5
5
0
I have read a lot about sociology and often thought of its impact on us all. Societal norms are ever changing and are geographically based. Ever more paradigms shift to realign with what is really a perverted version of empowerment, or more like what they may think it is.
To break it down a bit. Some groups in society are developing a sub culture in where they redefine their own values and standards even though they may be counter to what is held to the common American.
Trampling on the flag of the United States of American has never been commonly accepted. Yet now there is a some sort of challenge to where it is urged to do so. The reasons behind it don't really make much sense but as I stated before they are altering and redefining what the flag stands for.
How do we deal with this. I wish we could charge them with a crime but that is not illegal. By promoting this conduct it will only be more and more common. Is there anything that can be done?
To break it down a bit. Some groups in society are developing a sub culture in where they redefine their own values and standards even though they may be counter to what is held to the common American.
Trampling on the flag of the United States of American has never been commonly accepted. Yet now there is a some sort of challenge to where it is urged to do so. The reasons behind it don't really make much sense but as I stated before they are altering and redefining what the flag stands for.
How do we deal with this. I wish we could charge them with a crime but that is not illegal. By promoting this conduct it will only be more and more common. Is there anything that can be done?
Society
Culture
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 30
16
16
0
Ignorance is bliss.....and bliss is ignorance.....will we lose our country without a shot being fired because it is someone's right to come in and take it?
We have to make some changes in our society, drastic changes, we cannot continue on the way we are headed. If we fail to act, we will simply give our country away....our founding fathers would be ashamed at the fallacy that is our democratic society that exist today. Too many do too little and expect too damned much for absolutely frickin nothing!
We have to make some changes in our society, drastic changes, we cannot continue on the way we are headed. If we fail to act, we will simply give our country away....our founding fathers would be ashamed at the fallacy that is our democratic society that exist today. Too many do too little and expect too damned much for absolutely frickin nothing!
(16)
(0)
SPC Charles Brown
Ah yes, CSM Michael J. Uhlig, the entitlement generation rears it's ugly head yet again. Great response, I wholly concur.
(0)
(0)
15
15
0
So by all rights, I can wave a huge American flag and hold a sign saying "try to step on this one." Would that be considered trying to incite a riot? Why do I have the feeling that I would be at fault when things get out of control and I would be the instigator? I would also like to apologize for being white, which clearly makes me a member of this "white supremacy." Forgive me, but my "supremeness" needs to go back to counting my millions and twisting my mustache and think of the next way I can keep oppressing the masses. Haters gotta hate. Try putting on a uniform and standing a post and seeing how he rest of the world really is. You'll be picking that flag off of the ground with a super maga-f'n quickness! I'm wasting my time trying to think logically with people who believe that the way to solve this issue is to desecrate the American flag and blame "the man." That is an impressive solution regarding social reform. Then again, the way things are going, we will end up paying them $15 an hour to step on the flag because they aren't employed. Be a part of the solution and take that cell phone and take pictures of yourself cleaning up around your neighborhood or other positive steps.
(15)
(0)
SPC Charles Brown
SFC Mark Merino
My hat, so to speak goes off to you. wonderful comment and I am jealous that you got there with it before I could come up with something similar.
Respects
C.
My hat, so to speak goes off to you. wonderful comment and I am jealous that you got there with it before I could come up with something similar.
Respects
C.
(1)
(0)
MSgt Joseph DuPont
Vote in a new president and DOJ who do not buy into the liberal BS of certain minority groups being victims, and refuse to hold people accountable.
(0)
(0)
7
7
0
The first thing we need to do is recognize there is a problem. While that may sound like a "cop out", it needs to be stated. It is far too easy for those watching these actions unfold to throw up defensive barriers and cry out in exasperation "Why are *they* doing this?"
I believe everyone deserves the benefit of the doubt, and using that baseline, I must conclude that those protesting honestly feel that they are being mistreated. If I view it from the simplistic lens of "*they* just want to loot and get free stuff" or "*they're* stepping on a symbol that I fought for, and therefore *they* are not worth listening to" then I become part of the problem they seem to be decrying.
So I must first recognize a problem exists. Then I have to think to myself, "What would cause me to take to the streets in anger?" As a rational, semi-intelligent person, it'd take a lot to push me out into the streets against my neighbors, protectors, and country. However, I signed up for the military because I wanted to fight injustice that could harm my family, and by extension my world. That was an easy rational decision that each of us in uniform made.
So these protesters are stepping on the flag, and if we assume they are rational people, then it is because they feel like injustice has been done to them specifically by the country whose flag they are stepping on. They must fear harm will come to their family, and by extension, their world.
