Posted on Nov 25, 2013
Should Soldiers receive some type of compensation for having a degree?
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Posted 12 y ago
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I think the Army (speaking for Soldiers only) has compensated immensely as they are footing the bill for us to go to school. I believe that is enough for me and asking for compensation for having a degree could come off as wanting more than what we've already been given.
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SFC Todd,
Soldiers, Officers particularly are not paid to have a degree. They are paid based on their responsibility (Usually). At the end of the day it is that Officer that is responsible for the unit. That responsibility for mission, men and equipment at ever increasing levels is what creates a pay gap. As I said on another discussion, I have a Masters Degree, which educationally puts me up there with the average Major, but the Army is not going to pay me extra to bridge the gap between Company Grade Officers and Field Grade Officers, nor should they. I am a 1LT and I get the pay commiserate with my level of responsibility.
That is my disagreement with you. For the record, I didn't vote you down. I think people get a little crazy with that DOWN vote.
Soldiers, Officers particularly are not paid to have a degree. They are paid based on their responsibility (Usually). At the end of the day it is that Officer that is responsible for the unit. That responsibility for mission, men and equipment at ever increasing levels is what creates a pay gap. As I said on another discussion, I have a Masters Degree, which educationally puts me up there with the average Major, but the Army is not going to pay me extra to bridge the gap between Company Grade Officers and Field Grade Officers, nor should they. I am a 1LT and I get the pay commiserate with my level of responsibility.
That is my disagreement with you. For the record, I didn't vote you down. I think people get a little crazy with that DOWN vote.
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Why? Didn't the Army already pay for you to get that degree?
If otherwise qualified, that Soldier can apply for an officer producing program.
If otherwise qualified, that Soldier can apply for an officer producing program.
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SFC McKinley, I don't believe so. The Army already pays a substantial amount of money through the GI Bill, Tuition Assistance, the Student Loan Repayment Program offered as a bonus, and easy credits through degree programs tailored to specific career fields. I try to take a business outlook on it, which leads me to ask what the Army receives from soldiers going to school without the intent of taking a leadership position (i.e. commissioning.)
Personally, I think soldiers using Tuition Assistance should incur the same service obligation that ROTC students do: every year of using Tuition Assistance should incur another year of obligatory service.
Personally, I think soldiers using Tuition Assistance should incur the same service obligation that ROTC students do: every year of using Tuition Assistance should incur another year of obligatory service.
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SGT William B.
Sir,
Haha, I probably did. I'm sure that a couple years in the future, when I'm a crusty, mean SGT looking to finish a degree and transition to the civilian world, I just know that I'm going to regret inserting my foot into my fourth point of contact so deeply.
Haha, I probably did. I'm sure that a couple years in the future, when I'm a crusty, mean SGT looking to finish a degree and transition to the civilian world, I just know that I'm going to regret inserting my foot into my fourth point of contact so deeply.
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LTC Joseph Gross
I disagree. TAP is a benefit you have earned by virtue of your service. You want to turn it around and say it is something you don't deserve and by using it you owe the military more. Soldiers get little enough use out of the TAP that we don't need to add more stipulations and requirements. What I would like to see is ROTC scholarship students owing more time than they currently do and USMA cadets owing much more time. My sixteen weeks at OCS cost me three years of obligated time, no big deal because who doesn't want to stay at least three after OCS. An ROTC Scholarship student might get two to four years of free education and owes four years. A West Pointer gets the best education in the US and only owes five...
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PO1 B. Kieth Cooper
SPC(C) I have to disagree on the service incurment issue. If a enlisted person uses TA while serving they are already pay the debt. A ROTC is in school and not serving active service. If the military sends the individual to school and away from a serving command then yes they should inccur more time to pay back te expenditure of the military.
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SGT William B.
I think I understand the validity of what you're saying both saying. In my eyes, and in my relatively shallow experiences, I have always been told that TA is a privilege, and not a right. Without the TA Program being offered specifically as a guaranteed perk of signing an enlistment contract (much like you would see amendments to the contract for the GI Bill, Student Loan Repayment, etc), I can't definitively state that soldiers absolutely deserve that right. Don't get me wrong: I believe in higher education, and I absolutely believe that any man or woman that puts their name on the dotted line should have the right to pursue it as evenly as those who didn't. I just can't see it being an economically sustainable program when the military already spends so much money on other benefits and programs (perhaps if we would get smart and stop funding silly weaponry projects that cost us billions of dollars over decades while leaving us nothing in return, this wouldn't be an issue for me.)
