke. I went to Afghanistan with an A2 20" barrel, what the hell is a nurse going to do with a 20" barrel? I will absolutely never shoot a rifle in combat for distance and rare in close quarters. We should never carry anything longer than a 16" barrel and that is easily effective to 100m. The AR platform is a complicated platform and AMEDD would be better with M14 with a 16" SOCOM barrel.; fewer parts to take apart and lose and without the complicated gas system. Worst case scenario, a nurse could use it as a club. Land nav as we do it, hell no. I am a private pilot and if I screw up, I die. That being said, I do not need to do grids down to 100m and being able to will not keep me from getting lost. Do all need to be able to read a map, absolutely and every officer on a convoy needs to know where we are at and where we are going as at any moment I could be in charge. We would be better served to identify direct commission officers that want to shoot and not require it for all as this is a safety issue. Those that don't want to learn a map, well you should never be allowed to drive more than 50miles from home installation because even in CONUS we would lose you...
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I would say that there is no need for a nurse to have a rifle a side arm would be much better for all non combat arms officers.
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SSG (Join to see) - When traveling by jeep or chopper it might not hurt for a few female nursing officers to have been proficient with M16 / M60 in my generation. It would have made no sense for many nurses but it would have made sense on occasion. As far as the 1911 I ended up borrowing from men when I needed to deal with very badly behaved visitors who refused to follow my orders or hospital policies. Warmest Regards, Sandy :)
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