Here is where the problem reveals itself. Rationally speaking, you don't harm yourself. If you are going to bring harm to someone, it will be someone who is opposed to your way of life or preventing what you want to accomplish. These protesters must believe that if the US is harming them, it is because they stand in opposition to what the US wants to accomplish. Once again, since rational things don't hurt themselves, these protesters are basically saying "we are a culture that is separate and distinct, and our culture is being oppressed by the culture of the United States, because we stand in its way". Or, in other words, "We are not Americans".
So, what can be done? We need to create an "American culture" that binds us all together. For decades now we have broken our unified culture apart, holding certain sub-cultures up in the spotlight of the media as more or less important than others. We have split ourselves along racial, political, and religious lines. We have closed the ranks of our sub-cultures and created an environment where one culture can clash against another even in the heart of the same geographic location.
We need unity, and that starts with reaching out to someone who doesn't look or think like you, who doesn't match your sub-culture, and having a freaking conversation with them. Maybe soon enough we'll realize that our culture, our unifying American culture, hasn't really gone anywhere. Its been here all along... branded into our souls, framed in the constitution, and perpetually protected by an all-volunteer military. Tear down the sub-cultures; find our commonality in seeking true justice. It will start with each of us.
I believe everyone deserves the benefit of the doubt, and using that baseline, I must conclude that those protesting honestly feel that they are being mistreated. If I view it from the simplistic lens of "*they* just want to loot and get free stuff" or "*they're* stepping on a symbol that I fought for, and therefore *they* are not worth listening to" then I become part of the problem they seem to be decrying.
So I must first recognize a problem exists. Then I have to think to myself, "What would cause me to take to the streets in anger?" As a rational, semi-intelligent person, it'd take a lot to push me out into the streets against my neighbors, protectors, and country. However, I signed up for the military because I wanted to fight injustice that could harm my family, and by extension my world. That was an easy rational decision that each of us in uniform made.
So these protesters are stepping on the flag, and if we assume they are rational people, then it is because they feel like injustice has been done to them specifically by the country whose flag they are stepping on. They must fear harm will come to their family, and by extension, their world.
Here is where the problem reveals itself. Rationally speaking, you don't harm yourself. If you are going to bring harm to someone, it will be someone who is opposed to your way of life or preventing what you want to accomplish. These protesters must believe that if the US is harming them, it is because they stand in opposition to what the US wants to accomplish. Once again, since rational things don't hurt themselves, these protesters are basically saying "we are a culture that is separate and distinct, and our culture is being oppressed by the culture of the United States, because we stand in its way". Or, in other words, "We are not Americans".
So, what can be done? We need to create an "American culture" that binds us all together. For decades now we have broken our unified culture apart, holding certain sub-cultures up in the spotlight of the media as more or less important than others. We have split ourselves along racial, political, and religious lines. We have closed the ranks of our sub-cultures and created an environment where one culture can clash against another even in the heart of the same geographic location.
We need unity, and that starts with reaching out to someone who doesn't look or think like you, who doesn't match your sub-culture, and having a freaking conversation with them. Maybe soon enough we'll realize that our culture, our unifying American culture, hasn't really gone anywhere. Its been here all along... branded into our souls, framed in the constitution, and perpetually protected by an all-volunteer military. Tear down the sub-cultures; find our commonality in seeking true justice. It will start with each of us.
(7)
(0)
5
5
0
5
5
0
"...a perverted version of empowerment" - through creation of shared victimhood and the entitlement mindset purportedly designed to "correct" the "injustice." In reality, this remedy invokes voluntary subjugation of free will / critical thinking in exchange for a life-long reliance on those who are "protecting" the victims from further victimization.
It's control, pure and simple. Serfdom. Slavery of a sort. Tyranny...
"Liberty cannot be preserved without general knowledge among the people."
- John Adams
It's control, pure and simple. Serfdom. Slavery of a sort. Tyranny...
"Liberty cannot be preserved without general knowledge among the people."
- John Adams
(5)
(0)
CPT (Join to see)
I completely agree with you. This is something that is projected on many as a means of subjugation. Once they are rallied up they will fight for just about anything.
(0)
(0)
3
3
0
Stupid is as stupid does, Mrs. Blue...
Mrs. Blue: Are you crazy? Or just plain stupid? Forrest Gump: Stupid is as stupid does, Mrs. Blue. Mrs Blue: I guess.
Even Forrest had the smarts to know it when he saw it. It never ceases to amaze me how anti-government some folks are, as they demand their constitutional rights to spit on the constitution. Their rights seem to trump everyone else's rights. The land of the entitled.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJe6-afGz0Q
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJe6-afGz0Q
(3)
(0)
TSgt Christopher D.
For what it's worth, Jefferson believed there should be a 'revolution' of sorts about once every 20 years.
(2)
(0)
3
3
0
I was wondering the same thing. How do we stop this? I think that class conflict has been something that's been ignored in our country. This movement can evolve into far more worse than flag stomping. That's what I worry about. What's next?