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There already is compensation program in place, it's called Promotion Points.
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No. Being a prior service Soldier - I knew what I was getting myself into when I enlisted back in the day. I also knew that I was entitled to the MGIB & Tuition Assistance to get some college knocked out When you signed your enlistment contract - was there a clause in there that stated "if you get your degree, you will receive an extra $$X per month"? Don't think so. I loved being an NCO - but applied for a Green-to-Gold Scholarship and received one, in order to better provide for my family in the long term.
If you are of the opinion that you should get paid more money just because you have a degree - become a WO or Officer. Plenty of opportunities to do so. If you don't want to do that - then accept the facts of life as they are and be proud of yourself for putting in the extra effort to better yourself by advancing your education.
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As a staff sergeant with a master's degree, yes. For those that say "that's why we have officers", you either don't have a degree or you don't value the amount of education you have. I feel that I should be paid more. The reason I'm not an officer is because I LOVE BEING AN NCO!
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LTC Joseph Gross
Unfortunately the Army doesn't work that way. Chances are your degree, while it makes you a better person and a better NCO, it is not directly related to your job. No doubt it helped you get promoted sooner and possibly it helps your job, but unless you want to gain a commission, it isn't benefiting the Army that much.
If I could addrss SSG Hardy, I appreciate that so many people like to rant about how little we are paid, but to say we don't get minimum wage is not true. When you include all the benefits and additional pays we receive, we are very well compensated for what we do. And that is coming from someone who enlisted as an E-2 in 1985 with a wife and a child. That is comparing Apples to Apples. Comparing only base pay to what civilians receive is Apples to Oranges. Especially with Obamacare, we can easily see that civilians are paying thousands for health care and we get that free. Then there are all the other pays.
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LTC (Join to see)
SSG Gray,
And you knew this going in…and still decided to better yourself by getting your Master's Degree on your own time. I applaud you for that…however, the Army does not owe you more money just because you did so.
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CPT (Join to see)
It's good that you love being an NCO, there are thousands who give up doing what they love for more money. It is a choice the individual has to make. Do what you love most, or get paid what you feel you deserve.
I'm lucky because I love being an Officer, and think my pay is pretty decent, especially in terms of retirement.
I'm lucky because I love being an Officer, and think my pay is pretty decent, especially in terms of retirement.
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SFC (Join to see)
I have thought quite a bit since my original response, and I agree that we should not expect to get extra compensation for our degree(s). The Army paid TA for my degree (BS in IT), though I had to pay for my Master's. That was compensation. And, as a Reservist now, my degrees have helped me secure a good job in IT, as a contractor supporting the AF. I have no complaints. I thank you all for making me really think about what I expect as compensation from the Army.
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SFC McKinley, I believe that you do by getting promotions faster. Getting my degree is what is holding me back from getting promoted.
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CPT (Join to see)
MSG Cunningham,
He is probably referring to the promotion points available to E-5's for having a civilian degree.
He is probably referring to the promotion points available to E-5's for having a civilian degree.
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LTC (Join to see)
You do get promoted faster on both the officer and enlisted side depending on your degree type.
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LTC Joseph Gross
I would assume SGT Sanderson has maxed out all areas of the promotion points except civilian education.
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Yes, for the most part we are called - wait for it - 'officers' - and generally, the pay, billets. and chow is better . . .
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I think it's interesting to get the different point of views that other SM have when it comes to this issue. I had a Soldier who had earned his degree, but due to the Army changing requirements for OCS, was unable to apply. Now that Soldier is stuck with a degree and want to get paid for his hard work. What a lot of people fail to realize is that getting a degree in the military and staying enlisted may get you a promotion, but the pay increase is so little compared to officers pay increases and what you could earn in the civilian world based of the credentials you have. Thanks for everyone's response.
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CPT (Join to see)
SFC Keith,
I agree that many will seek a degree to become eligible for OCS. If they are not selected, then they may see it as an afront to the hardwork that they put in to getting the degree.
They have to realize, that the bachelor's degree is one of many qualifications in order to apply to OCS. Age, citizenship, GT score, physical profile, etc qualifications also must be met. If all qualifications are met, then they still must be selected against their peers as the best qualified to attend.
It's more than just a degree. I do understand that it is like hitting a moving target with the changing requirements, but just because they have the degree does not entitle them to instantly be selected for OCS.
I feel that anyone earning a degree needs to see it for what it is: an education. They need to study what interests them and understand that it is not a golden ticket. It just helps when combined with hard-work and other qualifications.
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No because you already do, that is what tuition assistance and the MGIB is.
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