Posted on Dec 10, 2015
SGT Training Room Nco
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Posted in these groups: Height and weight logo Height and WeightBilde AR 600-9
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SP6 Dustin Devlin
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I am a former marine and just recently out of the army reserve, i believe if you pass your pt test tape should not matter. I was taped for my whole career
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SSG Gregg Mourizen
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I have a lot of negatives for the Army High and weight standards. First, It counts way too much towards promotion. I have seen many, many incompetent and or incapable people put into leadership positions, who have enough trouble keeping themselves in line, let alone being responsible for others. Often, while more capable and competent soldiers are passed over du to not making points or meeting weight standards. Leadership depends on far more than just how many push ups or sit ups you can do, or how fast you can run. How can a PT test be worth more for promotion than Education, Training, Relevant work experience and performance records?
Yes, without a doubt, fitness is important. But as mentioned in many of these postings, GOOD and CAPABLE soldiers are put out to pasture due to their weight, without regard to their importance to unit or mission. I have seen many hard working soldiers passed over for awards or promotions, just by where their percentages lay. I have seen units suffer huge capability losses due to weight control pushing key solders out. The difference between a good hard working soldier and a SH*T-bag are often determined by a tenth of a percent. Very little effort is made to try to bring these soldier into compliance other than pushing them towards eating disorders and poor moral. I myself worked out daily, when time and mission permitted. I was eating far less that is considered healthy (less than 1000 calories per day). It wasn't until my third try to se a dietician that not eating enough was actually contributing to my weight problem. What is worse, is having to listen to people with no knowledge of healthy weight loss techniques, often having never experienced a weight problem themselves and with poor eating habits of their own.
I rode the line for many years, often seeing up to a 5% weight difference between tape measurements, with no way to dispute the measurements or even be allow to have one of the alternate, more accurate, methods even being considered. Myself and many others suffered through many injuries to try to meet the standards for no recognition.
Even though I might not have been able to run as fast as some of my peers, I more often than not could carry much larger loads over longer distances than most of them. My skills ratings where always at the top of the charts. Yet, I saw many PT studs get promoted, when there were many others more deserving of the position.
So yes, the weight control program needs to massively revamped.
An accurate measurement process needs to be used (Calipers, dunk tank, using more measuring points).
More relevance needs to be pushed towards actual leadership skills and traits than just physical fitness.
More effort needs to be made towards fixing a good soldier rather than just trying to replace him/her with a newer skinnier model. All that experience and training should be worth something.
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SSG Healthcare Specialist (Combat Medic)
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Yes! The "tape test" that is still used today has been vetted by multiple universities and health facilities and had been proven to be the least accurate way of measuring a person's body fat.
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SPC John Gifford
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There needs to be a weight limit. I have noticed, that the higher the rank, the bigger the waist
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SGT Lawrence Corser
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Sure, just enforcement of it in the ranks is a bigger problem. During deployments and memes you see online there are a lot of very out of regulation people in the Army. Now not as tight in some areas, because I was always on the program but passed tape even with a small neck.
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SFC Garry Kolberg
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Quality soldiers are let out because of a couple inches or pounds while below average soldiers are allowed to stay in because of being under the standards set. Standards set 25 years ago no longer fit the standards of today. It should be adjusted at least every 5 years. But, we must all remember that we were or are a part of the team that has to work together, to depend on each other and it is our responsibility to maintain our bodies to an acceptable standard that will not be a detriment to that team. It probably wouldn't be considered fair but maybe H&W Standards should by set by MOS's.
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SSG Delanda Hunt
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Yes I think its about time to allow Midgets and Leprechauns in the Military, they have a lot to offer and only need half the food and clothing. Big Momma should also have a chance to plug up holes in a navy ship. Since standards are being lowered we might as well take it to another level.
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SSG Gregg Mourizen
SSG Gregg Mourizen
>1 y
You say is sarcastically, but why shouldn't a midget be allowed to serve? They can fit into spaces a normal sized person couldn't even dream of. Imagine what they could do for maintenance teams, engineers, damage control (for our water borne friends).
Sadley the H/W standard would be impossible for them to meet, and don't get me started on run times.
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SGT Human Intelligence Collector
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There are machines that can scan one's full body to determine their Body Fat Content rating. The only problem is that they are not portable and most likely expensive but they do have them.
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COL John Power
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It probably is time to revisit the standards, but there will always be those that aren't satisfied. The common thread of complaint I've read is that one who passes the PT test but fails the measurements is in trouble. The PT Test should prevail and perhaps it should be a more difficult test to measure true combat readiness. But then some folks are in MOS that don't require the "full battle rattle" of the infantry. Should they take a different test? Would that be fair? And then some will complain that the test isn't fair; not properly administered, etc. I recall a call I received from a young soldier when I was an IG. He complained that some six months after his medical exemption ended he was being required to take a PT test and it wasn't being fairly administered. I offered to come to his unit and take the test with him to be sure the NCO administering the test was fair. I also suggested that even as a 52-year old Colonel I'd probably beat his numbers. He hung up!
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SSG Audwin Scott
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I say yes it should! As a former training NCO, I saw many fit soldiers that just didn't meet the Armies height and weight standards. Often times the females that were blessed in more respectful terms in certain areas were penalized for having body fat that just came naturally to them. I understand the purpose of the height and weight standard is to prepare each soldier to be fit to fight but in some cases there should be exceptions to the rules.
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MAJ Contracting Officer
MAJ (Join to see)
10 y
Height and weight is irrelevant in the Army natural blessings are not factored into the tape test which is the score that matters. 30+% is a large margin for obesity.
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SSG Audwin Scott
SSG Audwin Scott
10 y
MAJ (Join to see) - good point.
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SPC Tanya Beaver
SPC Tanya Beaver
10 y
Weight is factored into the female tape test. As are hips. Neither of these things are measured on the males. I say again, fitness standards only. No weight.
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