Posted on May 17, 2015
The Army's drone pilots are not being trained because they are too busy mowing lawns! Thoughts?
4.88K
46
26
3
3
0
According to a recent GAO report "Army UAS pilots in all of the focus groups we conducted stated that they had difficulty completing UAS pilot training in units because they spend a significant amount of time performing additional duties such as lawn care, janitorial services, and guard duty."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-switch/wp/2015/05/15/the-armys-drone-pilots-dont-get-enough-training-because-theyre-too-busy-mowing-the-lawn/?hpid=z16
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-switch/wp/2015/05/15/the-armys-drone-pilots-dont-get-enough-training-because-theyre-too-busy-mowing-the-lawn/?hpid=z16
Drones
Training
Leadership
Edited >1 y ago
Posted >1 y ago
Responses: 8
To be honest I am pretty disappointed. I would have thought they could have turned a lawn mower into a drone and drove it around the lawn for training. This is the out of the box type of thinking we are missing in the Army.
(10)
(0)
CPT (Join to see)
SPC Jan Allbright, M.Sc., R.S. They would have got that gopher that Bill Murray couldn't.
(1)
(0)
SPC Charles Brown
Yeah, you are right GySgt Wayne A. Ekblad and we all know the military isn't particularly fond of practical in certain situations.
(0)
(0)
SFC Stephen Carden
I think this idea is genius! LOL But then again, we all know that 1LT Rosa ain't your ordinary 1LT!
(1)
(0)
4
4
0
GySgt Wayne A. Ekblad, my first thought was, "Why didn't they also mention doing KP?" Doing area beautification, guard duty, kitchen patrol (KP), cleaning/waxing of floors, pulling staff duty and CQ, etc., are all part of being a Soldier. It's a cost-effective way to get these jobs done, and it also minimizes down time. It's more prevalent in the junior enlisted ranks, but the Senior NCOs have already gone through the rituals and put in their fair share of time waxing floors.
It does cut into training time, but not to the extent that missions can't be accomplished.
It does cut into training time, but not to the extent that missions can't be accomplished.
(4)
(0)
LTC Yinon Weiss
SGT (Join to see) - I wouldn't say those are are traits of being a professional Soldier. I would say those are traits of being a member of the US Army. There's a difference, and it doesn't have to be that way.
(5)
(0)
SFC Stephen Carden
I disagree with LTC Yinon Weiss , respectfully of course. I think all of the "extra duties" that we perform as junior, and sometimes senior, enlisted are an important part of the transition from civilian into professional Soldier. Every task we hated as privates and specialists taught us things like responsibility, attention to detail, time management, leadership, accountability, and professionalism. Development of these traits, some of which aren't learned by the vast majority of Soldiers until they join the military, is vital to the maturation process and professional demeanor that we expect from our NCOs and officers. This isn't summer camp, it's the military. We should take care of our own stuff and save money on contractors. When we talk about lost training time, let's also discuss the 1.5 hour lunches, the early releases, and the ridiculous amount of holidays, four-day weekends, and payday activities that we have that also waste "training time".
(1)
(0)
2
2
0
I can believe it. After working the Army on Bragg for over 3 years, I've seen things like this on more than one occasion.
(2)
(0)
1
1
0
1
1
0
SrA Edward Vong
SPC Jan Allbright, M.Sc., R.S. I believe in the USAF they do wear wings, theirs is just a little different.
(0)
(0)
(2)
(0)
(1)
(0)
1
1
0
That sounds like the Navy with us sending young sailors on the ship to the mess decks or the master-at-arms shack or anywhere needed outside of their division.
But isn't that the military motto anyway? Work more with less?
But isn't that the military motto anyway? Work more with less?
(1)
(0)
PO2 Johnathan Kerns
I did alot of things like this when I was in the Navy. However, it didn't come at the expense of the IT shop. I'm not bad mouthing the Army by any means, just things I've seen.
(1)
(0)
0
0
0
Looking at the article. It mentioned required training time being about 25~ hours per year.
Let me restate that. 25 hrs/year. Normal work WEEK has 40 hours. A year has 52 weeks. If you did 1 hour every OTHER week, you'd be fine.
If we're pulling them away from function so often that they can't get 30 minutes of flight training time per week, there's a #^%$#^ problem.
Now don't get me wrong. I did my share of #%^#% jobs as a PFC, LCpl, Cpl, & Sgt. Today I was at the USMC Historic Half in Fredericksburg, and I saw every rank from PFC through Maj (Quantico is the local base). I get $^&$ details. I have no problem with them. They have to get done, and they have to get done by somebody. Sometimes it's a Col, and sometimes it's a LCpl (most often).