There's so much disparity between races that it's almost a repeat of history. There are so many factors behind flag stomping. I know it isn't right but the specific group feels as if the country continues to betray them and they are reacting.
Ultimately, in some cases subcultures are forced to be whom they are by circumstance.
This is a great topic and I'd like to see more opinions from the active members of this site. Definitely thought stimulating.
There's so much disparity between races that it's almost a repeat of history. There are so many factors behind flag stomping. I know it isn't right but the specific group feels as if the country continues to betray them and they are reacting.
Ultimately, in some cases subcultures are forced to be whom they are by circumstance.
This is a great topic and I'd like to see more opinions from the active members of this site. Definitely thought stimulating.
(3)
(0)
CPT (Join to see)
This something that irritates me to no end. My father came to the US spoke not a lick of English and became a successful person with a great paying job. He is well off to say the least. I have seen my peers complain that they are getting screwed meanwhile I joined the military. I have a good job, house, family, and two nice cars. After I have achieved this I see some of my former peers still saying the same thing how they are getting screwed. My mind is blown by this.
I didn't come from well off family. I had to go everything on my own, to include college. It was not easy but I did it. One of my most enlightening, or dimming, experience was when I worked at WalMart. I was an Assistant Manager. I was never an Hourly Associate. I was salaried and made a very nice wage plus bonuses. I would deal with hourly associates that made substantially less and they would cast me as the Rich Guy that grew with with a silver spoon in my mouth. I would speak with them about this to gain more of an insight. Some of them were my age. They knew I was well paid but that is why I worked for it. They didn't see the struggle I put in. They only saw my success. They thought I was handed it and somehow that because I was white enough I was just handed a good paying job. I told them of my tours in Iraq and my time going to school and working a full time job while being married but they just though I was handed my degree.
The issue is that they only struggle to get by. I struggled to succeed. They are not the same. They thought they were but when your goal is to go to the club and hook up and you hope you have enough money to buy drinks you really aren't setting your goals high at all. My goals were much more. As a PFC that joined the Army 4 days after high school because I knew I had no other way to pay for college I put in my time. But still they thought I was handed everything. I recall one did realize what I have done. I spoke to him about my time overseas and he was grateful for my service. He realized what I did and thought I should be afforded the opportunity I was given. Still most of them saw me as another Rich White Guy.
I didn't come from well off family. I had to go everything on my own, to include college. It was not easy but I did it. One of my most enlightening, or dimming, experience was when I worked at WalMart. I was an Assistant Manager. I was never an Hourly Associate. I was salaried and made a very nice wage plus bonuses. I would deal with hourly associates that made substantially less and they would cast me as the Rich Guy that grew with with a silver spoon in my mouth. I would speak with them about this to gain more of an insight. Some of them were my age. They knew I was well paid but that is why I worked for it. They didn't see the struggle I put in. They only saw my success. They thought I was handed it and somehow that because I was white enough I was just handed a good paying job. I told them of my tours in Iraq and my time going to school and working a full time job while being married but they just though I was handed my degree.
The issue is that they only struggle to get by. I struggled to succeed. They are not the same. They thought they were but when your goal is to go to the club and hook up and you hope you have enough money to buy drinks you really aren't setting your goals high at all. My goals were much more. As a PFC that joined the Army 4 days after high school because I knew I had no other way to pay for college I put in my time. But still they thought I was handed everything. I recall one did realize what I have done. I spoke to him about my time overseas and he was grateful for my service. He realized what I did and thought I should be afforded the opportunity I was given. Still most of them saw me as another Rich White Guy.
(3)
(0)
MSgt (Join to see)
Thank you CPT (Join to see) for sharing your families experience. I'm sorry SrA (Join to see) but your argument of "in some cases subcultures are forced to be whom they are by circumstance" holds no water in the year 2015. This country has become too reliant on government subsidies and therefore have grown too lazy to what Lt. Rosa and countless others have done, and that is to make something of themselves, and leave the pity party in the past! I don't give a hoot if you're black, white, brown, or whatever the hell other color you can find...people have to put forth a little effort if they want to be rewarded. If not...you tell me how this country will end up.
(1)
(0)
SrA (Join to see)
MSgt (Join to see) Unless you've been through each and every individual's struggle there's no way you can make that call or even think in that fashion. It's indeed very humorous to see that age nor rank instantaneously gives a person this heightened sense of awareness. If you carefully read my statement, you would've noted that I specifically placed "IN SOME CASES" for this exact reason. People easily misconstrue ideals, piss people off and derail the whole conversation just because they failed to read carefully. Thank you for that.
In regards to this country, there's an abundance of ISSUES that we just turn the cheek to, resulting in the debilitating state our people are in. It's as if you're speaking like there's no discrimination present and shit just doesn't happen anymore. Oh but wait, it's 2015 so disregard what I just said.
When it comes to struggle, I'm very familiar with it. I was raised in The Bronx, exposed to drugs, poverty, violence and all that's dark. I had a troubled upbringing, mostly due to my egocentricity and unruliness. I went straight to the Marines after HS cause I knew I'd either end up dead or incarcerated. It's safe to say that I am well versed when it comes to these kind of issues because of my personal experiences and my studies. I completed my service with the Marines and pursued my Bachelor's Degree and a couple of other minor degrees. I earned mines and I understand the fundamentals of putting forth a substantial amount of effort to seek your goals.
YET, it still doesn't account for all of the citizens whom are struck by misfortune no matter how much effort they put forth. When shit is destined for you, it'll come to you no matter how far you are. I'm not blind nor stupid and I know that discrimination still exists. It does hinder people from succeeding in life because I've seen it myself. You think because an employer states they don't discriminate, that it's actually true?
Our country and people have made progress and issues aren't as heavy as they were decades ago, I'll give you that. There's certain systems within the government whom are not solely there for the citizen's benefit, and I'd even go so far to say that they're only hurting us. Systems like education, prison, criminal justice and corporate america can be used as strong examples.
In final aspect, just because people have dealt with IT or PERSEVERED doesn't mean the obstacles or barriers should remain in place or that they don't exist.
In regards to this country, there's an abundance of ISSUES that we just turn the cheek to, resulting in the debilitating state our people are in. It's as if you're speaking like there's no discrimination present and shit just doesn't happen anymore. Oh but wait, it's 2015 so disregard what I just said.
When it comes to struggle, I'm very familiar with it. I was raised in The Bronx, exposed to drugs, poverty, violence and all that's dark. I had a troubled upbringing, mostly due to my egocentricity and unruliness. I went straight to the Marines after HS cause I knew I'd either end up dead or incarcerated. It's safe to say that I am well versed when it comes to these kind of issues because of my personal experiences and my studies. I completed my service with the Marines and pursued my Bachelor's Degree and a couple of other minor degrees. I earned mines and I understand the fundamentals of putting forth a substantial amount of effort to seek your goals.
YET, it still doesn't account for all of the citizens whom are struck by misfortune no matter how much effort they put forth. When shit is destined for you, it'll come to you no matter how far you are. I'm not blind nor stupid and I know that discrimination still exists. It does hinder people from succeeding in life because I've seen it myself. You think because an employer states they don't discriminate, that it's actually true?
Our country and people have made progress and issues aren't as heavy as they were decades ago, I'll give you that. There's certain systems within the government whom are not solely there for the citizen's benefit, and I'd even go so far to say that they're only hurting us. Systems like education, prison, criminal justice and corporate america can be used as strong examples.
In final aspect, just because people have dealt with IT or PERSEVERED doesn't mean the obstacles or barriers should remain in place or that they don't exist.
(0)
(0)
2
2
0
Unfortunately the only way to handle these people is simply not to give them any attention. Yet, it sure not easy to do!
(2)
(0)
2
2
0
First of all give these idiots dictionaries because justice does not equal vengeance or revenge. Two minutes after an incident happens the jury of the court of public opinion has already reached a verdict - how can this be?? White LEO confronts ethnic subject does not equal guilt, does not equate to police brutality and is not a reason to destroy other people's property.
(2)
(0)
2
2
0
CPT (Join to see), Some would have you believe that if we as a nation ignore this behavior it will go away. I am sorry this is not the case. We as service-members/retirees/veterans took an oath to support and defend the Constitution of the United States, among the things we are/were defending is the right for some people to remain ignorant.
Many may have jumped on this band wagon simply because they think it is a cool thing to do. Protests, riots, and other civil actions have always existed in this nation otherwise we would still be colonies of the English. It wasn’t all that many years ago that burning the American flag was unacceptable, now it has become commonplace.
I would like to offer this simple solution;
Find this/these people
Let them pick the flag of any nation, you know, the one with all of the pretty colors
Help them pack
Give them a ticket for a free boat ride
Put them on said boat
Have the captain take them to 50 miles off shore
Throw all their stuff and them over board and tell them to swim the rest of the way to shore and have a nice day.
Just my opinion.
C.
Many may have jumped on this band wagon simply because they think it is a cool thing to do. Protests, riots, and other civil actions have always existed in this nation otherwise we would still be colonies of the English. It wasn’t all that many years ago that burning the American flag was unacceptable, now it has become commonplace.
I would like to offer this simple solution;
Find this/these people
Let them pick the flag of any nation, you know, the one with all of the pretty colors
Help them pack
Give them a ticket for a free boat ride
Put them on said boat
Have the captain take them to 50 miles off shore
Throw all their stuff and them over board and tell them to swim the rest of the way to shore and have a nice day.
Just my opinion.
C.
(2)
(0)
Read This Next
Continue with Facebook 
Continue with Google