But, if we can't get 1/80th (1.25%) of our time to "basic job related training," we need to rethink out lives.
How is this not being screamed up & down the chain of command, by literally everyone? I had training NCO's on my butt if I didn't MCIs done withing 60 days of them being ordered. They'd lose their mind if I got within 30 days of my PFT or Rifle Qual expiring. How is this any different?
Let me restate that. 25 hrs/year. Normal work WEEK has 40 hours. A year has 52 weeks. If you did 1 hour every OTHER week, you'd be fine.
If we're pulling them away from function so often that they can't get 30 minutes of flight training time per week, there's a #^%$#^ problem.
Now don't get me wrong. I did my share of #%^#% jobs as a PFC, LCpl, Cpl, & Sgt. Today I was at the USMC Historic Half in Fredericksburg, and I saw every rank from PFC through Maj (Quantico is the local base). I get $^&$ details. I have no problem with them. They have to get done, and they have to get done by somebody. Sometimes it's a Col, and sometimes it's a LCpl (most often).
But, if we can't get 1/80th (1.25%) of our time to "basic job related training," we need to rethink out lives.
How is this not being screamed up & down the chain of command, by literally everyone? I had training NCO's on my butt if I didn't MCIs done withing 60 days of them being ordered. They'd lose their mind if I got within 30 days of my PFT or Rifle Qual expiring. How is this any different?
(0)
(0)
Suspended Profile
I think the article was referring to a division between what can be logged as "training" and what is "ops", based on the part where is mentioned that in the AF, flying hours are flying hours. It led me to think the Army won't let pred pilots log "ops" hours as "training", which is stupid because flying is flying.
If the AF was using such a system, in which hours executing ops could not be used to log training requirements, we'd have the same problem. Our drone guys fly 12 hours/day, almost everyday, doing missions, and thus have no time for "practice" flights, let alone additional duties. As such they are extremely proficient pilots and sensor operators, and to say they're not getting enough practice would be a little ridiculous depending on the context. Now the article also mentioned the lack of practice comes into play with certain types of missions (it mentioned interdiction), as the only ops functions that are really happening are ISR and turning bad guys into pink mist. Given that these functions they're not getting enough training for are ones rarely used in current conflicts, I don't have too much of a problem with there being minor training deficiencies (keyword: minor. I don't know whether the current situation is major, minor, or in between).
Back to another issue, those 12 daily average flying hours don't include the hours of mission planning, pre-briefing, and de-briefing that must also occur. Basically, these guys work 14-hour days easily, with random "weekends" that are not related to the actual day of the week. My buddy who flies Reapers said he was working and flying less during his deployment than he would home station, it was basically a relief for him. I know a lot of the other posters on here keep harking about "well it's the military and you need to have good time management". But where do you find free time to shovel s**t or mow lawns or do CBTs or take care of your facility manager duties after a 14 hour day?
If the AF was using such a system, in which hours executing ops could not be used to log training requirements, we'd have the same problem. Our drone guys fly 12 hours/day, almost everyday, doing missions, and thus have no time for "practice" flights, let alone additional duties. As such they are extremely proficient pilots and sensor operators, and to say they're not getting enough practice would be a little ridiculous depending on the context. Now the article also mentioned the lack of practice comes into play with certain types of missions (it mentioned interdiction), as the only ops functions that are really happening are ISR and turning bad guys into pink mist. Given that these functions they're not getting enough training for are ones rarely used in current conflicts, I don't have too much of a problem with there being minor training deficiencies (keyword: minor. I don't know whether the current situation is major, minor, or in between).
Back to another issue, those 12 daily average flying hours don't include the hours of mission planning, pre-briefing, and de-briefing that must also occur. Basically, these guys work 14-hour days easily, with random "weekends" that are not related to the actual day of the week. My buddy who flies Reapers said he was working and flying less during his deployment than he would home station, it was basically a relief for him. I know a lot of the other posters on here keep harking about "well it's the military and you need to have good time management". But where do you find free time to shovel s**t or mow lawns or do CBTs or take care of your facility manager duties after a 14 hour day?
Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS
1st Lt Matt A. I get your point, and agree with it, but 25 hours. Like you said, they're doing 12 hours a day. 220 work days a year. we're talking 1% of the time dedicated to training.
This isn't a "we can't do it because we're too busy doing X," it's a "we can't do it because we don't want to do it, and this is our excuse."
This isn't a "we can't do it because we're too busy doing X," it's a "we can't do it because we don't want to do it, and this is our excuse."
(0)
(0)
0
0
0
Read This Next
Continue with Facebook 
Continue with Google